Potential MASSIVE Speed Downgrade for One Piece

[CinCameron20]

This Calculatio suggests that Kalifa moved her arm length in the time frame in which the lightning bolt fell, however, we never see any "movement" made by Kalifa in this feat.

Here is the chapter in which the feat took place.

The only thing we can argue is that she made her bubble shell in the time-frame, but the shell is NOT her arm length. We can even argue that she reacted and began her defense before the lightning was triggered by Nami.

With this, there would be absolutely no support for MHS combat speed and travel speed for pre time-skip characters, and no support for MHS travel speed for the ENTIRE verse. Kalifa's bubble shell does not scale to combat speed

This would mean a speed downgrade to Hypersonic+ for all characters during and after Water 7 arc.

High tiers and above will keep MHS combat and reaction speed via scaling to Doflamingo, since he performed a MHS feat by slicing a meteorite apart.

Unless Kalifa has MHS+ reaction speed (she witnessed Lightning falling down from a few meters away and acted upon it), this downgrade must happen.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. I suppose that this seems to make sense. However, if other staff members agree, I would appreciate if they help out with unlocking and re-locking the necessary profile pages.

 

[Adam_of_darkness]

Just a question

Wouldnt CP9 members be lightning+ in speed since luffy wasnt able to react to their attacks,while he reacted to enel's attacks ?

 

[CinCameron20]

@Ant - currently, i'm trying to find Kalifa's Reaction speed, so that we can safely judge how this should be handled.

If we CAN assume Blueno's reaction speed powerscales to Kalifa's, than Luffy vanishing from his sight with movements and attacks can still legitimize a higher speed tier.

 

[CinCameron20]

@Adam - Luffy did not react to Enel's attacks. He only reacted to his physical movements, not when he went into Logia dispersion and used lightning strikes. He was always caught by them.

 

[Hellspawn_Barbarian]

Hyped for this.

 

[CinCameron20]

Okay, i did A quick calc for Kalifa's reaction speed

So perhaps MHS one piece can be saved since Luffy's travel and attack speed blitzed Blueno, who underwent the same training alongside Kalifa (though he is superior to her)

 

[Antvasima]

I would appreciate if you inform the calculation group members about this thread, and ask them for input.

 

[Gunchar]

Sounds interessting, but which profiles would be affected by that?

 

[CinCameron20]

Luffy was never "reacting to lightning" and also, "reacting to lightning" does not automatically give them speed even comparable to lightning.

@Gunchar - literally all of them.

 

[Addarash]

I recall Khalifah being able to anticipate the lightning before the bolts were protruded, seems she should be a lightning timer rather than having lightning speed reaction if anything and even the name was a give away of the attack.

The clouds actually took time to form.

I can see this being more reliable if we don't use this lightning reaction. She would have evaded before the thunder could strike, it wasn't exactly point-black at all. And she couldn't even react to the mirage's movements with the same lithe of reaction.

 

[CinCameron20]

@Addrash - the 2nd case can be argued as "not real lightning" due to the nature in which the attacks work and where it comes from, though it could actually be lightning-speed, either way, it's still possible that Kalifa is MHS regardless due to the first feat (her reacting to Lightning from a few meters away is already Mach 190 minimum, potentially higher).

 

[Addarash]

If that's the case then why couldn't she react an even slower lightning? The point was the balls were much slower and Nami's not MHS, so she should be able to evade her lightning balls with that agile of a reaction, so it might be a discrepancy.

 

[CinCameron20]

That's only for the 2nd case, but she did indeed react to the lightning strike from the first feat, which is indeed true lightning.

The 2nd case was Kalifa being surrounded and not knowing which balls were fake or real, so she got hit by panicking.

 

[Addarash]

She's MHS why would she panic when there's a massive disparity between the two's speed. Nami only moves HS+ and somehow while Kalifa is MHS, why couldn't she dodge them all is a better question.

 

[RexofLM]

^PSI.

 

[Gunchar]

@CinCameron20 Oh well that would be a lot of work then, but im still for a downgrade if its true.

 

[CinCameron20]

@Addarash - Nami's attack speed should be up to MHS+ since she can create clouds and use lightning bolts.

Also, Kalifa's combat and travel speed might be less than her reaction speed, since we have basically nothing to scale her to MHS. She has only proven MHS reactions.

Also, the plot called for Nami to win, so there's that >_<!

 

[Antvasima]

If Kalifa has MHS reactions, it is reasonable to assume that her and other Cipher Pol members' combat speed scales, as othervise they would be unable to keep up with/hit her during training.

 

[CinCameron20]

@Ant - true, especially since the "mach 190 reactions" is only from the last possible time in which she needs to defend herself. her reaction speed could be considerably higher. So now I believe that we can maintain MHS One Piece since we've mostly solved the problem (no extra work! Yay), but I am curious of one thing:

Do you know exactly why characters are listed as High Hypersonic in Water 7? I looked at the calculation and only saw that it was Mach 9, which is Hypersonic for Zoro's speed.

Unless they scale to CP9 members, High Hypersonic is not supported. Zoro and Sanji would need to be upgraded to MHS (Sanji being too fast for Kalifa to react and both being capable of fighting the higher tier CP9 members and winning, for example).

 

[Antvasima]

No, I do not know why they have that speed ranking. You can scale them from CP9 if you wish.

 

[CinCameron20]

Okay, I will need Zoro, Sanji, and Luffy's pages unlocked so that I can apply changes from HHS to MHS while i work on edits for CP9.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay.

 

[CinCameron20]

@Ant - i made the appropriate changes to those three characters, so now i'm curious about what this means for characters like Chopper, Franky and Nami, who could keep pace with CP9 members in some cases.

I am not sure about Nami, but Chopper and Franky being MHS seems consistent.

 

[Antvasima]

I suppose so, yes.

 

[CinCameron20]

I need to ask something regarding the speed of Rob Lucci:

Do we assume that his speed is multiplied as he possesses a Doriki that is 5 times superior to the lower tier CP9, and 6.35 Kalifa's? I'm sure that would be calc stacking territory, but if not, we'd have Lucci at Lightning speed. Luffy himself could blitz Blueno from over a dozen meters away on several occasions in Gear 2nd, while Kalifa could react to Lightning at a much closer range.

I'm not sure if this is the case, but it's worth asking regardless (it is the wank speaking).

I'm going to message the rest of the Calc group to come over and give input on this thread and the calculation i did regarding Kalifa's reaction speed.

 

[Thebluedash]

Makes sense enough.


@Cin No, power level scaling is just bad.

 

[Antvasima]

I do not think that we can multiply speed from power level, no.

 

[Grudgeman1706]

I agree with both antvasima and blue on that.

 

[CinCameron20]

Yeah, it was the "wishful upgrade" talk speaking (it had to come out sooner or later) .

 

[Addarash]

I too would suggest we, not power scale, in this instance at all.