• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

RWBY Lightspeed Downgrade

Status
Not open for further replies.
Sorry for the 1 month necro, but the thread wasn't really closed, and I had one last argument I wanted to make to clarify my side.

RWBY's light speed relies on a very important statement, which I find flimsy, that statement is of course lasers being made of light. In a vacuum and on its own, this is fine, however, in the examples I show, we are given clear showcases that the lasers DO NOT ACT how light acts.

A laser made of light, being used to justify a light speed rating, should act like light, so let's go over this once more. All disqualifies I show will be IN LINE with what VSBW's own Laser/Light Beam dodging feats page says.

To preface these, Spinoirr's argument is that the lasers are "stylized" and therefore should not be held to such scrutiny, however this should clearly not be the case. When the sole statement providing light speed IS that the lasers are made of light, you cannot just handwave how a laser visually acts simply because it's a stylized animation. The use of the world stylized does not even make sense here.

Penny's Lasers
The beam is tangible and can be interacted with physically by normal humans, as if it was a solid, liquid or gas. It shouldn't disperse when being hit as a substance would, and should not be redirectable without using a mechanism like refraction.
In this example, we see the laser disperse on numerous occasions, sometimes even when there is no material or object to make it disperse. It leaves behind weird trails that are clearly not straight, as light should behave, especially when it is simply traveling through the air. There is no material to create such run off or refract / mess with its path, meaning that if it was made of light it should just travel in a straight line and then disappear, not create random particles.

This isn't even limited to when the laser is simply in the air, here are a couple other examples of it behaving in the exact same way upon actually hitting a solid wall, substance, or person.
Vs. Neo
Vs. a Grimm
Weird particle effects, dispersing, etc. are all blatantly and visually clear here, once again light does not behave this way. The especially egregious part is that this all occurs even when the Laser is directly hitting / pushing someone... which brings me to the next glaring issue.
While a laser can in theory push things, through radiation pressure or by causing explosions when vaporizing part of an object, those are niche circumstances and generally a laser should not primarily push things away like a physical projectile would.
In the examples of Neo and the Grimm we see something very, very important and obvious, force. Something that is present in all examples, including this one versus Cinder.
The primary force of damaging people seems to be the force applied by the laser, as shown by Neo's aura breaking upon being launched into an aircraft by Penny's laser, and alongside Cinder.

Now, I've been told "force isn't a disqualifier" but this clearly isn't the case given it is on the Laser page, but also, once again light does not behave this way. Light does not normally push people so much that the impact of which is the cause of damage, light does not create weird trails and particles effects, as well as disperse along substances like water splashing on a surface. I additionally see no instances of radiation pressure.

Even more egregiously, in the example of the Grimm vs. Penny, the Grimm is actively pushing AGAINST the light, in an almost tug of war like matter, and when Penny deactivates her laser it immediately can start running at a faster speed, clearly showcasing the laser was actively forcing it back and preventing it from doing so.

One thing I also find odd, is that every time Penny uses her lasers, before AND after they have a crackling electricity effect, something that just feels odd to have alongside all these other "stylistic" choices.

So once again, to reiterate my arguments, Penny's lasers cannot be light speed, because the statement making them light speed lies solely on the basis that all lasers are made of light. In these multiple examples, we see attributes that behave nothing like light, disqualifiers even from the wiki's own page!
A stylized laser is fine, but when said laser is riding on a statement to be made of light, it should behave as light does, and these lasers clearly do not behave like light.
 
Fair

I would highly recommend looking through the previous page, all of what Endou just posted was disagreed with by basically everyone
I was bringing up arguments which I believe should be reevaluated, didn’t get much of a response from staff besides Dale

The big important thing however is the fact that light speed relies on the lasers being made of light, which means these lasers should act like light, but they don’t. It’s an angle that needs to be considered for these feats.
 
Just seeing this (I'm at work) the thread honestly should have been closed 3 staff disagreements (2 of which were admins)
 
I was bringing up arguments which I believe should be reevaluated, didn’t get much of a response from staff besides Dale

The big important thing however is the fact that light speed relies on the lasers being made of light, which means these lasers should act like light, but they don’t. It’s an angle that needs to be considered for these feats.
They do act like light. They only travel in straight lines, they burn matter and produce heat, they are directly stated to be light in the guidebook, etc. This on top of Velvet's weapon utilizing light constructs to copy weapons, and her copy of Penny's weapon is just a straight beam of pure light.

As brought up previously, the lasers being stylized does not discredit them from being lasers, nor does force.

And even if it did, it still wouldnt downgrade them from FTL as the low end of the calc that uses a particle beam rather than a lightspeed laser still yielded FTL results

So no matter how you slice it, they wouldnt be downgraded from FTL
 
They do act like light. They only travel in straight lines, they burn matter and produce heat, they are directly stated to be light in the guidebook, etc. This on top of Velvet's weapon utilizing light constructs to copy weapons, and her copy of Penny's weapon is just a straight beam of pure light.

As brought up previously, the lasers being stylized does not discredit them from being lasers, nor does force.

And even if it did, it still wouldnt downgrade them from FTL as the low end of the calc that uses a particle beam rather than a lightspeed laser still yielded FTL results
Velvet is not relevant here, especially because she hasn't been present since volume 3

The particle beams were relativistic, not whatever calc you made off-site at 99.99% the speed of light. Also, if force is not discrediting them, then why is it a disqualifier on the light speed page? Nobody has addressed this because that is literally a rule/standard on the site that's just being hand waved.

I've also never once argued simply being stylized is a disqualifier, so let's stop saying that. My point is that light behaves in certain ways, and it is not behaving as light does. We can't handwave an issue just because of how something is animated, especially since RWBY is literally a visual media first.
 
Also, if force is not discrediting them, then why is it a disqualifier on the light speed page? Nobody has addressed this because that is literally a rule/standard on the site that's just being hand waved.
This was one of the first things addressed on the the first page
A laser showing force as in pushing alone is not a disqualifying since light and lasers do have momentum and exert force so sufficed to say a super high intensity laser would exert force as well (though if its strong enough to push something it'd likely melt whatever it impacts way before). Interacted as if it were a physical object would moreso entail it being actually interactable like being able to be physically held, grabbed, or like hit away
Since no new arguments that are relevant have been brought up I'm going to go ahead and close this
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top