Small Mario AP Upgrade

[Armorchompy]

The Super Mario RPG remake contains a cloud-parting feat, performed in conjunction by Peach, Mallow and Mario, that still ends up within Island level, but quite a bit higher in it (around 1.6x higher than DK's Island Punch, which is the current main feat). This does not mandate the editing of most profiles, though at least those three's profiles should be edited to fit the new feat, as well as the verse page.

That is all. The blog also contains a 65.9 c feat and an 8-B+ one, neither of which are particularly useful given the current ratings, but I thought there was no reason to remove them from it.

 

[Da3ggman]

One step closer to the return to galaxy level supremacy!

Seems quite simple; I agree.

 

[Minion_of_Pigsaw]

I also agree.

 

[TheMassivlyUnkn0wn]

Awesome. Agree

 

[Tonygameman]

Easy agree.

 

[Accelerated_Evolution]

Looks fine

 

[Omnificence]

Agree, I guess.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Looks okay

 

[LuckyEmile]

Sounds good, good job on the calculation! A little confused on how it worked (for instance 46 frames at 60FPS feels more like it would be happening in less than a second rather than 46 * 60, but might just be visualising it wrong), but should be fine...

 

[ZespeonGalaxy]

Looks ok, agree

 

[Dalesean027]

Nice good work

 

[Armorchompy]

Sounds good, good job on the calculation! A little confused on how it worked (for instance 46 frames at 60FPS feels more like it would be happening in less than a second rather than 46 * 60, but might just be visualising it wrong), but should be fine...

It is in less than a second, yeah. If you swap the two numbers around in the formula you end up with lower speed.

 

[Psychomaster35]

Should be fine

 

[AStrangeverse]

Nice

 

[Flowman777]

Agree.

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

This should work.

 

[CloverDragon03]

Looks good to me. I agree

 

[Flowman777]

Sounds good, good job on the calculation! A little confused on how it worked (for instance 46 frames at 60FPS feels more like it would be happening in less than a second rather than 46 * 60, but might just be visualising it wrong), but should be fine...

It seems the calculation was dividing by 46 and then multiplying by 60 as 20000 m / (46/60 s) gives the 26086.95652 m/s value listed.

 

[Mephistus]

Mallow the goat (Return please )

 

[Omnificence]

Besides my agreement on this, I'm slightly iffy on scaling the Mario Bros to Donkey Kong's moon punching feat since the feat doesn't really come from the main continuity of the Super Mario Bros and rather the Donkey Kong Country series, but if we're still considering the mini-verses like Wario Land and Donkey Kong Country series from the downgrade thread as part of the Marioverse, I don't have a problem with it.

I also don't believe this is even Super Mario's greatest feat as I do plan on making a blog going over some of the other most impressive feats in the franchise, but I'll take what I can get.

 

[Passersby]

so uhh, why is that beam not considered some kind of magic spell or hax considering the storm literally poofed out of existence and then a rainbow suddenly appeared?

that's not how any of that works, like at all

 

[CloverDragon03]

Because that's kinda just appealing to reality and not much else

 

[Passersby]

Because that's kinda just appealing to reality and not much else

that beam is very explicitly literal magic, there is no 2 ways about it, this feat isn't applicable in any way shape or form, how is appealing to common sens wrong all of a sudden?

matter of fact why are you even assuming the beam isn't magic?

is there some kind of context or missing information i somehow don't know about?

 

[Dust_Collector]

so uhh, why is that beam not considered some kind of magic spell or hax considering the storm literally poofed out of existence and then a rainbow suddenly appeared?

It is considered magic, but it scales since magic is like Mallows main and best method of attacking others and major bosses are durable enough to handle said magic, and this in particular is just a massive energy beam he shoots.

Also the storm doesn't just poof outta existence the clouds do actually move away when the explosion happens, it's easier to see if you slow the footage down.

 

[CloverDragon03]

It's magic, yes. But there's a difference between magic and hax. I'm responding to the claim that it's hax, which is only really supported by "this doesn't happen in real life"

Also "common sense" is just an authority to appeal to if used like this. Not something to actually use as a means of argumentation

 

[Passersby]

It is considered magic, but it scales since magic is like Mallows main and best method of attacking others and major bosses are durable enough to handle said magic, and this in particular is just a massive energy beam he shoots.

...the energy beam should only go up to the sky and not much else, the way the cloudes dispersed in a fraction of a second while actual white clouds stay in the backround implies that yes, the storm clouds actually just dissapeared out of nowhere, unless the beam is an american cop that doesn't exactly make sens

if the beam had the ke neccessary to disperse such a huge quantity of storm clouds not only would the wind be strong enough to send the characters to space at terminal velocity but with such a huge ammount of energy it won't leave a single cloud behind for at least several dozen kms

It's magic, yes. But there's a difference between magic and hax. I'm responding to the claim that it's hax, which is only really supported by "this doesn't happen in real life"

..exactly, a mystical bullshit beam with after effects that don't follow the laws of phyics is pretty explictly hax, there is no way you can meaningfully quanitify it when it doesn't even operate under the laws you're assuming it does for no reason

Also "common sense" is just an authority to appeal to if used like this. Not something to actually use as a means of argumentation

i have no idea what this even means, do you mean appeal to authority?

 

[CloverDragon03]

..exactly, a mystical bullshit beam with after effects that don't follow the laws of phyics is pretty explictly hax, there is no way you can meaningfully quanitify it when it doesn't even operate under the laws you're assuming it does for no reason

By this logic, most magic verses wouldn't have any AP feats since they use magic. Not directly following the laws of physics doesn't disqualify a feat in a fictional verse. Why do we suddenly care about being one-to-one with real life?

i have no idea what this even means, do you mean appeal to authority?

Basically, rather than providing an argument, you're just going "common sense (or another "authority figure") would say this." And this is especially egregious because your definition of "common sense" is different from others'.

 

[Passersby]

By this logic, most magic verses wouldn't have any AP feats since they use magic. Not directly following the laws of physics doesn't disqualify a feat in a fictional verse. Why do we suddenly care about being one-to-one with real life?

as long as the feats's after effects follow the laws of physics even partially then the mechanims via which it operates matters little, not following the laws of physics at all disqualifies this from ever being quantified because it's after effects don't follow clear physical principles, rather metaphysical bullshit principles, there is no way to meaningfully quantify any of this

Basically, rather than providing an argument, you're just going "common sense (or another "authority figure") would say this." And this is especially egregious because your definition of "common sense" is different from others'.

....that's not how that works, but sure, this is meaningless anyways

 

[CloverDragon03]

as long as the feats's after effects follow the laws of physics even partially then the mechanims via which it operates matters little, not following the laws of physics at all disqualifies this from ever being quantified because it's after effects don't follow clear physical principles, rather metaphysical bullshit principles, there is no way to meaningfully quantify any of this

Except this is not how we do things at all. Again, you're appealing to reality in a fictional verse. That's a recipe for disaster.

Also you keep asserting the clouds poofed out of existence. No, they literally did move. And after that, all that remains is... "This feat can't be used because a rainbow appears too soon." Like, no, that's not how that works.

 

[Passersby]

Except this is not how we do things at all. Again, you're appealing to reality in a fictional verse. That's a recipe for disaster.

The only reason appealing to reality exists to begin with is because of bs like slashing a sky scraper with a flick of a wrist despite that being impossible, that we can actually Quantify and calculate because we know damn sure the author just doesn't know shearing mechanics, this isn't it, it's a mystical energy Beam that dispersed a huge body of storm clouds and made a ******* rainbow out of them while also leaving multiple white clouds in the sky, this very clearly magical hax bullshit

Also you keep asserting the clouds poofed out of existence. No, they literally did move. And after that, all that remains is... "This feat can't be used because a rainbow appears too soon." Like, no, that's not how that works.

They have poofed out of existence, yes, otherwise if clouds displacement was what actually took place not a single cloud would have remained on the visible sky with how fast the storm was presumably removed

And yes, rainbows Don't suddenly appear outta nowhere, that's also true

 

[Dust_Collector]

Storm clouds can be seen visually getting launched away from the beam

"No they actually just ceased to exist"

 

[CloverDragon03]

The only reason appealing to reality exists to begin with is because of bs like slashing a sky scraper with a flick of a wrist despite that being impossible, that we can actually Quantify and calculate because we know damn sure the author just doesn't know shearing mechanics, this isn't it, it's a mystical energy Beam that dispersed a huge body of storm clouds and made a ******* rainbow out of them while also leaving multiple white clouds in the sky, this very clearly magical hax bullshit

You do know clouds can exist above the cloud layer that was blown away, right? And the rainbow is just straight up a horribly fallacious argument, because that doesn't change the potency of the cloud split itself

It's not "very clearly magical hax bullshit," it's a move with a quantifiable potency.

 

[Passersby]

You do know clouds can exist above the cloud layer that was blown away, right? And the rainbow is just straight up a horribly fallacious argument, because that doesn't change the potency of the cloud split itself

brother i don't think you have any idea how much energy is being talked about here,with how fast the storm cloud dispersed(literally a fraction of a second) asuming this isn't some hax bullshit and even ignoring KE and wind this energy beam that appearently has mass should have been able to produce (it dispersed storm clouds after all), even if we only talk about dipersing the clouds, there should not be a single one left anywhere on the visible sky for these characters, it's not like the beam just stopped either, it kept going straight up

the rainbow isn't a fallacious argument because it proves there is no physics invcolved in any of this, it just popped out of nowhere 2

It's not "very clearly magical hax bullshit," it's a move with a quantifiable potency.

it is magical hax bullshit that you can calculate the potency of even tho you shouldn't, correct, you can also calculate the potency of an esoteric space slash that cuts planets in half, doesn't mean you should, because there is no physics involved in space cutting, at least none that we know of

 

[Armorchompy]

what

 

[Minion_of_Pigsaw]

Here's the thing, Passersby:

Fiction, by definition, requires some suspension of disbelief; that is, letting oneself appreciate a story as if it were real while knowing that it is fiction. Obviously, there is no plumber in real life who can jump several times his height, who can grow taller using magical mushrooms and throw balls of fire using flowers, and who frequently fights a giant, sentient, fire-breathing turtle in order to save a princess; and yet, we can let ourselves forget about his unreality and enjoy the stories of his adventures as if they were real. Battleboarding, at its core, is about taking characters from different stories and the powers which they carry in these stories, and imagining which would win if they hypothetically met and fought. In order to do that, battleboarders employ even more suspension of disbelief than those who simply enjoy the stories, as they calculate the energy, force, and speed of the stories' events as if they occurred in real life, with real physics.

However, fiction being fiction, oftentimes characters can break the real world's laws of physics: perhaps a character can move faster than light, or perhaps they can exert more work than physics would allow. Since that is such a common occurrence in fiction, we battleboarders have agreed to occasionally ignore the laws of physics in the name of facilitating our hypothetical battles: this community in particular has done that by separating work from speed, allowing faster-than-light speeds, and so forth.

You argue that the feat in question is invalid because it ignores the laws of physics, dismissing it as "magical hax bullshit" (despite the fact that this community defines hax as an ability that can be used to "ignore/bypass one or more of a target's statistics, rendering them irrelevant," per the wiki page, which does not apply to this feat). Such an argument requires the premise "If a feat breaks the laws of physics, it cannot be used," which is, as stated above, untrue. Furthermore, you argue that the rainbow that appears in the animation somehow proves that "there is no physics invcolved [sic] in any of this, it just popped out of nowhere 2"; besides the above proof of the unsoundness of the argument which this is a premise, this argument is also invalid, as even if the rainbow were breaking the laws of physics, it would not prove the impossibility of the cloud movement feat.

If you do not learn to accept the use of impossible feats in battleboarding, you will not be taken seriously by any battleboarder, including us.

TL;DR: Google "fiction"

 

[Passersby]

Here's the thing, Passersby:

if you're goinfng to address my stuff then quote me otherwise this is meaningless

Fiction, by definition, requires some suspension of disbelief; that is, letting oneself appreciate a story as if it were real while knowing that it is fiction.

ok then?
and?
what does that have anything to do with what i said?

Fiction, by definition, requires some suspension of disbelief; that is, letting oneself appreciate a story as if it were real while knowing that it is fiction. Obviously, there is no plumber in real life who can jump several times his height, who can grow taller using magical mushrooms and throw balls of fire using flowers, and who frequently fights a giant, sentient, fire-breathing turtle in order to save a princess; and yet, we can let ourselves forget about his unreality and enjoy the stories of his adventures as if they were real. Battleboarding, at its core, is about taking characters from different stories and the powers which they carry in these stories, and imagining which would win if they hypothetically met and fought. In order to do that, battleboarders employ even more suspension of disbelief than those who simply enjoy the stories, as they calculate the energy, force, and speed of the stories' events as if they occurred in real life, with real physics.

so basically this is a whole lot of nothing, i do enjoy fictional media thanks for asking, never said i didn't

However, fiction being fiction, oftentimes characters can break the real world's laws of physics: perhaps a character can move faster than light, or perhaps they can exert more work than physics would allow. Since that is such a common occurrence in fiction, we battleboarders have agreed to occasionally ignore the laws of physics in the name of facilitating our hypothetical battles: this community in particular has done that by separating work from speed, allowing faster-than-light speeds, and so forth.

and that's completely fine, never said to not do that, i simply draw the line with hax, that's it, this feat is completely okay as a hax ability that disperses storm clouds, but as a beam with an energy output several higher than our best nuclear weapons?
**** no, it very clearly demonstrates that it doesn't interact with the physical laws or matter in a way which we can confidently state that it actually packs that ungodly ammount of energy, and the reaons are stated above

supersonic characters not making a sonic boom?
faster than mach 10 characters not compressing the air into plasma?
swordsman cutting mountains with a leaf?
creating bigger city shocwaves due to strenght even when that's purely a mechanism of speed?

sure!
completely fine, you can easily scale and quantify and accept that because it interacts with the world clearly and consistenly enough for us to scale the energy output they emulate, this feat doesn't, that's all there is to it

You argue that the feat in question is invalid because it ignores the laws of physics, dismissing it as "magical hax bullshit" (despite the fact that this community defines hax as an ability that can be used to "ignore/bypass one or more of a target's statistics, rendering them irrelevant,"

it can still exist, what i was arguing is calculating it's energy output is as useless as calculating the energy output of a spell meant to clear the weather, that beam doesn't damage the characters at all nor does it ever display what the ungodly ammount of energy this thread says it has, so it's invalid as an AP measurment when all it does is clear the weather


also that's how i describe hax, usually

"If a feat breaks the laws of physics, it cannot be used,"

never said that, that wasn't my argument

Furthermore, you argue that the rainbow that appears in the animation somehow proves that "there is no physics invcolved [sic] in any of this, it just popped out of nowhere 2"; besides the above proof of the unsoundness of the argument

...brother, your argument was have more suspension of disbleif and ignore the physics involved, you didn't exacly prove much

and yes, a literal rainbow appearing right above them for no reason actually proves without the shadow of a doubt there were no physics or known physical laws operating there, it just popped right there for no reason

this argument is also invalid, as even if the rainbow were breaking the laws of physics, it would not prove the impossibility of the cloud movement feat.

if the rainbow was due to the effect of the spell used then yes, yes it would, and the fact that there is actual white clouds literally right above them proves it 2

If you do not learn to accept the use of impossible feats in battleboarding, you will not be taken seriously by any battleboarder, including us.

that doesn't really matter,if you have no clear boundaries and definitions of what you consider as hax and actual physical attack that does damage then i don't think i'd take you seriously either, and i'm not trying to be a d*ck, feel free to argue and correct where i'm wrong, i'd happily concede, this is what arguing is for anyways

you can't just shove appear to reality fallacy when faced with the slightest scrutiny to a feat just to get higher numbers

 

[CloverDragon03]

The cloud split is very much quantifiable. Armor literally did just that…

You’re trying to dismiss this feat for a reason that isn’t even part of the split itself

 

[Accelerated_Evolution]

How we will Index this feat in their profiles? Something like "Gave a third of the energy needed to disperse a large storm"?

 

[CloverDragon03]

That works yeah

 

[Accelerated_Evolution]

I added the upgrade to their profiles, this thread can be closed