Rock Lee vs Deku

[TheFrostKnight]

Wait, this is a stomp?

 

[CiscoTheSoto]

Wait, this is a stomp?

No, I don’t believe so. Deku can still figure out Lee’s fighting style and spam Air Force from afar.

 

[Tatsumi504]

No, I don’t believe so. Deku can still figure out Lee’s fighting style and spam Air Force from afar.

Lee's a ninja who's fighting style can also throw off sharingan users. He's teacher can fight using the same style while only watching his opponents feet.
If it can throw off even the sharingan, I see no reason why deku would be able to analyze lee's fighting style

 

[Tatsumi504]

No, I don’t believe so. Deku can still figure out Lee’s fighting style and spam Air Force from afar.

His air force is also weaker than his normal AP and lee would just dodge all of them.

No one has brought up lee's shuriken techniques and can lee use the body flicker? If he can he basically blitzes

 

[CiscoTheSoto]

Lee's a ninja who's fighting style can also throw off sharingan users. He's teacher can fight using the same style while only watching his opponents feet.
If it can throw off even the sharingan, I see no reason why deku would be able to analyze lee's fighting style

Well those were the arguments I was making when speed was equalized, but they were being ignored

His air force is also weaker than his normal AP and lee would just dodge all of them.

Also what I said with equalized speed, that Lee's very good at dodging attacks given how he dodged all of Gaara's sand attacks.

No one has brought up lee's shuriken techniques and can lee use the body flicker? If he can he basically blitzes

Don't remember Lee ever using shuriken techniques (correct me if I'm wrong) and I don't believe he can use the body flicker either, or at least he's never shown to use it due to his limited ability to manipulate his own chakra.

 

[Tatsumi504]

and I don't believe he can use the body flicker either, or at least he's never shown to use it due to his limited ability to manipulate his own chakra

That's why I was asking, but he can still walk on vertical surfaces and water so I believe he can. Molding chakra to use jutsu is different from just channeling chakra and body flicker falls into the latter category so of he can use it he'll blitz

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Well those were the arguments I was making when speed was equalized, but they were being ignored

Yeah, because speed was equal, Deku’s able to actually analyze it.
Here Lee is beating deku’s Ass for a few minutes straight while you want him to “spam Air Force” against someone ~3x faster than him, Cisco he can’t run away.
With speed unequal it’s a stomp in lee‘s favor, with him having every factor bar a Few tons is lifting strength

 

[Tatsumi504]

Even if you make speed equal again, lee's fighting style is still capable of throwing of the analytical predictions of the sharingan of all things and he'll still be able to amp his speed with body flicker & concentrating chakra at his legs, he can still further amp his AP by concentrating chakra in his fists though not to an unprecedented level.

I see no reason why lee isn't winning this

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Even if you make speed equal again, lee's fighting style is still capable of throwing of the analytical predictions of the sharingan of all things and he'll still be able to amp his speed with body flicker & concentrating chakra at his legs, he can still further amp his AP by concentrating chakra in his fists though not to an unprecedented level.

I see no reason why lee isn't winning this

Yeah upon further inspection it’s just Lee’s match to win with Deku having no chance of victory.
this isn’t final act Deku where is analytical prediction is good enough to track 6 homing projectiles faster than him. Deku‘s here still has cracks and flaws that someone like Lee will easily break through.

 

[LNZO19]

Lee pretty much easily overwhelms Deku. He is faster (High Hypersonic vs Hypersonic), stronger (City Block vs Large Building+), more skilled + weapon mastery, and can resist analytical predications (iirc Sasuke's sharingan). I give Deku better range but it wont matter since Lee would close the distance quickly.

I give this to the green beast of Konoha.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Lee pretty much easily overwhelms Deku. He is faster (High Hypersonic vs Hypersonic), stronger (City Block vs Large Building+), more skilled + weapon mastery, and can resist analytical predications (iirc Sasuke's sharingan). I give Deku better range but it wont matter since Lee would close the distance quickly.

I give this to the green beast of Konoha.

Ye it’s already been said above, Lee stomps this man

 

[CiscoTheSoto]

Ok, so has it been established that even with speed equalized, Lee would still be capable of overpowering Deku and resisting his analytical prediction based on his performance against Sasuke's Sharingan technique? Because I'll equalize speed AGAIN to make it more fair, but Lee would still win regardless.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Ok, so has it been established that even with speed equalized, Lee would still be capable of overpowering Deku and resisting his analytical prediction based on his performance against Sasuke's Sharingan technique? Because I'll equalize speed AGAIN to make it more fair, but Lee would still win regardless.

Lee stomps regardless Yeah.
AP advantage skill advantage durability advannage, complete immunity to analytical prediction.
yeah.

If you do want an MHA vs Naruto match with Deku, what about one of the CS1 sound four (low 7-C) vs 10% Deku.

 

[CiscoTheSoto]

Lee stomps regardless Yeah.
AP advantage skill advantage durability advannage, complete immunity to analytical prediction.
yeah.

If you do want an MHA vs Naruto match with Deku, what about one of the CS1 sound four (low 7-C) vs 10% Deku.

Yea, that's a possibility of making a match with Deku against one of the Sound Four. And while Lee does win here, I wouldn't say it's a stomp, but rather a decisive win.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Yea, that's a possibility of making a match with Deku against one of the Sound Four. And while Lee does win here, I wouldn't say it's a stomp, but rather a decisive win.

A decisive win implies Deku has a chance of victory, even if it’s small, not him getting beaten up for 3 hours while he can’t do anything to defend himself

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Take for example Lucci vs Deku.
Lucci skill ****** there, but it wasn’t a stomp because Deku had a 5.1x ap advantage over his base and could two tap him.
But that isn’t the case here, where Lee has every advantage (outside of LS, which Deku never uses in this key)

 

[CiscoTheSoto]

Well Deku could still play long-ranged game with Air Force and launch multiple shots from different angles, and could possibly predict Lee's moves eventually. And Iron Soles double the impact, so his attacks could hit harder. Point is it's not an absolute stomp like what's being suggested with speed equal.

 

[Tatsumi504]

Well speed's equal again, so Deku could still play long-ranged game with Air Force and launch multiple shots from different angles, and could possibly predict Lee's moves eventually. And Iron Soles double the impact, so his attacks could hit harder. Point is it's not an absolute stomp like what's being suggested with speed equal.

Air force gets dodged, if lee gets hit with iron soles once he's going to notice it deals double damage and later party or evade deku's kicks. He still has body flicker, a slight speed and AP amp, better mobility via acrobatics, better Kinetic vision and ability to stick to vertical surfaces. There's also resistance to analytical prediction and information analysis.

All in all, of not a stomp lee still wins hands down. So is this gonna be added to their profiles?

 

[Kingofwolves999]

I’m sorry, but am I going insane coming back to this thread???

Sasuke’s sharingan didn’t work on Rock Lee at the time because it wasn’t developed enough to deal with actual Taijustu, not because Rock Lee is immune to being analyzed at all. Sasuke was analyzing the wrong things with his Sharingan, looking for illusions or ninjutsu, and was overconfident as **** on TOP of being SLOWER THAN LEE PHYSICALLY.

He only began to do actual analytical prediction vs Orochimaru in the Forest of Death, AFTER he fought Rock Lee.

And even then, he literally analyzed Rock Lee with his Sharingan and copied his moves after this to make the Lion’s Barrage technique, and to increase his speed after training with Kakashi.

Like, what are you all even talking about that Lee is immune to the Sharingan??? He caught Sasuke off guard like hell in the first place and then specifically states why his Sharingan didn’t work on his movements??? On top of Sasuke being, on panel, stated slower so even if he sees the movements he can’t react in time??????

How does any of that = Rock Lee can’t be analyzed by anyone? He used a weakness of Sasuke, was faster than him at the time and caught him off guard since Sasuke didn’t even know what he was capable of. That doesn’t even COMPARE to what Deku will be facing and analyzing in this fight with speed equal. He will legit just be reading his physical movements, not seeing for illusions or ninjutsu, because that doesn’t exist in his world. His analysis is purely physical. Which is a direct matchup for Rock Lee’s fighting style.

Vs. Sasuke, it was verbatim a mismatch.

Vs. Deku, it absolutely is not, and actually works perfectly.

Please read and tell me if I’m missing a scan or something that denotes something beyond what Lee himself is saying.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

“Rock Lee is immune to being analyzed”

 

[CiscoTheSoto]

Yea, I don't see where the implication that Rock Lee was immune to having his moves read came from. Regardless, all the other points that've been made are still valid: Lee's taijutsu skills are superior to Deku's, he can eventually close the distance against Deku if he decides to use long-range, he can stick to walls with Chakra, damage him much more with his attacks than Deku can do to him, is just as mobile as Deku, and has very high stamina too.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Speed equal and with similar mobility, Deku wins since his main gimmick is literally his analysis. He can predict Rock Lee’s attacks and counter, that’s his whole fighting style. Even if he’s inferior physically and less skilled in h2h, he’s a smarter combatant who can memorize patterns and techniques within seconds. Rock Lee managing to actually hit Deku after he fights him for a while is going to get harder and harder and Deku has superior stamina feats in every way compared to Rock Lee pain wise, it’s not even close.

The 2x advantage makes things harder than they should be but no where near impossible, and the skill difference is evened out by the analytical prediction. Rock Lee is a martial artist but that’s essentially it, he doesn’t have any wacky abilities other than getting close for his attacks and outskilling since his gates are restricted. Deku can play around that by reading his moves and avoiding his attacks by predicting what he will do next, then firing back when Lee isn’t expecting it.

Most instances of Deku’s analysis actually failing or being defeated is due to the enemy having something up their sleeve that throws his analysis off, ergo Mirio’s intangibility, Lover Mode with Gentle, Nine having multiple quirks, Overhaul’s quirk speed and range, etc.

Rock Lee has none of that. He’s purely h2h. That is all he has in this key with no gates, not even an LS advantage to restrain Deku with his cloth bindings. There is no reason I see that Deku can’t eventually keep up with Rock Lee’s skill by predicting his movements and dodging or kicking back accordingly.

At worst I’d say this is an incon since it’s a debate between analytical prediction and skill, and the only difference physically is one is 2x stronger but the other has better stamina (pain wise) and spammable ranged attacks. I personally say Deku takes it after a long fight as he’ll just keep adapting and memorizing all of Lee’s attack patterns until he can consistently predict all of them and then Air Force spam him down.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

It comes down to do you think Deku can last long enough to learn Lee’s attack patterns to a degree of avoiding and hitting him back more than he’s being hit, or do you think Lee has enough skill to defeat Deku before the predictions come in despite Deku’s stamina gap and range.

Considering Deku can do that level of analysis within seconds, I think it’s clear where I stand.

 

[LNZO19]

With speed equalized this makes things more interesting I guess. You right about the analytical thing kingofwolves - didn't remember why it was resisted.

Lee's stamina isn't that bad this matchup since he is not using gates and Lee will tag Deku with massive hits because of the skill gap (at least in the beginning) + Lee does have some range with his ninja equipment.

I do think it is close I guess Deku has more of a chance to outlast Lee if Lee doesn't knock him out quickly with his AP advantage but it will be difficult.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

With speed equalized this makes things more interesting I guess. You right about the analytical thing kingofwolves - didn't remember why it was resisted.

yeah, if it’s not resisted deku’s gonna be dodging nearly every hit, like he does in most fights

Lee's stamina isn't that bad this matchup since he is not using gates and Lee will tag Deku with massive hits because of the skill gap (at least in the beginning) + Lee does have some range with his ninja equipment.

ninja equipment which can be knocked out of the air. And stamina of, training for several hours on end vs Running around with dusted repeatedly shattered limbs and breaking them on a whim at this point without care.

 

[Tots_Real]

And stamina of, training for several hours on end vs Running around with dusted repeatedly shattered limbs and breaking them on a whim at this point without care.

Wait are you saying Rock Lee has the more intensive training or Deku?

 

[CiscoTheSoto]

Wait are you saying Rock Lee has the more intensive training or Deku?

He’s referring to Deku.

 

[Tots_Real]

He’s referring to Deku.

Saying Deku trains more/harder then Lee is like objectively wrong.

 

[Nullflowerblush]

What exactly are the current arguments?

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Saying Deku trains more/harder then Lee is like objectively wrong.

No I was referring to Lee in terms of stamina.

Deku’s known for shattering his limbs into dust don’t ask me why Cisco thought I was referring to Lee for that one

 

[CiscoTheSoto]

No I was referring to Lee in terms of stamina.

Deku’s known for shattering his limbs into dust don’t ask me why Cisco thought I was referring to Lee for that one

I thought you were referring to Deku in both cases since Deku also trained very intensively for several hours with All Might.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

I thought you were referring to Deku in both cases since Deku also trained very intensively for several hours with All Might.

I put a ”vs” there

 

[Tots_Real]

No I was referring to Lee in terms of stamina.

Deku’s known for shattering his limbs into dust don’t ask me why Cisco thought I was referring to Lee for that one

... The fight between Lee and Gaara is literally end with Lee perparing to continue fighting despite being literally crippled by Gaara moments prior. Also Lee doesn't just "train for several hours" Lee training is intensive day long stuff, it's not some basic training regiment.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

... The fight between Lee and Gaara is literally end with Lee perparing to continue fighting despite being literally crippled by Gaara moments prior. Also Lee doesn't just "train for several hours" Lee training is intensive day long stuff, it's not some basic training regiment.

He got his arm and his leg crushed and was preparing to fight on, but was clearly going unconscious and filled Guy with tears at the state he was in.

Deku gets pierced with lasers, ribs crushed, burned by a fire tornado and beaten down for several minutes straight, all just to go 100% and break all his bones EVEN FURTHER than they already were broken, and still operates at complete peak efficiency, no where near done fighting yet.

Rock Lee is not anywhere near Deku’s stamina pain-wise. Deku literally has explosions of power destroying his limbs from the inside out every time he uses 100% so hard they fragment into his muscles, what Rock Lee went through vs Gaara is baby food to Deku.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Deku started Heroes Rising off doing 1000 kicks as a part of his standard training regimen and wasn’t even slightly winded. He trains all day even in class doing air chairs and even when studying he’s lifting weights or doing grip strength training. ALL Deku does is train every single day non stop while also attending school.

If Deku didn’t have school work, he would be training just as much as Rock Lee because his only drive in life is to get stronger to control OFA.

He hasn’t done “a normal regimen” since All Might took him to clean that beach. He is either studying, training by himself or training with his classmates. His 8 hours feat from the Pussycats was BEFORE he actually started training with them and got even more stamina, and THAT was far before Joint Training months later when he’s trained even harder.

 

[Maitreya12]

Deku started Heroes Rising off doing 1000 kicks as a part of his standard training regimen and wasn’t even slightly winded. He trains all day even in class doing air chairs and even when studying he’s lifting weights or doing grip strength training. ALL Deku does is train every single day non stop while also attending school.

If Deku didn’t have school work, he would be training just as much as Rock Lee because his only drive in life is to get stronger to control OFA.

He hasn’t done “a normal regimen” since All Might took him to clean that beach. He is either studying, training by himself or training with his classmates. His 8 hours feat from the Pussycats was BEFORE he actually started training with them and got even more stamina, and THAT was far before Joint Training months later when he’s trained even harder.

Yeah Deku is literally insane with that kind of stuff. He actually never stops. He’s either working out, studying, working out and studying, in school, working out in school, or squaring up with main villains.

Should add passive exercise on his profile.

 

[CiscoTheSoto]

Still think Lee’s got this. His AP and fighting experience is his largest advantage. Weaker characters like Nine and Mirio were able to easily hurt Deku with their attacks, so I don’t see how Deku’s gonna be able to fare much better against Lee.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Still think Lee’s got this. His AP and fighting experience is his largest advantage. Weaker characters like Nine and Mirio were able to easily hurt Deku with their attacks, so I don’t see how Deku’s gonna be able to fare much better against Lee.

Those “weaker” characters had things that directly countered Deku.

Mirio’s intangibility and own predictive abilities beat Deku’s in a single instant, which led to him getting a hit on his sternum and stunning him down.

Nine? There is literally no comparison to Lee there. Multiple quirks ring a bell? 7-C barriers, laser beams, air blasts and water dragons? Followed by him stunning Deku by attempting to steal OFA?

The conditions that he was defeated by Nine and Mirio are absolutely nothing like how he would fight Rock Lee. Against Lee it would be far more like how he fought Gentle, who I have no clue why you omitted. Gentle was even faster than Deku after amping with Lover Mode and Deku still could predict and beat him after getting beaten around by him for several minutes.

After Deku’s predictions set in and he realizes Lee’s only abilities are taijutsu, I see no reason he can’t avoid and Fire back far more often than Lee can get hits off.

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Hell against Nine, Deku got knocked out of Full Cowl for the first fight when Nine tried to steal OFA. He was getting smacked around in his base by Nine, which would obviously tax him more when Nine can **** up his 8%. In the second fight he fought Nine for multiple minutes until Nine actually got tired, and when the lightning showed up, he and Bakugo were still in fighting shape after that beating to defeat him until he went sicko mode, and EVEN THEN he went Full Cowl 100%, breaking everything in his body, to beat him.

I see no reason for Nine to be some anti-feat for how much punishment Deku can take.

 

[CiscoTheSoto]

Regardless of whether or not they had Quirks which were effective against Deku, it doesn’t change the fact they were able to deal him serious damage. It’s not like they were some special techniques that did internal damage or anything. Mirio’s simple punch to the gut was able to wind Deku and knock him down for several seconds. Nine was also able to injure Deku and make him bleed when just a few lasers hit him on the shoulder

When they go close combat, which is one of Deku’s starting tactics, Lee will definitely get past Deku’s guard and hit him with a Leaf Hurricane, or the powerful front kick to the chin. Against stronger opponents like Sasuke and Naruto, his attacks were able to wind them for several seconds, so Deku’s gonna be even worse off. Lee’s gonna take advantage of that moment and land several more attacks. By the time that Deku manages to start analyzing Lee’s movements, he’ll already be too worn out to effectively fight, and he can’t increase his OFA percentage like he often does in his big fights.

Also, in his fight with Gentle, even after having analyzed Gentle’s fighting style, he still struggled during their match after Gentle went into Lover Mode. He couldn’t strike Gentle with pinpoint accuracy with their exchange of blows, nor did he accurately dodge all the close combat encounters. He didn’t read his movements with fluid motions like someone with the Sharingan, for instance. Deku defeated Gentle because of a well-placed St. Louis Smash, that’s it. Deku has never defeated an opponent stronger than him in 5% or 8% without increasing his OFA levels or without getting help from someone else, and Gentle was an equal to Deku. I really don’t believe that Deku’s analytical prediction is good enough for him to accurately dodge all of Lee’s movements long enough to outlast Lee’s stamina or get a good attack in, especiallly if he bounces around like he did against Gaara. It’s possible, but very slim.