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No, it wouldn’t. Trickster doesn’t auto-win.Joker's passive Fatehax allow him to win the battle.
It just helps him adapt and eventually overcome threats, doesn't just instantly make himself fated to winJoker's passive Fatehax allow him to win the battle.
That's moreso his RE/AD, but as Milly said, Fatehax isn't an "instant-win" either.It just helps him adapt and eventually overcome threats, doesn't just instantly make himself fated to win
Prove that joker swaps personas to null attacks in characterThat's moreso his RE/AD, but as Milly said, Fatehax isn't an "instant-win" either.
For now, I'll vote for Joker. I think he simply has more versatility than Nahobino, due to his ability to switch between a multitude of Personas in comparison to Nahobino's maximum of eight skills (though this point might be moot is that's simply gameplay mechanics). Regardless, Joker can simply switch to a Persona that nullifies, drains, repels, or at least resist most of Nahobino's skillset.
He's an RPG character, so he doesn't have a set fighting style or set of tactics he employs. It can be logically inferred that he would switch to a Persona most advantageous for given situation (especially when he can do so with a thought) due his sense of self-preservation.Prove that joker swaps personas to null attacks in character
you can watch the animeHe's an RPG character, so he doesn't have a set fighting style or set of tactics he employs. It can be logically inferred that he would switch to a Persona most advantageous for given situation (especially when he can do so with a thought) due his sense of self-preservation.
"Most of the time" When?Most of the time, when discussing RPG characters, if they lack a set character for Battle In Game, it is inferred that they will do what they must in order to win in most threads. In addition, in Persona, and especially in P5, it is emphasized in game to capitalize on Weakness's and Resistances. As such, it can be inferred that Joker is at least willing to switch to be more advantageous. Can you prove it's out of character for him to switch to do so?
it is inferred that they will do what they must in order to win in most threads
In addition, in Persona, and especially in P5, it is emphasized in game to capitalize on Weakness's and Resistances
As such, it can be inferred that Joker is at least willing to switch to be more advantageous
"Most of the time" When?
I agree that he won't immediately do it per say, but that's more so because he wouldn't know off the bat what Nahobino has in store. But I do believe that once he does switch, he's going to become significantly more difficult for Nahobino to win against.
On... This wiki, in other threads...? Where and when else would I be referring to? Time and time again, people infer that since they have little character set for battle,that they're willing to use their full repertoire to their advantage in battle.
I agree that he won't immediately do it per say, but that's more so because he wouldn't know off the bat what Nahobino has in store. But I do believe that once he does switch, he's going to become significantly more difficult for Nahobino to win against.
On... This wiki, in other threads...? Where and when else would I be referring to? Time and time again, people infer that since they have little character set for battle,that they're willing to use their full repertoire to their advantage in battle.
In order to do that, I think he would need to be swapping quite a lot, unless there's some persona I forgot about that nulls/repels or drains like 3 or more elements at onceI... Don't think the point was ever that he would spam swap, even though he could. I think it was more so that he could have a Persona that Null's most or all of Nahobino's skills.
I know there are at least ones that do that to two while resisting other's. Could check the Compendium, though that would take some time.In order to do that, I think he would need to be swapping quite a lot, unless there's some persona I forgot about that nulls/repels or drains like 3 or more elements at once
In order to do that, I think he would need to be swapping quite a lot, unless there's some persona I forgot about that nulls/repels or drains like 3 or more elements at once
He can swap his Personas with a thought, given how they're simply manifestations of his own Mind/Soul. It'd be the equivalent of a well-trained fighter instinctively clenching or blocking oncoming attacks.I have no issues with Joker using his full repertoire but how does that mean he will spam persona swaps to null characters
This isn’t a wincon because Nahobino would really just… do the same, except with the fact that he can add 3 extra Demons to help him, while Ren can only use one Persona at a time.Ren sleuths out nahobino's affinity and finds the weaknesses. Gets that weaknesses clapped several times with the "1 more" combo going, knocks him down and robs him.
That's only really half true. ren has the Sleuthing Mastery: Chance to reveal all of one enemy’s affinities at the start of battle. Which would be a lot more of a effective passive way to reveal weaknesses than wasting resources on magnifying glasses to find a exploitable weaknesses.This isn’t a wincon because Nahobino would really just… do the same, except with the fact that he can add 3 extra Demons to help him, while Ren can only use one Persona at a time.
I don't see how Ren simply knowing his enemies' affinities is a wincon, when Nahobino (and presumably his demons) can match his speed and have methods of covering their weaknesses.That's only really half true. ren has the Sleuthing Mastery: Chance to reveal all of one enemy’s affinities at the start of battle. Which would be a lot more of a effective passive way to reveal weaknesses than wasting resources on magnifying glasses to find a exploitable weaknesses.
Expect in standard equipment: Ring of Wrath giving him passive speed master/Auto Sukukaja making him more evasive at the start.I don't see how Ren simply knowing his enemies' affinities is a wincon, when Nahobino (and presumably his demons) can match his speed and have methods of covering their weaknesses.
What's stopping Nahobino from just...casting Sukukaja himself? Or casting Dekeja?Expect in standard equipment: Ring of Wrath giving him passive speed master/Auto Sukukaja making him more evasive at the start.
In this type of match with speed master in play even if the speed buff is lost and only has that advantage for a short moment he could use the ring of vanity which nullifies any of his weaknesses which is gonna make trying to hit ren's weaknesses first definitely more difficult even with making this battle a 1 v 4.What's stopping Nahobino from just...casting Sukukaja himself? Or casting Dekeja?
All of one. Against 4. Not all that helpful. Is that even a mid-game item?That's only really half true. ren has the Sleuthing Mastery: Chance to reveal all of one enemy’s affinities at the start of battle. Which would be a lot more of a effective passive way to reveal weaknesses than wasting resources on magnifying glasses to find a exploitable weaknesses.
If he can afflict it, not like it matters with Patra & Amritra Shower.A wincon that probably makes nahobino's 4v1 against ren more of hindernce than a help would be the hex status effect that ren could put on any of the demons attacking him transferring half the damage back at the attacker.
Yeah it sleuths out a opponent's affinity and everything their weak/strong against, so unless your appealing to possibly that it would just target a random demon rather than the nahobino I don't see ren not figuring everything out. it's confidant skill you get from akechi and it's right under information analysis in his mid keysAll of one. Against 4. Not all that helpful. Is that even a mid-game item?
I said one, I never said it wasn’t going to be him. But if Ren suddenly figures out his weakness on one, he would just summon a demon that nulls those attacks. Again, 4 vs 1 with opponents that are all comparable isn’t exactly easy here.Yeah it sleuths out a opponent's affinity and everything their weak/strong against, so unless your appealing to possibly that it would just target a random demon rather than the nahobino I don't see ren not figuring everything out. it's confidant skill you get from akechi and it's right under information analysis in his mid keys
The Ring of Vanity doesn't nullify weaknesses. It simply reverts the affinity of weaknesses to neutral. Elemental affinity would matter as much when Nahobino's party would consist of four relatively equal Demons who could all attack Ren at any given moment.In this type of match with speed master in play even if the speed buff is lost and only has that advantage for a short moment he could use the ring of vanity which nullifies any of his weaknesses which is gonna make trying to hit ren's weaknesses first definitely more difficult even with making this battle a 1 v 4.
I mean, Okuninushi himself, considering you get him mid-game. Any of the beings you beat by mid-game you can summon.What are all the demons Nahobino has who are strong enough to take at least 1 hit from Joker? Joker using Okuninushi can one shot Thor
I think Joker's would be more powerful than a regular Okuninushi due to the wild card and other factors. One example is that his Vishnu's Megidolaon is not significantly weaker than Yaldabaoth's attacks, and I'm sure you'd agree that Yaldabaoth would be several orders of magnitude above a regular VishnuI mean, Okuninushi himself, considering you get him mid-game. Any of the beings you beat by mid-game you can summon.
Detox would passively cure it.Nahobino's Demons could spam status-inflicting spells.
According to the AP justification for his Low 1-C, this version of Nahobino is post-Throne Race. Thus, he'd have access to Odin, Vasuki, Ishtar, and Mother Harlot; all of whom should be vastly more powerful than Thor. I believe (though am not entirely sure) he should also scale above three of the four Archangels (and have the ability to summon them), who are dimensionally superior to Thor, since the side quest in which he fights them is given to players before entering the Temple of Eternity.Are there any Low 1-C demons Nahobino can beat/summon that are that much stronger than Thor?
If I remember correctly, Detox only has a certain chance of triggering. The point would still stand.Detox would passively cure it.
If you can prove it, sure.I think Joker's would be more powerful than a regular Okuninushi due to the wild card and other factors.
I don’t get this example.One example is that his Vishnu's Megidolaon is not significantly weaker than Yaldabaoth's attacks, and I'm sure you'd agree that Yaldabaoth would be several orders of magnitude above a regular Vishnu
If wanna get technical on coverage then ren with X persona that has Unshaken Will to negate mental status effects added with that chance to detox to cut a lot status effect options down a peg.If I remember correctly, Detox only has a certain chance of triggering. The point would still stand.
I don't think he'd even have access to that skill. The earliest one can get Unshaken Will is from Yamata-no-Orochi in Shido's palace, which is obviously far past his Low 1-C key.If wanna get technical on coverage then ren with X persona that has Unshaken Will to negate mental status effects added with that chance to detox to cut a lot status effect options down a peg.