Primal Groudon vs Primal Kyogre

[Modernmyrmidon]

Both 5-B

Groudon- 8 (Bob8999, PaChi2, Overlord775, GyroNutz, JooCipher, Starter Pack, GogiBoyForever, Glaceongamez471)

Kyogre- 0

Inconclusive- 3 (TheArsenal1212, Armorchompy, Listentomyrythm)

 

[Modernmyrmidon]

Bump

 

[Modernmyrmidon]

Bump

 

[Modernmyrmidon]

Bump

 

[Bob8999]

hmm... well all their stats are equal, but kyogre should have the type advantage (meaning it should resist most (if not all) of groudon´s attacks and groundon is weak to most (if not all) of kyogre´s attacks.) so kyogre should take this.

 

[Overlord775]

Water Type attacks are nullified by Groudon's ability

 

[Bob8999]

oh yeah, forgot about that, in that case kyogre still resists of groudons ground type attacks and it´s ability nullifies his fire type attacks and kyogre´s ability kind of cancels out groudon´s because one causes intense sunlight and the other causes massive storm clouds to appear which would block the sun there by nullifying the intense sunlight and by extention groudons ability. kyogre takes this.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

They're canonical equals. However, because Groupon is slower, his ability would cancel out Kyogre's meaning water gets screwed over. Also Kyogre doesn't resist Ground and is weak to Solar Beam.

 

[Modernmyrmidon]

So, from what I've gathered so far, 1 for Kyogre.

 

[Bob8999]

well i forgot a lot of stuff, but to be fair, i havent played a pokemon game in 4+ years.

 

[Overlord775]

Water types doesn't resist Ground type attacks

Also In the Mega Evolution Special Groundon nullified Kyogre's Origin Pulse by kinda just standing there

 

[PaChi2]

Asuming game mechanics, Groudon.

 

[Bob8999]

ok, basically kyogres only moves are: hyper beam, sheer cold, ice beam, calm mind, ancient power, rest, double edge, body slam, and scary face, but it does have a slight speed advantage (based on game mechanics.) it is suseptible to solar beam and due to groudons ability it doesnt have to wait for it to charge meaning it can spam it and kyogre is kinda doomed. groudon can also learn thunder (another move kyogre is weak to) and due to kyogre´s ability it cant miss, so kyogre is kinda doomed, as far as i can tell no matter which ability takes effect kyogre is doomed. i take back my previous posts groudon should win.

 

[Overlord775]

Land fra

 

[Modernmyrmidon]

3 for Groudon.

 

[Modernmyrmidon]

Bump

 

[GyroNutz]

Primal Groudon looked far more impressive in the mega evolution special fight, and that was in the middle of the ocean. He should take this, + FRA

 

[JooCipher]

Groudon FRA

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

This pretty much sums it up.

 

[TheArsenal1212]

They're literally equal. I don't see why game mechanics allowing Groudon to go second with weather means it's overrules the actual lore of the series

 

[Modernmyrmidon]

So from what I've gathered so far, 5 for Groudon.

 

[TheArsenal1212]

I'm voting Incon. They're literally even

 

[Modernmyrmidon]

Alrighty. 1 for Inconclusive.

 

[Armorchompy]

Incon. That's literally a plot point that they're even. Also, both have 90 base speed in the games, so that argument is factually wrong anyway.

 

[Listentomyrhytm]

Thunder McQueen FRA

 

[GyroNutz]

Well, their fights always get interrupted by Rayquaza. If they fought to the death, I'd say Groudon edges out. Weathers won't override one another, but they should clash, meaning that any water moves Kyogre fires off get evaporated near Groudon and any fire moves Groudon fires off at Kyogre sizzle out.

Kyogre is completely out of its comfort zone fighting at central park which doesn't have much water at all, and its only viable wincon is sheer cold, whereas Groudon's movepool is generally more effective.

 

[Overlord775]

@Arsenal

But about every fight Kyogre Vs Groudon we have seen Groudon was holding his own, if not having the upper hand, even when Kyogre had the environmental advantage, which he doesn't have here.

@Gyro

In the Mega Evolution Special Groundon shrugged off Sheer Cold, with his body heat just melting the ice around him, so it's not a wincon

 

[GyroNutz]

Oh, fair enough. That resistance should really be added to his profile.

One more reason why P Groudon wins.

 

[GojiBoyForever]

Incon FRA

 

[GyroNutz]

They may be even in strength, and practically counterparts, but Groudon has all the situational advantages. Battle location, better weather condition in terms of defending its weak spots, negating Kyogre's best moves. These put it squarely in P Groudon's favour.

 

[Starter_Pack]

I'm definitely voting Groudon FRA.

Also, really funny that in the original games, it was pretty clear that Kyogre would be the winner in a battle between the two Pokemon, only for the remakes to flip that on its head and make Groudon easily superior to its counterpart.

It is also interesting to note that, while they are exactly similar in terms of speed in their base stats, Kyogre is clearly faster than Groudon according to the Pokeathlon stats. So, that helps to settle that.

 

[Overlord775]

About the speed thing, it doesn't matter, Groudon in the Mega Evolution Special evaporated an Origin Pulse with his own heat, not even with the harsh sunlight., just his sheer boiling hotness.

 

[GojiBoyForever]

Switching to Groudon FRA. Gen 2 & 3 for life.

 

[Overlord775]

Our God and saviour Arceus says hi

 

[Bob8999]

voting groudon fra

 

[GlaceonGamez471]

Groudon FRA

 

[Overlord775]

Grace

 

[Armorchompy]

quick reminder that lore literally says they're even and that every time they fight they're even

 

[GyroNutz]

In what context are they even? It most likely is referring to strength, in which case Groudon takes it FRA. Their fights are generally interrupted by Rayquaza and/or don't happen on land, which gives Groudon a large advantage.

 

[Armorchompy]

It isn't referring to strength, just general power. And where the fight takes place barely matters, as both basically reshape the environment around them with their presence.