Please Remove Reality-Fiction Interaction

[Karter406]

You know how no "Then the characters went to the real world" scene in fiction ever changed something in reality? That's because these scenes come with their own fictional copy of reality.

A character whose fourth-wall breaking is limited to cracking dated jokes about real-world celebrities will have trouble beating someone who can canonically leave his story's universe and threaten the author into making him win. However, in a VS Battle, he can't do that. He can't access our reality, erase that fictional character's fiction, paint bigger muscles on himself, or anything else.

But if character number three can paint bigger muscles on himself to boost his strength or whatever while in his fictional world? Then they're canonical reality-warping abilities this character has, and he could defeat both of the theoretical characters I mentioned.

A character's ability to personally manipulate his or her own fictional existance is a canonical ability that character has, but a 3-A who can make himself a Tier Zero will lose to someone who's already a Tier Zero. This is far more useful than the "ability to go to the real world", which is meaningless when discussing works of fiction with multiple real worlds.

The Zapper in Duck Hunt Duo, for example... What even is this?

 

[Sera_EX]

As the result of this thread, I suggest we finish discussing this as it was apparently forgotten or swept under the radar only to resurface and cause more issues.

 

[Antvasima]

I thought that we were done here. What still needs to be discussed?

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

We need to do some small changes still.

 

[Pritti]

Wait, were the argeed upon changes not made?

 

[Sera_EX]

The page looks nearly identical to the way it did before.

 

[Antvasima]

I thought that we removed the parts that you disagreed with.

 

[Sera_EX]

The only part removed was this:

Our real world can logically never truly intersect with fictional worlds. The fact that people have created a fiction in our view just means that they have created, for example, words and pictures. The authors have not created any new realities, they have not created intelligent and spiritual beings. They have just created stories within books, comics, games, TV, movies, or animation. We compare the fictional worlds from their points of view. And to them our world does not exist in any sense. Author avatars, fourth walls, and any similar silliness are just part of the same fiction and nothing more. It is not our world, and it is not us. The intermingling of reality and fiction is generally pure nonsense, as is automatically placing the former in a higher tier of power through "real humans solo fiction" discussions.

However the page still scoffs at metafiction in general, using a very biased argument:

"Firstly, no matter what the author's intentions are, fiction and reality can never fully interact. The real world, and real people can be simulated within fiction, but they will still be fictional representations and characters. As such, no fictional character can be responsible for the creation of "The real world"."

"Secondly, Author Avatars are not inherently bad, as some fictions use them in meaningful and relevant manners."

Please tell me what is the purpose of this approach? Pritti's original proposal debunked 90% of the page in the OP alone. No fiction anywhere has ever claimed reality and fiction can truly interact or that a fictional character created the real world. Ever.

 

[Pritti]

Yep. She's right. There is still no evidence of these fictional verses that claim to have characters that created the real world, except Suggsverse and Penultimate Pataverse, the former which isn't even allowed here and the latter which is completely irrelevant.

 

[Antvasima]

As far as I remember, it was mainly added due to that the "Omniverse" argument used to be prevalent in fan circles at the time, but I am open for a rewrite. I don't think that the third bolded phrase causes any harm though.

 

[Antvasima]

That said, I personally usually find metafiction taken to extreme degrees very pretentious, and if it involves all-powerful self-insert characters, it is extremely arrogant and deluded on top, but I agree that we should try to remain neutral.

 

[Pritti]

Define "taken to extreme degrees"? You've been around far longer than I have so you've debated against all kinds of people, but other than those above listed examples I gave I never read, watched, or played a piece of media that takes it that far. Only Suggs has characters that claim to be the author, editor, and publisher of all fiction and Penultimate Pataverse is just a wiki-based copy of that with the same abysmal ideas.

 

[Sera_EX]

Not seeing how being the god of your own fiction is arrogant. It doesn't even qualify as a god complex.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

It's not arrogant, it's a metaphor. And both Sewa and Pritti are 100% correct.

 

[Sera_EX]

At any rate, I don't intend or want this to get into that kind of debate, I'll just leave this be for now, there's too much to do at the moment.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, I personally usually find metafiction that goes too indepth with the angle as self-indulgent and pretentious rather than entertaining (I have no wish to pretend that I am communicating with the characters), and that all-powerful self-insert characters coming from regular 10-B human beings give an even more extremely narcissistic power-tripping delusions of grandeur impression (It is no coincidence that several prominent comicbook authors refer to themselves as literal magicians), but I am not forcing anybody to agree with me. I respectfully ask that you do not try to force me to agree with you in this respect either, as it would waste all of our time and energy for no gain.

Let's focus on what you wish to modify in practice instead. As usual, use a scalpel rather than a sledgehammer.

 

[Pritti]

To be fair, one could find the idea of even having a fictional character be "omnipotent" is arrogant, delusional, and pretentious. However we must interpret things from a NPOV. So yes, let's please move on from that bit.

 

[Sera_EX]

It seems unnecessary now that I think about it. I won't keep delving into a subject matter that no one cares about. To be fair if no one else has a problem with the page as it is now then I won't try to force revisions. It's not good practice. After all, as I said, there's more important matters that are actually more concerning than this that need addressing.

 

[Pritti]

I can dance to that.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay.

 

[Antvasima]

This topic has been finished. Please do not derail. You can start your own thread instead.