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Scarlet Witch Speed (MCU)

I do not think that this has been discussed, no. That would require much higher combat speed. However, we preferably need a calculation.
 
Why? She has little other feats. And with Hypersonic+ Guardians of the Galaxy being a thing, Quicksilver calced at Mach 100+ or something, it's fine.
 
It's debatable that she reacted to it, or that she saw what he was to do so she made a move before it happened.
 
@Matthew Schroeder

Superheroes reacting to bullets put them at Subsonic if the bullet is Supersonic. With most explosions being Hypersonic+ shouldn't Wanda be maybe Supersonic?
 
We need calculations that take the distance into account.
 
The scene goes:

  • Cap is talking to CB
  • CB talks about Bucky
  • Cap is momentarily stunned by what's he's saying and steps back
  • CB Detonates his bomb
  • Red Energy Cntains the explosion
  • Cap Looks over
  • Wanda is shown to be the one doing it
Someone should rewatch the scene with slow motion to be extra safe.
 
She was shown after the bomb went off, so we don't know if she reacted to it, or managed to shield it up after seeing him pull out the remote instead of pressing it from within his pocket, or something.
 
We see the explosion deonate and the energy containing it after though. So maybe at least her magic scales? If not then it's at least a good enough feat to scale her from people like Hawkeye and possibly faster for this.
 
I'm very much unsure about this. Perhaps we can assume she summoned the shield just before the explosion happens, and the shield actually appears as the explosion is already a short distance outward?
 
I'm pretty sure this feat already has a calc anyway, which was Hypersonic+ (Albeit I think I followed our old rules for explosion calcs).
 
@Gemmysaur

In the Clip I showed, you can hear the the detonation and not long after that the sound of wanda's magic. If short but it happens 1:16-1:17 in case you want to hear it yourself.
 
@The Everlasting Can you link to the calculation please? Also, how have our rules changed regarding this?
 
@Ant I did the calculation. She moves some 1.2-1.4x faster than the explosion but it's been awhile. With explosions being, at their slowest, Mach 1 then this would be a Mach 1.2-Mach 1.4 feat.

The change in the rules was that we don't use detonation velocity anymore since that isn't the speed of the explosion, just the speed the reaction goes through the detonating material IIRC.

But, yeah, I'm pretty sure this was counted as an outlier. Nearly every other feat in the series is Subsonic-Subsonic+, and I'm wondering where Hypersonic+ Guardians is coming from? I'm assuming it was something in GotG2, but the only feat from that that I think would be even close to that wouldn't scale to anyone and doesn't account for cinematic timing.
 
"and I'm wondering where Hypersonic+ Guardians is coming from? I'm assuming it was something in GotG2, but the only feat from that that I think would be even close to that wouldn't scale to anyone and doesn't account for cinematic timing."

The Guardians' jetpacks can let them fly from the center of Ego (Which is as large as the moon) to the surface in a very maximum timeframe of four minutes (As the bomb was set to detonate in five minutes, and the Guardians got up when the timer was at one minute).
 
They fight while using their jetpacks, so it scales to combat and reaction speed. Also consistent with Rocket and Starlord's reaction speeds as they can easily fly through quantum asteroid-fields at top speed with their sci-fi ships
 
The asteroid scene only has them travelling at about 100 m/s (Gamora states the distance to the place they're going to as 40 km yet it takes them minutes to get there) and the jetpack thing falls under the problem that Bebop had, in that there's no reason to assume he's flying at top speed since "slowing down so I don't die" isn't uncommon.

At best I could see an upgrade based on Rocket dodging a shot from the Sovereign ships, which seem to be around Mach 1 in speed based on some of their scenes.
 
No, it's not a problem in either case. For a sci-fi spaceship far more advanced to only be racing at such minimal speeds is definitely nonsensical, when it was running away from an entire fleet at top speed.

As for the Jetpack, there really is no problem here. Characters can do Hypersonic+ feats at an absolute minimum, and even then they can fight other characters while piloting the jetpack and are capable of functionally maneuvering it and making turns and fighting monsters using the jetpack.

There is 0 reason to assume that it doesn't scale.

Plus, Thor's hammer throws in Thor 2 were calculated at near Mach 100 and plenty of characters react to his throws, and you calculated that Quicksilver is Mach 100+ too, so it's not like there's plenty of better feats to scale the characters rather than just put everyone at Subsonic.
 
@Matt

Do you have any evidence they were moving at Mach 3 though? We have a stated distance and we can see how long it took. It's not like there's a problem with them having to race away from the Sovereign either, since they were moving at comparable speeds.

With the jetpack I'm saying it's kinda like assuming that since my car can go to 120 mph and I can make turns while in my car that I have 120 mph reactions, rather than that I just slow down to make a turn.

Quicksilver scales to nobody, he's literally FTE to the entire cast, and IIRC Mach 100 was for Thor's hammer returning to him, not him throwing it.
 
Mjolnir returning to Thor was calced at mach 100+, not it being thrown by Thor.

Quicksilver was calced to be around mach 5, not mach 100.

When they are fighting with the jetpacks they don't travel in straight lines so one can easily assume that they don't reach these speeds.

Also also (yes that's a double also, not a mistake) your reaction time doesn't need to match the vehicle you are using, take for example real life drivers, or pilots.
 
@Xcano

My evidence is that the ship is far more advanced than any flying aircraft of earth and they had 0 reason not to move at top speeds. The Sovereign being at comparable speeds doesn't prove your point.

No, it's not at all comparable. You can't fight a giant monster making quick turns and dodges while driving your car. They show capable of using the Jetpacks to fight both in the beginning of the movie and at the ending, in the later against multiple foes to boot. The two feats go hand in handn, and do not require making extra assumptions about them always slowing down.

Wow, now are you going to say that Thor's hammer returns faster than it is thrown? When is that ever a thing.
 
Gwynbleiddd said:
Mjolnir returning to Thor was calced at mach 100+, not it being thrown by Thor.
Quicksilver was calced to be around mach 5, not mach 100.

When they are fighting with the jetpacks they don't travel in straight lines so one can easily assume that they don't reach these speeds.

Also also (yes that's a double also, not a mistake) your reaction time doesn't need to match the vehicle you are using, take for example real life drivers, or pilots.
Click to expand...
Okay, why would Mjolnir have faster returning speed.

Xcano calced Quicksilver at Mach 100+

There's nothing to assume that they can't, considering how lowballed and casual the Hypersonic+ feat is, and how they constantly use the Jetpacks to quick maneuver in combat.

You do need it if you are flying through a quantum asteroid-field, or else you'd run into something like a moron.
 
@Matt

I don't think speculation should supersede what we actually see happen on-screen. Fiction is full of things being far slower than they should be. Impulse in Star Trek is measured in terms of c in the guidebooks yet in nearly every appearance it's 100 to 1000 m/s.

That's more a feat for the maneuverability of the jetpack than it is evidence that they were moving at Mach 20 at all times.

IIRC it wasn't even thrown for the Mach 100 feat. Thor threw it normally and then got teleported or something.
 
If the Star Trek Impulse has an official speed that is FTL, then it is, it "appearing" to be 100 to 1000 m/s would obviously be a stylistic choice to make it visible to us. And this doesn't correlate to what happens on screen.

No, it's definitely a feat of speed. You are overthinking the plot if you have to assume that they cannot react to the speed of a device that they constantly use to perform quick dashes and dodges in combat, and is a key component of their fighting against larger and more powerful, or more numerous threats. The fact that it being Mach 20 is also a hilarious low-end since they spend the majority of those 4 minutes fighting Ego also doesn't help your case.

Thor threw the hammer. It went back to him at speeds calculated at Mach 900+. And since Thor villains can react to Mjolnir's projectile speed, either swatting them away or dodging, and Thor can use Mjolnir to fly at top speed and once again isn't a blind idiot unaware of where he's going, it could scale.

By the way, I am not certain if MHS MCU Thor is okay, but it goes to show that Hypersonic+ is pretty acceptable.
 
You're thinking of Warp. Max. Impulse is listed as 0.25c.

All I'm asking for is an instance where they are reacting to their jetpacks whilst their jetpacks are moving at Mach 20+. Rather than assuming that, secretly, they are actually moving 100+x faster than it appears with no statement or indication this is the case.

I know it went back to him at Mach 900. This isn't evidence that he can throw it Mach 900 or that it is always moving Mach 900. Thor's hammer returns faster depending on the distance between him and it, this is obvious from every shot where he does through it.
 
If it's said to be 0.35c, then it is. It's simple. The fact that you can see it move is only there to allow a scene to exist.

Of course they would have to be moving 100x times faster than they appear to be. Next time you'll say me that Sonic isn't FTL because you can't control it in a video-game.

How things appear on screen has nothing to do with how they actually are, upon certain levels of speed.

Once again, they can dash, dodge, maneuver quickly, react, etc. all while using the Jetpacks for enhanced speed. Rather than assume that this is done on the lowest speed possible, you take the known speed of the jetpack and apply to it. Simple.

No it doesn't, that's an outright lie. Mjolnir tends to return at speeds comparable to the hammer throw, occasionally even slower. Never is this supposed superior returning speed apparent.

Also

>always moving Mach 900

Why would you assume that Mjolnir is not dashing at top speed when Thor throws it at his foe with full strength? This reminds me of that terrible argument that used to plague this wiki's discussions, but has mostly gone, where users would see a feat performed from a character, and then go "Well, how strong exactly was him during that issue! His Tier 5 / 4 / FTL feats happened on other storylines" as if every comic book exists in its own singularity completely devoid of any and all connection to other events and an overarching continuity.
 
"Okay, why would Mjolnir have faster returning speed."

There is no reason to connect the two in the first place, one is the product of Thor's strength and the other is mjolnirs magic that makes it return to its user, plus Thor got teleported into another planet while when he is closer Mjonlir doesn't reach such high speeds.
 
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