Paramount Shadow Revision

[LordTracer]

I brought this up in the discussion thread and nobody gave me a proper answer, so now that it’s been added to the profile anyway, it’s CRT time.

Paramount Shadow has this line in his Attack Potency justification:

higher with Emotional Empowerment (Shadow surged with energy upon thinking back to the time of Maria's death)

Despite having this line, Shadow’s feat of charging the Eclipse Cannon, which happened immediately after the scene that the above justification is describing, is scaled to his base stats.

The way I see it, and with how the profile has things laid out, Shadow charging the Eclipse Cannon should scale to his emotional empowerment, while his base should be scaled to the next best thing, which is this black hole feat that Shadow performed in a relatively calm state. This would then scale to Movie 2 & Onward Sonic and Knuckles, who downscale from base Shadow, and Eggman Emerald, who upscales from Sonic and Knuckles.

To summarize, Shadow charging the Eclipse Cannon should be scaled to his emotional empowerment, not his base stats. His base should be scaled to the black hole feat, which then scales to Sonic, Knuckles and Emerald Robotnik.

If this revision passes, Shadow’s stats would look like this:

High 6-A, up to Low 5-B with Emotional Empowerment, higher without Limiter Rings

Sonic and Knuckles would be At most High 6-A while Robotnik can be solid High 6-A.

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Yeah, fully agreed. At least until I see a proper reasoning for the current situation.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Agreed!

 

[ShakeResounding]

I'm actually in full agreement with this. I don't participate or follow the movie general but had I noticed I would've agreed with you. It felt a bit dubious when I was editing some pages to apply the CRT.

A few things though.

Sonic and Knuckles would be At most High 6-A while Robotnik can be solid High 6-A.

I think Sonic specifically should have "At most High 6-A, possibly Low 5-B with Emotional Enpowerment" due to the director's statements regarding Sonic being in the same league of power as Shadow, as well as the Chaos Emeralds seemingly boosting them an equal amount (since afaik the Movie Emeralds themselves don't have a varying level of Empowerment like in the games), making it a strong case that Sonic could wield similar power when sufficiently emotional as well.

I think Knuckles could be scale via "possibly Low 5-B with the Flames of Disaster" depending upon the context of him breaking through a forcefield to kill Sonic, but that's a more minor note since I haven't watched the show.

 

[Theuser789]

Wasn't it agreed in the previous thread to NOT add "higher" with emotional empowerment? The Eclipse Cannon should scale to Base Shadow.

 

[Dalesean027]

Wasn't it agreed in the previous thread to NOT add "higher" with emotional empowerment? The Eclipse Cannon should scale to Base Shadow.

I know I rejected outright twice so I'm not sure how it got added but I mean if it's gonna be like that anyways then I'd say this works

 

[LordTracer]

I think Sonic specifically should have "At most High 6-A, possibly Low 5-B with Emotional Enpowerment" due to the director's statements regarding Sonic being in the same league of power as Shadow,

If you can find that statement, I don’t mind giving Sonic like a ‘far higher, possibly up to Low 5-B with Emotional Empowerment’ rating. Knuckles scaling I’m not too sure about, as I haven’t watched the show yet either.

 

[ShakeResounding]

Wasn't it agreed in the previous thread to NOT add "higher" with emotional empowerment? The Eclipse Cannon should scale to Base Shadow.

Really? If so then somebody fudged up.

Do you have the statement I was referencing for @LordTracer regarding Sonic and Shadow being in the same ballpark?

 

[That_moron2]

, possibly up to Low 5-B with Emotional Empowerment’ rating. Knuckles scaling I’m not too sure about, as I haven’t watched the show yet either.

Knuckles seemed pretty confident he could fight Sonic while he was at his angriest, and in the novel was willing to fight Shadow a second time

 

[1000TonsofFun]

I think that the emotional empowerment thing just needs to be removed is all. Sonic and Knuckles would still be “at most Low 5-B”. Especially since Sonic and Shadow weren’t too far apart in the Super fight, and they theoretically should have been amped by the same amount.

 

[Theuser789]

Really? If so then somebody fudged up.

Do you have the statement I was referencing for @LordTracer regarding Sonic and Shadow being in the same ballpark?

I only have the deleted scene I posted in the last thread and Tyson Hesse's comments, also posted in the last thread.

Which is why I don't understand why this thread is happening when it was agreed Sonic and Shadow are equals that they scale to the Eclipse Cannon in base.

 

[Dalesean027]

Bump

 

[LordTracer]

I see that @Maverick_Zero_X is a supporter of the verse, could you give your thoughts and help resolve this?

 

[Shadowslaya!]

I agree.

But honestly they should have a 5B rating too.

 

[Dalesean027]

I agree.

But honestly they should have a 5B rating too.

Thats the Super Form rating?

 

[Dalesean027]

bump

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

i agree with the new tier

 

[GlaceonGamez471]

Bump

 

[GodEarh206]

So, will the base shadow be High 6-A or Low 5-B? I mean, physically, because I don't see clearly why Shadow base is at Low 5-B

 

[LordTracer]

I’m willing to go ahead and apply this, if there isn’t going to be any more input.

 

[Dalesean027]

Well there are things that haven't been addressed yet that could use an opinion by you

I'll comment later when I have time

 

[Dalesean027]

I’m willing to go ahead and apply this, if there isn’t going to be any more input.

Sorry for the late response

Sonic the Hedgehog Film Series Discussion Thread

Eggman was sent in the future by the explosion. BAM. Silver set up 👀

vsbattles.com

We have this WoG post for sonic and shadow being comparable as well as this scene (albiet a deleted scene) saying that they are near equals, I believe there is more but for right now this is what I could find off hand but I think there's more

Basically this proposal below should still be valid as well

I'm actually in full agreement with this. I don't participate or follow the movie general but had I noticed I would've agreed with you. It felt a bit dubious when I was editing some pages to apply the CRT.

A few things though.

I think Sonic specifically should have "At most High 6-A, possibly Low 5-B with Emotional Enpowerment" due to the director's statements regarding Sonic being in the same league of power as Shadow, as well as the Chaos Emeralds seemingly boosting them an equal amount (since afaik the Movie Emeralds themselves don't have a varying level of Empowerment like in the games), making it a strong case that Sonic could wield similar power when sufficiently emotional as well.

I think Knuckles could be scale via "possibly Low 5-B with the Flames of Disaster" depending upon the context of him breaking through a forcefield to kill Sonic, but that's a more minor note since I haven't watched the show.

 

[LordTracer]

Basically this proposal below should still be valid as well

I mean, I already said that I’d be fine with that proposal as long as the WoG statement was found. Still haven’t seen Knuckles, so I still can’t say anything about his scaling, but I’m fine with Sonic scaling.

 

[Ghengiroo115]

It’s been almost 2 months but I don’t believe that’s enough to make this a necro, so bump

 

[Apex_Predator_GX]

Knuckles seemed pretty confident he could fight Sonic while he was at his angriest, and in the novel was willing to fight Shadow a second time

Agree.

 

[LordTracer]

Yeah, I fully forgot about this thread, but I don’t think it’s in necro range just yet

To recap, on top of what’s in the OP, Sonic also gets ‘up to Low 5-B via Emotional Empowerment’ since he’s stated to be relative to Shadow, and Knuckles probably gets it as well (someone else will have to come up with the justification there, since I still haven’t seen his series).

@Dalesean027

 

[ShakeResounding]

Most threads seem to move at a snail's pace nowadays tbh

 

[Lonkitt]

Yeah, this makes sense. I agree : )

 

[Snek]

Interesting although I want to ask why is Shadow Low 5-B at all when the Eclipse Canon feat is just kind of strange? All the energy he provided it was 5-B which in any other context would make base Shadow 5-B but then later in the film it took Super Sonic and Super Shadow together to hold back the canon so base Shadow not fully scaling to it I understand. However why Low 5-B since I know he's scaled to 600 times weaker because the canon took 10 minutes to absorb his energy although how does that relate to Shadow at all and not just to the Eclipse Canons energy intake?

Anyways though, that said, I agree with Knuckles, Sonic and Robotnik being downgraded to High 6-A regardless of Shadow's rating which is admittedly a different topic. I got a little ahead of myself there but still it would be nice to know why base Shadow is Low 5-B.

 

[Dalesean027]

Interesting although I want to ask why is Shadow Low 5-B at all when the Eclipse Canon feat is just kind of strange? All the energy he provided it was 5-B which in any other context would make base Shadow 5-B but then later in the film it took Super Sonic and Super Shadow together to hold back the canon so base Shadow not fully scaling to it I understand. However why Low 5-B since I know he's scaled to 600 times weaker because the canon took 10 minutes to absorb his energy although how does that relate to Shadow at all and not just to the Eclipse Canons energy intake?

The only other option be attempting to calculate shadows work through movement and dividing by the steps he took to generate the energy which is a whole mess itself but no matter how it goes he didn't provide the 5-B energy all at once so you will have to take that into account to get low 5-B for base regardless in some way or another

Yeah, I fully forgot about this thread, but I don’t think it’s in necro range just yet

To recap, on top of what’s in the OP, Sonic also gets ‘up to Low 5-B via Emotional Empowerment’ since he’s stated to be relative to Shadow, and Knuckles probably gets it as well (someone else will have to come up with the justification there, since I still haven’t seen his series).

@Dalesean027

Sure this works

 

[LordTracer]

Alright, I’ve applied the changes. I gave Knuckles a very basic Low 5-B justification that someone else can expand if they want.

I’ll close the thread now.