Potential Luffy Upgrades.

[Rib78]

There is a calculatio for Gomu Gomu no Storm that places the destroyed volume of bedrock at between 74000 and 100000 cubic metres; applying violent fragmentation would make that small town level, which would be an upgrade to his DC and likely durability.

The question of whether violent fragmentation is applicably isn't totally simple because:

-There are a a few large blocks of debris at the top and bottom of the tunnel

but

-Atleast part of the mass was visibly pulverised

-There is significant amounts of small debris at the ends of the tunnel

-No large mass of debris left the tunnel as the attack was going, and there is not where for it to be displaced to at any significant size

Also, a little detail: "Small City level via combination attack" is listed inbetween his Fishman Island and Dressrossa versions with seperators on either side, I'm assuming this is a reference to his Elephant Gatling, in which case the seperators between that and his Fishman Island stats should be removed.

 

[Illuminati478]

but isn't he already stronger then that, even without king kong gun? even if you would assume the entirety of the high end was pulverized you would still arrive at small town level, and even then he is power scaled higher, this is no upgrade, its a downgrade we should be considering for fishman arc luffy.

 

[Rib78]

Gomu Gomu no Storm was back in Alabasta for which he's listed as Multi-City Block.

 

[DontTalk]

If I see this right the pictures/video of the calculation in the thread were deleted, so I am not sure what scene they are refering to, but isn´t Gomu Gomu no storm an attack made from multiple hits? Usually, when it comes to attack potency, it is said that damage doesn´t stack, right? So does this calc only consider a single punch?

 

[Davy0]

Then we'd just call it a chain/combo attack. We shouldn't take away he can do it though.

 

[Rib78]

The calculation only considers the attack as a whole, but I think that's fair because when it comes to attack potency the reason we disregard things often done in multiple hits is because it may not be representative of what the can output in a single attack, whereas when it comes to attacks like Luffy's storm (or from another verse, the sunlight yellow overdrive), etc. they are still technically one attack (as opposed to something like Yusuke beating on Toguro, even if the difference is only semantics, I'd say it's important semantics).

So if the is "can he output that in one attack", then the answer is that in a way, he just did.

Even if this doesn't apply to his alabasta/skypiea potency his G3 moves should scale from this, given how they're obviously superior to his various gatlings, etc.

 

[Davy0]

I getcha.

 

[DontTalk]

I would say we shouldn´t apply it to normal attack potency.

As I understand the reason for not accepting multiple hits is usually because it doesn´t scale to higher durability. Basically if you do a bit damage 1000 attacks will do more damage, but if you do no damage in the first place you will also not do it in multiple hits.

So if you punch a wall and it doesn´t damage the wall it will still not be damaged if you do it another 1000 times, that is the idea as far as I understand. If we would accept it like this we would logically also have to accept damage stacking for characters that can do hundreds of trillions of attacks in a similar timeframe, which could put wall level characters to continent level.

About scaling it to G3... If they are obviously stronger than GGnStorm I have no problem with it, even through I don´t know how certain that is.

 

[Davy0]

But we're not talking about durability, only the fact that he caused such a huge hole, as well as an earthquake by using Gomu Gomu no Storm.

 

[DontTalk]

Attack Potency is the counter part to durability. So we are talking about how high of a durability he coud harm if we are talking about attack potency.

 

[Rib78]

Would the same concept not apply to things like Toriko's kugi punch as well?

 

[DontTalk]

I don´t know Toriko so I can´t really answer that.

 

[Davy0]

That's why we make sure to name the attack which had the ability to do such damage. Gomu Gomu no Storm was arguably his strongest attack (without using a certain Golden Ball) before he reached Gear Second and Third. We also make sure to note that it was a combination attack and shouldn't be counted towards Luffy's singular attacks or moves in single burst strikes.

 

[DontTalk]

If you note that it doesn´t enable him to harm characters with a higher durability than with his singular attacks, since damage doesn´t stack, I don´t have a problem with you adding it, even through I personally think it is pointless and will just make the page less overseeable.

But I will leave judgement to how much detail makes sense to the people that actively take care of the characters.

 

[Davy0]

If he uses that move, it should harm people of higher durability, that wouldn't make sense. Elephant Gun was also a Combo attack, should we discount it was going to destroy Noah if he hadn't stopped his attacking, too? It also makes sense to why Crocodile was defeated when he tanked a punch from a guy like Jozu and was still conscious and capable of fighting.

 

[Antvasima]

I agree with DontTalk about the damage stacking point.

 

[Davy0]

Then why did we place Elephant Gatling which is also a combination attack, within Luffy's destructive capacity. You guys aren't making any sense.

 

[Antvasima]

Please explain about what the elephant gatling is? I am in the middle of the daily backlog and cannot afford the time to investigate at the moment.

 

[Davy0]

http://a.*************/store/manga/106/58-645.0/compressed/e12.jpg?v=51320228142

http://a.*************/store/manga/106/59-647.0/compressed/i06.jpg?v=51322028561

http://a.*************/store/manga/106/59-647.0/compressed/i07.jpg?v=51322028561

http://a.*************/store/manga/106/59-647.0/compressed/i08.jpg?v=51322028561

http://a.*************/store/manga/106/59-647.0/compressed/i09.jpg?v=51322028561

http://a.*************/store/manga/106/59-647.0/compressed/i12.jpg?v=51322028561 - Piece of resistance.

 

[Antvasima]

Hmm. You do have a point in that the elephant gatling should either be removed as well, or the gomu gomu no storm be accepted.

However, accepting it would still open up a massive can of worms, as we would likely have to start accepting multi-attacks from lots of different characters, so I would prefer if somebody removed the elephant gatling instead.

 

[Davy0]

If that's what ya want to do. Though again, Luffy didn't just up and gain this strength. He finally showed his true trump card in Gear 4, and that was his full power at this chapter of One Piece, so what I would recommend is that instead of making three-hundred Keys, we mix the Fishman Island to the Dressrosa Arc together, as it makes no sense considering Luffy showed his full strength.

 

[Antvasima]

That seems sensible. He should not have turned significantly stronger for the Dressrosa arc.

 

[Davy0]

I think he may have gotten stronger, we just didn't know his limits, most battles he was goofing off (Zoro yelled at him to get more serious about fighting in the new world due to being caught off-guard too much in Punk Hazard so there's a hint). And Luffy took on Hody almost effortlessly, with a few surprises not being that much of a problem for him to handle. Caesar was strong due to hax, but Luffy took that fight handily too. Dressrosa was his most serious battle, as Doflamingo was a far more dangerous opponent than either of them.

 

[Antvasima]

I agree.

 

[Davy0]

Let's see if anyone else agrees, and if they do, get someone (or me, or whoever) to change it. But we don't need so many keys for him now that we know his true strength.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay.

 

[Nibbler3100]

Out of curiousity why do we even use arcs for his page in the first place? I noticed on the other characters pages like Naruto, Ichigo & Natsu they all use different forms why can't we do that with Luffy like Pre-Timeskip: Base, 2nd, 3rd, Post-Timeskip: Base, 2nd, 3rd, 4th Gear. This may have been covered previously but I apologize I'm new it just makes more sense it's hard to tell how much damage a strike would do in say Gear 2nd Currently with this system, it only maxes out at a full on Elephant Bazooka via the Pica calc.

 

[Kambetal1]

Shouldn't base Luffy be small island+ level with blunt force, due to tanking Fierce Tiger from Fujitora?