[R2M1] 1st Crosstier Tournament - Laser Frogman vs. Jose Cruz (3-0-0)

[ExSENNA]

Welcome to the First Match of the Second Round of the 1st Crosstier Tournament! (Event Leaderboard)

On the blue corner, we have Laser Frogman, submitted by @Froggytron!
On the red corner, we have Jose Cruz, submitted by @GreyFang82!
Duel 5, let's go!

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Stage 4 Frogman with equipment is used.
Speed equalized.
The location is Roman Forum, Rome, Italy
Starting distance is 10 meters.

Frogman: 3
Jose:
Incon (coin flip):

 

[GreyFang82]

José only chance here is landing a Particle Fission on Frogtron.

José lacks any other way to damage him and even move him.

Since LS varies, I’ll assume the high end and assume Crying Girls’s particle electromagnetism won’t slow it down.

That and the fact José will be aware that his particles are sentient (because fear hax) he will start with Overclocked to avoid these dangerous attacks and try to land a PSR.

I’ll wait to hear more if that can win him the fight or not.

 

[Froggytron]

I’ll wait to hear more if that can win him the fight or not.

At first look, the ability to manipulate the very atoms upon hit (ignoring durability) could do serious damage, but I will have a deeper look at tomorrow morning (because my brain works worse after taking a college exam today).

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Following

 

[GreyFang82]

What Crying Girls can do:
-Fire a Particle Fission Reaction: A very bright projectile that is an atom large, it does tend to blind those who look at it directly and is very difficult to track for both those reasons. On contact it deconstructs bonds of all the atoms of that mass of matter. Even if that matter adds to itself the whole will come apart until each particle is separate from each other. (Jo Freespirit created a water dragon, and when it got hit by it and was starting to fall apart Jo tried to keep adding water to it but that newly added water also got deconstructed until the entire thing was turned into hydrogen and oxygen. Jo also tried to separate the part that wasn't deconstructed yet to salvage it but that too fell apart)
-Repeal Jose himself from all attacks: although the Electromagnetic Particle can't more or slow down Frogman, what it can do is make both Jose and Frogman extremely positively charged (or negatively) and anytime Frogman tries to attack with a melee attack or an attack that has matter (like rockets or bullets) Jose is repealed away from the attack.
-Use Overclocked on Jose: This gives a "Blitz level" reaction boost to Jose. This doesn't mean he can move fast enough to blitz Froggytron, it just means Jose will be able to dodge attacks on that level. Meaning he shouldn't get caught off guard by any attacks and should be able to react to everything thrown at him comfortably.
-I am also pretty sure Frogman can't actually detect Crying Girls but I'm sure when Froggytron is back online he can give me his thoughts.

 

[Froggytron]

Well, ironically, the massive stat difference also gives Jose a chance. Even strong Frogman as stage4 likes to enjoy fights (if not pressured by time), irritating their opponent with stat difference and their arsenal (which they see right away with energy vision), before finishing them. They show this with massively weaker Red Stickmen.

What Crying Girls can do:
-Fire a Particle Fission Reaction: A very bright projectile that is an atom large, it does tend to blind those who look at it directly and is very difficult to track for both those reasons. On contact it deconstructs bonds of all the atoms of that mass of matter. Even if that matter adds to itself the whole will come apart until each particle is separate from each other. (Jo Freespirit created a water dragon, and when it got hit by it and was starting to fall apart Jo tried to keep adding water to it but that newly added water also got deconstructed until the entire thing was turned into hydrogen and oxygen. Jo also tried to separate the part that wasn't deconstructed yet to salvage it but that too fell apart)

I would say Particle Fission Reaction gives Jose a chance combined with using Frogman's tendency to look down at him (as Jose possesses Social Influencing). Starting with his High 8-C Lightning Creation and all to make it seem like there is nothing he can do, then summoning his stand out next to Frogman to shoot the atom as sneakily as possible, having a chance to catch Frogman with bigger experience and reactions off guard. Given the description, it could also have a shot at combating Low-High Regen.

-Repeal Jose himself from all attacks: although the Electromagnetic Particle can't more or slow down Frogman, what it can do is make both Jose and Frogman extremely positively charged (or negatively) and anytime Frogman tries to attack with a melee attack or an attack that has matter (like rockets or bullets) Jose is repealed away from the attack.

That could buy more time, but doesn't seem to combat the ranged Red Laser attack arsenal.

-Use Overclocked on Jose: This gives a "Blitz level" reaction boost to Jose. This doesn't mean he can move fast enough to blitz Froggytron, it just means Jose will be able to dodge attacks on that level. Meaning he shouldn't get caught off guard by any attacks and should be able to react to everything thrown at him comfortably.

Stage3 and 4 Frogmen possess supreme reactions as well (able to organize entire battlefield and avoid bullets of entire armies by casually dodging to sides), which would make Overclocked boosting Jose's reactions matching to stage4 Frogman.

-I am also pretty sure Frogman can't actually detect Crying Girls but I'm sure when Froggytron is back online he can give me his thoughts.

If Jose summons the stand early, there is a chance Energy Vision or Sin Vision (stands are manifestations of lifeforce, if Jose made any unfair action in his life, the sin-meter of his soul could probably be seen in the stand as well, or if the stand thought for itself and made unfair things) could make Frogman notice it. The best odds for Jose would be to summon it right before the atom attack. Yet, and ability of Frogman to develop a near-future precognition organ or TP Deferoid managing to work with atom precisition lowers the odds of Jose's wincoin.

 

[GreyFang82]

That could buy more time, but doesn't seem to combat the ranged Red Laser attack

Actually Laser is an acronym for Light Amplification by Stimulated Emission of Radiation and does have mass (extremely little but still some), meaning it still falls under Crying Girl’s effects.

If Jose summons the stand early, there is a chance Energy Vision or Sin Vision (stands are manifestations of lifeforce, if Jose made any unfair action in his life, the sin-meter of his soul could probably be seen in the stand as well, or if the stand thought for itself and made unfair things) could make Frogman notice it. The best odds for Jose would be to summon it right before the atom attack. Yet, and ability of Frogman to develop a near-future precognition organ or TP Deferoid managing to work with atom precisition lowers the odds of Jose's wincoin.

In that case Frogman should be able to see it only because José always starts a fight by summoning Crying Girls. José without Crying Girl’s cannot access any of his abilities.

Also let me ask this, is Frogman vulnerable to EMPs? Because José is smart enough to try that but I he doesn’t know if it would work.

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Bump

 

[Froggytron]

Actually Laser is an acronym for Light Amplification by Stimulated Emission of Radiation and does have mass (extremely little but still some), meaning it still falls under Crying Girl’s effects.

Then Jose could buy more precious time. How would the effect behave if Jose got surrounded with Red Laser homing bursts from all sides?

In that case Frogman should be able to see it only because José always starts a fight by summoning Crying Girls. José without Crying Girl’s cannot access any of his abilities.

Then Frogman will focus a bit more attention on it. Still, catching a singular atom could be troublesome for stage4, if he chooses a non-optimal arsenal for it. Even spotting it won't be easy with energy vision.

Also let me ask this, is Frogman vulnerable to EMPs? Because José is smart enough to try that but I he doesn’t know if it would work.

What is meant by EMP precisely? I couldn't find it on the profile by these letters alone, Im bad at shortcuts

 

[GreyFang82]

Then Jose could buy more precious time. How would the effect behave if Jose got surrounded with Red Laser homing bursts from all sides?

Is it omni directional in 3-D space?

Then Frogman will focus a bit more attention on it. Still, catching a singular atom could be troublesome for stage4, if he chooses a non-optimal arsenal for it. Even spotting it won't be easy with energy vision.

Especially if José gets desperate he might try to use some tricks like magnetizing the particle to Frogman, so after the Frogman has dodged it a few times it could get caught off guard by it suddenly homing onto it in the last second.

What is meant by EMP precisely? I couldn't find it on the profile by these letters alone, Im bad at shortcuts

Electro Magnetic Pulse, it’s not a thing he’s done since he’s never needed to but he is smart enough to create one and has all the abilities needed to do so.

Basically I’m asking if he can use his electro magnetism to fry or force reboot Frogman.

 

[Froggytron]

Is it omni directional in 3-D space?

Stage4 could definitely spam enough of them to create a perfect circle around Jose, slowly moving at him. They are incredibly heat and age-manip-emitting arrows, but there is no need for Frogman to send their stronger 6-B variants. In fact, their weaker versions could be used to let Jose show his abilities first.

Especially if José gets desperate he might try to use some tricks like magnetizing the particle to Frogman, so after the Frogman has dodged it a few times it could get caught off guard by it suddenly homing onto it in the last second.

Frogman could also try stopping the atom with telekinesis, portals of AT shields. But given the atom's size, nothing guarantees stopping it.

Electro Magnetic Pulse, it’s not a thing he’s done since he’s never needed to but he is smart enough to create one and has all the abilities needed to do so.

Basically I’m asking if he can use his electro magnetism to fry or force reboot Frogman.

At maximum, it could disturb some of Frogman's communication equipment, yet Frogman himself is organic, so he won't be affected.

 

[GreyFang82]

Stage4 could definitely spam enough of them to create a perfect circle around Jose, slowly moving at him. They are incredibly heat and age-manip-emitting arrows, but there is no need for Frogman to send their stronger 6-B variants. In fact, their weaker versions could be used to let Jose show his abilities first.

How does the aging work mechanically, what specifically does it do to the body on the most fundamental level you can explain.

The heat isn’t a problem, his stand creates and disperses the heat of Plasma (11,000 degrees Fahrenheit or 6366 Kelvin) and Lightning (50,000 degrees Fahrenheit or 28033.15 Kelvin)

And does so passively, so long as Crying Girl’s is active

Also since this is from a weapon and not Frogman himself, Crying Girls should be able to redirect these projectiles away from him by using electromagnetism.

Frogman could also try stopping the atom with telekinesis, portals of AT shields. But given the atom's size, nothing guarantees stopping it.

Would Frogman use a barrier of telekinesis or would try to grab it?

A barrier could be slipped through by it skirting around the side or by the electromagnetic pulls to the side and then hit where the barrier isn’t.

If Frogman tries to grab it, it would take way more effort and a miscalc will cost his life. If they succeed it will stop it from moving for sure.

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

If Frogman tries to grab it, it would take way more effort and a miscalc will cost his life. If they succeed it will stop it from moving for sure.

I should point out that if frogman is actually killed, his core BFR’s and he’ll regen and come back, plus 3 second rewind also helping here

 

[GreyFang82]

I should point out that if frogman is actually killed, his core BFR’s and he’ll regen and come back, plus 3 second rewind also helping here

It would also deconstruct even when BFR’d so unless it time travels first it will be reduced to atoms.

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

It would also deconstruct even when BFR’d so unless it time travels first it will be reduced to atoms.

Is that an ability of crying girls? Frogman’s body deconstructs, the core does not. It will regenerate stage 4’s body after a short time and he will return agai

 

[GreyFang82]

Is that an ability of crying girls? Frogman’s body deconstructs, the core does not. It will regenerate stage 4’s body after a short time and he will return agai

The core is attached to Frogman no? If it’s attached on, in, other way of contact it will deconstruct. Think of it as a mass of particles, and once hit it will deconstruct until everything that was in contact with is reduced to atoms

 

[Froggytron]

How does the aging work mechanically, what specifically does it do to the body on the most fundamental level you can explain.

Basically, any red laser projectile landing a physical hit steals some of your lifespan => makes you radically older, as the years are now gone. The radiation emitted from red laser projectiles also makes things get older around it, but way less aggressively.

Also since this is from a weapon and not Frogman himself, Crying Girls should be able to redirect these projectiles away from him by using electromagnetism.

Even if Frogman gets tired and sends projectiles capable of destroying the moon?

Would Frogman use a barrier of telekinesis or would try to grab it?

Frogman having so much arsenal to possibly stop it could end up in choosing a method with less chance of success.

The core is attached to Frogman no? If it’s attached on, in, other way of contact it will deconstruct. Think of it as a mass of particles, and once hit it will deconstruct until everything that was in contact with is reduced to atoms

I should point out that if frogman is actually killed, his core BFR’s and he’ll regen and come back, plus 3 second rewind also helping here

The core system is a passive last-save system BFRing Frogman's brain and heart (even to another universe with a stage4, which wouldn't be necessary here). It works by predicting the future on its own. The moment Frogman should die in the next move, it activates. If getting hit by the stand's atom meant the brain+heart deconstructing even in other universe, the core would be BFRed before the atom hits.

Also comes with a question, couldn't Frogman just make parts getting deconstructed explode? They can make their blood explode, which contains extreme amounts of energy at stage4. Even if the deconstruction becomes an absolute effect for all atoms Frogman is made from the moment 'Particle Fission Reaction' hits, the deconstructing amounts of atoms would spread through all the area around with a massive speed amplification, and the odds of hitting Jose would be more than great. Once that makes contact with Jose, wouldn't he deconstruct as well? While Frogman has an over 99% means of coming back safely, Jose would be finished by his own technique.

 

[GreyFang82]

Basically, any red laser projectile landing a physical hit steals some of your lifespan => makes you radically older, as the years are now gone. The radiation emitted from red laser projectiles also makes things get older around it, but way less aggressively.

Yes but how, is it supernatural unexplainable means or through a physics based reason

Even if Frogman gets tired and sends projectiles capable of destroying the moon?

Have these laser physically pushed something back? If not, yes. This is based on the force it imparts not the potency.

Frogman having so much arsenal to possibly stop it could end up in choosing a method with less chance of success.

So they would default to trying to grab it?

The core system is a passive last-save system BFRing Frogman's brain and heart (even to another universe with a stage4, which wouldn't be necessary here). It works by predicting the future on its own. The moment Frogman should die in the next move, it activates. If getting hit by the stand's atom meant the brain+heart deconstructing even in other universe, the core would be BFRed before the atom hits.

Ok, so José can’t win.

Also comes with a question, couldn't Frogman just make parts getting deconstructed explode? They can make their blood explode, which contains extreme amounts of energy at stage4. Even if the deconstruction becomes an absolute effect for all atoms Frogman is made from the moment 'Particle Fission Reaction' hits, the deconstructing amounts of atoms would spread through all the area around with a massive speed amplification, and the odds of hitting Jose would be more than great. Once that makes contact with Jose, wouldn't he deconstruct as well? While Frogman has an over 99% means of coming back safely, Jose would be finished by his own technique.

No. Deconstruction makes it to single atoms, so unless the tech is literally able to function after being turned to iron, carbon, etc then yeah he’s dead. But if not he’a fine.

But by the sound of it José can’t do anything. GGs.

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Ok, so José can’t win.

I believe there’s a certain point where frogman can’t do it anymore, José basically needs to win the battle multiple times to actually win the fight, if you know what I mean

 

[GreyFang82]

his only way to win was to get a fast and tricky win.

If he has to do 3 rounds against a person who can casually one shot it’s a certain loss.

 

[GreyFang82]

Basically, even if José wins the first fight.

He always loses the second because he would assume the fight is over and drop Overclocked and Desummon Crying Girls.

When Overclocked is dismissed the person (José) will have his brain fried for a a while. And Crying Girls de Summoned means when Frogman reappears José is stunned and can’t passively protect himself with it. He certainly loses. He would never assume a person getting hit from PFR would come back.

 

[Froggytron]

Have these laser physically pushed something back? If not, yes. This is based on the force it imparts not the potency.

Red Laser (for example one of Gunnix's bullets) possesses a tendency to push other things away.

So they would default to trying to grab it?

If other methods would fail. Catching an atom still would be a thing you cannot guarantee.

Basically, even if José wins the first fight.

He always loses the second because he would assume the fight is over and drop Overclocked and Desummon Crying Girls.

But I never mentioned there is a 100% chance of Frogman returning. In rare scenarios, the universe into which the Core would BFR itself is onesided, aka possessing its own rules or a barrier preventing the regenerated Frogman from traveling back to the battlefield. The other situation would be Core getting repeatedly BFR'd into dangerous objects like black holes, upon which (when finally reaching a safe space), the regenerated Frogman would have lost the way back to the battlefield, not finding it in time within SBA rule.

Having a means of forcing Frogman to BFR out as a Core already grants a win coin, even if small. Jose can be stunned, but the fact he remains on the battlefield alone would grant him the win.

When Overclocked is dismissed the person (José) will have his brain fried for a a while. And Crying Girls de Summoned means when Frogman reappears José is stunned and can’t passively protect himself with it. He certainly loses. He would never assume a person getting hit from PFR would come back.

How long is he stunned for after using this? It takes at least several minutes for stage 4 to fully regenerate + another time to successfully return to the battlefield. This could theoretically grant Jose more attempts at BFRing Core to point, from which it cannot return in time.

 

[GreyFang82]

How long is he stunned for after using this? It takes at least several minutes for stage 4 to fully regenerate + another time to successfully return to the battlefield. This could theoretically grant Jose more attempts at BFRing Core to point, from which it cannot return in time.

He’s basically fried for a few days, in all intents and purposes he’s alive but not able to fight.

 

[Froggytron]

He’s basically fried for a few days, in all intents and purposes he’s alive but not able to fight.

Then the % odds of winning should be on Frogman's side

Stage 4 Frogman FRA

 

[GreyFang82]

Then the % odds of winning should be on Frogman's side

Stage 4 Frogman FRA

I agree, it’s guaranteed. Frogman FRA

Bro can stand there, and do nothing and still win more than half the time. GGs.

 

[MintyBoi1]

Frog FRA

 

[Froggytron]

Grace time! Round 3 (Finals) gonna be cruel as hell, wonder if stage4 will make it there

 

[MintyBoi1]

You might be done for

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Y’all underestimate stage 4 frogman for real

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Also Frogman FRA so it'll be 4-0, able to be added right away

 

[GreyFang82]

Honestly, the fact José has no way of knowing the BFR and auto loses to that leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

In terms of the tournament this match has concluded, but honestly I would like a rematch with both characters having prior knowledge of the other.

José can either pull an inconclusive verdict or lose in fair fight but by doing everything he could and not having a scenario where he lands the PFR which is already super difficult and then losing because of random chance hugely in Frogman’s favor.

Edit: Same feeling I have with the Sans fight, it was hugely unfair for Sans and is kinda the reason I haven’t added the fight to José wins.

 

[Froggytron]

Honestly, the fact José has no way of knowing the BFR and auto loses to that leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

Well I get that since in the past, I had awful tourney-matching luck too

In terms of the tournament this match has concluded, but honestly I would like a rematch with both characters having prior knowledge of the other

But I still don't know if that would help Jose at all, once Frogman knew Jose had a method of forcing him into the Core, he would use W.I.S.H nuke cast technique, being in minimum AoE Small Country Level waves destroying what stage 4 wants around himself. But if it made you feel better, we could do a rematch where Jose has prior knowledge of stage 4 Frogman, while Frogman sees Jose first time => once more going easy at him.

Edit: Same feeling I have with the Sans fight, it was hugely unfair for Sans and is kinda the reason I haven’t added the fight to José wins.

Still think the Sans fight should be added, as luck made Jose match something he trained against. It's like studying at A for three maturity exam questions (out of 25) and getting lucky to draw one of them, you just feel blessed.

 

[GreyFang82]

But I still don't know if that would help Jose at all, once Frogman knew Jose had a method of forcing him into the Core, he would use W.I.S.H nuke cast technique, being in minimum AoE Small Country Level waves destroying what stage 4 wants around himself. But if it made you feel better, we could do a rematch where Jose has prior knowledge of stage 4 Frogman, while Frogman sees Jose first time => once more going easy at him.

Oh even then I would feel better, at least it would take a powerful weapon that is out of José’s league than Frogman being able to win by literally doing nothing. Which in-character wouldn’t happen but is very disrespectful of the character and the fight in general l.

Still think the Sans fight should be added, as luck made Jose match something he trained against. It's like studying at A for three maturity exam questions (out of 25) and getting lucky to draw one of them, you just feel blessed.

I get that, and José had to work his ass off and use all his buffs to win a fight against a character like that.

I’ll leave that in the air, it’s up to the Inverted Fate Sans page creator to add it or not.

 

[Froggytron]

Oh even then I would feel better, at least it would take a powerful weapon that is out of José’s league than Frogman being able to win by literally doing nothing. Which in-character wouldn’t happen but is very disrespectful of the character and the fight in general l.

Sorry for not realizing this sooner, Im doing the rematch with prior knowledge once I can, we will shredder this threat instead of writing the results

I get that, and José had to work his ass off and use all his buffs to win a fight against a character like that.

Indeed, it still cost Jose much arguing and willpower to win.

 

[Froggytron]

In terms of the tournament this match has concluded, but honestly I would like a rematch with both characters having prior knowledge of the other.

So do you wanna do the rematch? Else Im writing the results (but doing the rematch is possible even later, overwriting the results)

 

[GreyFang82]

So do you wanna do the rematch? Else Im writing the results (but doing the rematch is possible even later, overwriting the results)

I do, and it will very much end the same way but at least it isn’t from a zero difficultly battle in Frogman’s part and self incap on José part.

 

[Froggytron]

I do, and it will very much end the same way but at least it isn’t from a zero difficultly battle in Frogman’s part and self incap on José part.

The rematch is up