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Protagonist tier list
- Thread starter Seventy96
- Start date
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I feel like this tiering list is wacky.
After all, we all love Dio Brando, and he's evil because he's just absolutely evil.
Kinda misleading here.
After all, we all love Dio Brando, and he's evil because he's just absolutely evil.
Kinda misleading here.
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Also, YOU UNCULTURED SWINE
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@Eficiente
Remind me how he's a Gary Sue again?
Superman is regularly challenged by the enemies he faces, whether they be supervillains or his own inner demons. He strives to act as a beacon of hope and justice to everyone he can to the point that he can seem like a messianic or even godly figure to those not in the know, but at the same time he knows he can't save everyone.
He has many failures. His inability to save his adoptive parents from their fatal car accident. His inability to save his adoptive son Chris from being taken into the Phantom Zone to keep General Zod at bay. His inability to save every man, woman, and child who cries out to him for help at every hour of the day. He doesn't fear death or self-harm, but he is terrified of the thought of being unable to save people when they need him most.
The comic books go out of their way to show that despite his godly abilities, Clark is very much human and thinks like one. He works long hours in and out of costume and minds his bills. He's a loving but diffident family man who is always worried about being there for his wife and son, feeling guilty whenever he is unable to spend time with them and fears the thought of losing either of them.
He knows he can upend the status quo with his vast powers, but has enough faith in humanity to let them decide the course of the future. Even after facing countless evils, he still trusts us people to pave the way for a better world.
He's an ideal hero, but a flawed, human, likable character as well.
Demeaning him as an "inconsistent, easy to use, and overpowered Gary Sue" is a gross generalization and a ridiculous interpretation of his character when he's anything but. He's one of the hardest characters in fiction to write well since he's so well-known and loved. He embodies the best in us, our hopes, fantasies, and dreams, as well as the worst in us in his constant need to avoid the temptation to abuse his powers.
I hate statements like the one you made because you're clearly misinformed about the nature of one of the most beloved characters of all time.
Remind me how he's a Gary Sue again?
Superman is regularly challenged by the enemies he faces, whether they be supervillains or his own inner demons. He strives to act as a beacon of hope and justice to everyone he can to the point that he can seem like a messianic or even godly figure to those not in the know, but at the same time he knows he can't save everyone.
He has many failures. His inability to save his adoptive parents from their fatal car accident. His inability to save his adoptive son Chris from being taken into the Phantom Zone to keep General Zod at bay. His inability to save every man, woman, and child who cries out to him for help at every hour of the day. He doesn't fear death or self-harm, but he is terrified of the thought of being unable to save people when they need him most.
The comic books go out of their way to show that despite his godly abilities, Clark is very much human and thinks like one. He works long hours in and out of costume and minds his bills. He's a loving but diffident family man who is always worried about being there for his wife and son, feeling guilty whenever he is unable to spend time with them and fears the thought of losing either of them.
He knows he can upend the status quo with his vast powers, but has enough faith in humanity to let them decide the course of the future. Even after facing countless evils, he still trusts us people to pave the way for a better world.
He's an ideal hero, but a flawed, human, likable character as well.
Demeaning him as an "inconsistent, easy to use, and overpowered Gary Sue" is a gross generalization and a ridiculous interpretation of his character when he's anything but. He's one of the hardest characters in fiction to write well since he's so well-known and loved. He embodies the best in us, our hopes, fantasies, and dreams, as well as the worst in us in his constant need to avoid the temptation to abuse his powers.
I hate statements like the one you made because you're clearly misinformed about the nature of one of the most beloved characters of all time.
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@Reppuzan Took the words right out of my mouth.Superman is an amazing character and a amazing hero.
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Okey, okey. I really regret having called him a Gary Sue, that was a big mistake on my part. But I can't say the same for the other things, sorry. That being said, I love the character as much as everyone here, and hopefully my opinion about him is due to writers not using him properly in most of the stories where I see him.
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Rorschach is definitely Elder God Tier or at least somewhere up there.
Guts is probably Great tier. Tragic backstory, is pretty much struggling the whole way, doesn't win, he just keeps going on.
High tier should belong to Luke Skywalker. Textbook protagonist done right.
Mid tier is for characters who just do good because it's the 'right thing'. Like MCU Thor.
Meh tier belongs to characters like Jotaro. Lack of overall character, but we still love the guy anyway. Definitely not the worst kind of character but still bland as hell.
Rey from Star Wars is definitely shit tier though. I can go on and on about why she is just a terrible protagonist, but I don't think the word count can take it.
Guts is probably Great tier. Tragic backstory, is pretty much struggling the whole way, doesn't win, he just keeps going on.
High tier should belong to Luke Skywalker. Textbook protagonist done right.
Mid tier is for characters who just do good because it's the 'right thing'. Like MCU Thor.
Meh tier belongs to characters like Jotaro. Lack of overall character, but we still love the guy anyway. Definitely not the worst kind of character but still bland as hell.
Rey from Star Wars is definitely shit tier though. I can go on and on about why she is just a terrible protagonist, but I don't think the word count can take it.
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That superman comic though ....
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I will never, ever get why people say Superman is overpowered.
Anyway. I don't really like the idea of a tier list for something like character quality. It's all subjective what one finds more interesting or threatening. I personally find the "Mid Tier" (villains by virtue of nature and primordial instincts) to be more interesting then a lot of other villains because their motives are absolute: they're unable to be reasoned with and in some cases, their motives are impossible to understand. And plus, some villains are just entertaining despite not being very well written. Gary Smith is an unbelievable and poorly written villain with weird motives but he's just ******* insane and I love him for it.
As for protagonist, it depends on personal taste. Personally I love heroes who are actually heroes. Morally ambiguous anti-heroes never did it for me, I like characters who are undeniably heroic and kind-hearted. As Reppu pointed out above, Superman is a flawed character, but he's still compassionate, kind and, well, heroic.
Anyway. I don't really like the idea of a tier list for something like character quality. It's all subjective what one finds more interesting or threatening. I personally find the "Mid Tier" (villains by virtue of nature and primordial instincts) to be more interesting then a lot of other villains because their motives are absolute: they're unable to be reasoned with and in some cases, their motives are impossible to understand. And plus, some villains are just entertaining despite not being very well written. Gary Smith is an unbelievable and poorly written villain with weird motives but he's just ******* insane and I love him for it.
As for protagonist, it depends on personal taste. Personally I love heroes who are actually heroes. Morally ambiguous anti-heroes never did it for me, I like characters who are undeniably heroic and kind-hearted. As Reppu pointed out above, Superman is a flawed character, but he's still compassionate, kind and, well, heroic.
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Yeah, quality of motive =/= quality of villain.
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I mean to a certain extent, that's true. But a bland villain is a bland villian.
Kylo Ren is a good example of this. He has no character motivation to do what he does, and when he does, it's just broken logic. The dude has more mind swings than a girl on her period and he only did what was convenient to the plot.
Kylo Ren is a good example of this. He has no character motivation to do what he does, and when he does, it's just broken logic. The dude has more mind swings than a girl on her period and he only did what was convenient to the plot.
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I would give reputation to Reppuzan and Darkanine if the feature wasn't broken.
Edward Elric should be in God-Tier, and so should Vash from Trigun as well.
Edward Elric should be in God-Tier, and so should Vash from Trigun as well.
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Yeah but he wasn't bland because he did his evil things just for being evil but simply because his motives are all over the place.
Hell most traditional (And thus, beloved) villains falls into the "evil for evil" category.
Hell most traditional (And thus, beloved) villains falls into the "evil for evil" category.
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DMUA said:
i hate evil beings, even if someones called Dio Brando
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Put EU-Luke on Top-Tier and Rey on Shit-Tier.
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Ok but evil for the sake of being evil doesn't mean you have to sacrifice character.
The Dark Knight Joker is a great example of this. All he wanted to do was watch the world burn. No great motive whatsoever. He was evil for the sake of being evil. But his character was just so enthralling that it was impossible not to love him.
The Dark Knight Joker is a great example of this. All he wanted to do was watch the world burn. No great motive whatsoever. He was evil for the sake of being evil. But his character was just so enthralling that it was impossible not to love him.
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Browsing through my list of favorite characters I realize that most of them are either villains or at best extreme anti-heroes. Woops.
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what tier should Sockpuppets be here?
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Haven't played/read/watched DI so nop.
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Reinhard would fall under...idk actually. From what I've seen of DI, he's evil for the evulz, but I also know there's far more to his character, and the entire "I love everything, but love means destroy to me"
Anyway, as a writer myself, judging a character by the motives is well...flawed, to an extent. Not everyone has to be Zuko to be likable. For example, my main villain in my series is just a dude who is into militaristic research. He's so passionate about his research that he's willing to try to get his weapons as powerful as possible, and he realizes that the best way involves the torture of superpowered characters. He's very sadistic, but everyone who reads the script say he's the most memorable character, even including Delia, my main protagonist. Going off of me, there's Frieza, who'd be sh*t tier, sub, dub, or TFS, yet all (or at least Kai, for dub), are amazing. Darkseid is an amazing villain, etc. People love Lavos in CT because of his terrifyingly cryptic ways and how he was sort of an anti-paragon, "inspiring" Zeal, but he's just middling, despite being one of the most memorable game villains of all time.
Similarly, there's the protagonist. People would think that the archetypal paragon would be at the bottom, which couldn't be farther from the truth. A lot of this will be inspired from the waifu Red-kun (no, not Redgrave ovo). Paragons are good characters by who they play off of, who they inspire, and they're flawed because of their unwavering sense of justice, even if other decisions need to be made. There was the aforementioned Superman, but even Goku, yes Goku, is a paragon, despite his fight boner. Effing Batman is a paragon, albeit for different reasons. Most shounen protagonists are paragons for that matter, yet none of that makes them bad. Don't get me wrong, flawless characters are hard to relate to, and tbh, I don't think flawless characters are necessarily bad if done right. It's about what they represent.What's their theme. And all that jazz. What's Wonder Woman's flaw, for example (I'm actually asking, as I don't know)? Plus, flaws can be minor things. Gohan, as I was told yesterday, has a flaw of not bringing out his true power, even though that can only be brought out by rage, which in itself is a flaw for most other characters. And keeping on the Gohan example, after his character arc ended, he was still interesting in the Buu Saga, and we love Ultimate Gohan.
Anyway, as a writer myself, judging a character by the motives is well...flawed, to an extent. Not everyone has to be Zuko to be likable. For example, my main villain in my series is just a dude who is into militaristic research. He's so passionate about his research that he's willing to try to get his weapons as powerful as possible, and he realizes that the best way involves the torture of superpowered characters. He's very sadistic, but everyone who reads the script say he's the most memorable character, even including Delia, my main protagonist. Going off of me, there's Frieza, who'd be sh*t tier, sub, dub, or TFS, yet all (or at least Kai, for dub), are amazing. Darkseid is an amazing villain, etc. People love Lavos in CT because of his terrifyingly cryptic ways and how he was sort of an anti-paragon, "inspiring" Zeal, but he's just middling, despite being one of the most memorable game villains of all time.
Similarly, there's the protagonist. People would think that the archetypal paragon would be at the bottom, which couldn't be farther from the truth. A lot of this will be inspired from the waifu Red-kun (no, not Redgrave ovo). Paragons are good characters by who they play off of, who they inspire, and they're flawed because of their unwavering sense of justice, even if other decisions need to be made. There was the aforementioned Superman, but even Goku, yes Goku, is a paragon, despite his fight boner. Effing Batman is a paragon, albeit for different reasons. Most shounen protagonists are paragons for that matter, yet none of that makes them bad. Don't get me wrong, flawless characters are hard to relate to, and tbh, I don't think flawless characters are necessarily bad if done right. It's about what they represent.What's their theme. And all that jazz. What's Wonder Woman's flaw, for example (I'm actually asking, as I don't know)? Plus, flaws can be minor things. Gohan, as I was told yesterday, has a flaw of not bringing out his true power, even though that can only be brought out by rage, which in itself is a flaw for most other characters. And keeping on the Gohan example, after his character arc ended, he was still interesting in the Buu Saga, and we love Ultimate Gohan.
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Also, I liked Rey... She represented hope, from what Red-kun said.
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which tier would sockpuppets fall under?
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>liked Rey
Do I need to pull up that rant on Rey's Mary Sue-ness again?
Do I need to pull up that rant on Rey's Mary Sue-ness again?
