Overlord’s new abilities

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Firstly, Overlord showed Resistance to Extreme Cold and Hot temperatures here and here. Also it grants Resistance to Petrification. There is also evidence for Overlord’s Power Nullification via creating Stone Army, and the Anti-Golden armors from S3 being used by Stone Warriors (so logically Overlord created those Anti-Golden armors), and these armors were both stated and shown to have ability to Nullify Golden Power. Also I believe that Golden Master’s and Digiverse Overlord’s Lifting Strength can be upgraded via him turning the Entire New Ninjago City and Zane hinting Golden Master being able to do same thing, although I don’t know where it scales (should it be calced? If yes, can someone help?). Also, Golden Master was Overlord’s true form, unlike Garmadon (Dragon Form) and Digiverse, who were just vessels, which means that Zane destroying him and Overlord still coming back grants him High-Godly Regeneration.

EDIT: Also Golden Master must have Abstract Existence Type 1 via being Overlord’s free form that I had already showed. All of Overlord form also must have Acausality Type 4 via it being confirmed that Cloud Kingdom has no control over the Overlord (more than once btw).

Agree: @Lloydblitzed @Scumbag_Steve @DarkDragonMedeus
Disagree: @Mr._Bambu
Neutral:

 

[Lloydblitzed]

Firstly, Overlord showed Resistance to Extreme Cold and Hot temperatures here and here. Also it grants Resistance to Petrification. There is also evidence for Overlord’s Power Nullification via creating Stone Army, and the Anti-Golden armors from S3 being used by Stone Warriors (so logically Overlord created those Anti-Golden armors), and these armors were both stated and shown to have ability to Nullify Golden Power. Also I believe that Golden Master’s and Digiverse Overlord’s Lifting Strength can be upgraded via him turning the Entire New Ninjago City and Zane hinting Golden Master being able to do same thing, although I don’t know where it scales (should it be calced? If yes, can someone help?). Also, Golden Master was Overlord’s true form, unlike Garmadon (Dragon Form) and Digiverse, who were just vessels, which means that Zane destroying him and Overlord still coming back grants him High-Godly Regeneration.

EDIT: Also Golden Master must have Abstract Existence Type 1 via being Overlord’s free form that I had already showed. All of Overlord form also must have Acausality Type 4 via it being confirmed that Cloud Kingdom has no control over the Overlord (more than once btw).

Agree:
Disagree:
Neutral:

Simple, I agree

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Bump

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Bump

 

[Overlord_Darkness]

when my CRT will be finished, I'll take an input here and express what I think

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Bump

 

[Scumbag_Steve]

Simple enough
Agree

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Bump

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Looks alright for now.

 

[Overlord_Darkness]

Despite I'm disagree with Golden Master from Season 3 being Overlord's true form (I'm considering this body as possessed Golden Armor because of this [See media above]), High-Godly regen seems reasonable considering that Golden Power is able to changing laws in the Realms (like setting different time axis) and directly attack the Overlord's spirit and he returned three times in a row after being defeated by it, so I agree

 

[Mr. Bambu]

it's always the simple resistances first followed by the most overpowered interpretations of any ability one can slip in, isn't it

Regarding heat/petrification, I don't know if I can agree. These abilities seem to affect the Overlord fine, and it may not even be petrification- it appears (correct me if I'm wrong) that he is already made of stone, and rather that the heat of the dragon's breath temporarily hardened him such that he couldn't move? I'll await a response, but this technicality would surely eliminate petrification from the equation. I may lean in favor of temperature resistance, acknowledging that these attacks did visibly have an affect on him but he manages to endure. The ice breath isn't really "extreme cold" unless we have a stated temperature for it, but fire is pretty decent.

I would note that we do not, as a policy, automatically assume that the creator of an item inherits the abilities of that item.

Also, Golden Master was Overlord’s true form, unlike Garmadon (Dragon Form) and Digiverse, who were just vessels, which means that Zane destroying him and Overlord still coming back grants him High-Godly Regeneration

...Why?

Regarding your two Twitter screenshots: firstly, it is preferable to link directly to them, and secondly, neither are firm in their statements. We already are slow to take Word of God as gospel regarding verses, given the non-concrete verbiage used here, I would disagree.

To lighten the mood of things I'm rejecting here, I think the LS proposal could be good, but currently lacks a calc, so.

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

it's always the simple resistances first followed by the most overpowered interpretations of any ability one can slip in, isn't it

Regarding heat/petrification, I don't know if I can agree. These abilities seem to affect the Overlord fine, and it may not even be petrification- it appears (correct me if I'm wrong) that he is already made of stone, and rather that the heat of the dragon's breath temporarily hardened him such that he couldn't move? I'll await a response, but this technicality would surely eliminate petrification from the equation. I may lean in favor of temperature resistance, acknowledging that these attacks did visibly have an affect on him but he manages to endure. The ice breath isn't really "extreme cold" unless we have a stated temperature for it, but fire is pretty decent.

I would note that we do not, as a policy, automatically assume that the creator of an item inherits the abilities of that item.


...Why?

Regarding your two Twitter screenshots: firstly, it is preferable to link directly to them, and secondly, neither are firm in their statements. We already are slow to take Word of God as gospel regarding verses, given the non-concrete verbiage used here, I would disagree.

To lighten the mood of things I'm rejecting here, I think the LS proposal could be good, but currently lacks a calc, so.

We don’t really know if he is made out of stones. He used the Crystals to create his Centaur form, and there is no confirmation that it is rocks. Also, it is not the first time that Fire is used to petrify others, who are clearly not made out of stones, such as Firstborn petrifying Iron Baron. The Ice Breath should “scale” to Fire Breath, because this Dragon came from Ninjas’ power and when Kai and Zane used their power together, it created water (twice), and if Ice was not relative to Fire in temperature (just one is cold, and second is heat), Fire would just overpower it.

What does “creator of an item does not inherit the abilities of that item” have to do with this case tho?

Because Golden Master is his REAL form, not a shell unlike Dragon Form or Digiverse form. He is pure concept of Evil in the reality at that point, so complete destruction of him should’ve destroyed his concept as well, but yet he still came back.

Here are the links: 1st and 2nd. Also I am not sure if I understood you correctly: WoG may not be used on this wiki anymore? Also just to note, it is very logical for Overlord not being controlled, because if he was, it would make huge plot holes such as “why Cloud Monks summon him back?”, etc.

Okay, I’ll ask someone to help with calc later.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

What does “creator of an item does not inherit the abilities of that item” have to do with this case tho?

You mentioned the Overlord creating armors that have nullifying abilities, and seem to imply that these powers ought to be held by the Overlord himself.

Because Golden Master is his REAL form, not a shell unlike Dragon Form or Digiverse form. He is pure concept of Evil in the reality at that point, so complete destruction of him should’ve destroyed his concept as well, but yet he still came back.

Even if he is a conceptual being, you would need to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that his concept was destroyed. This "true form" stuff is fine and all I suppose, but simply being destroyed is not the same as the concept of the Darkness being destroyed. It would require significant evidence to prove that the concept as a whole was wiped out, more than his representation/visage/what have you being destroyed.

Here are the links: 1st and 2nd. Also I am not sure if I understood you correctly: WoG may not be used on this wiki anymore? Also just to note, it is very logical for Overlord not being controlled, because if he was, it would make huge plot holes such as “why Cloud Monks summon him back?”, etc.

WoG is considered a lower form of evidence compared to something actually in the media itself- we have countless historical precedents set regarding Death of the Author. It being logical is one thing- it being certain is another.

 

[Overlord_Darkness]

You mentioned the Overlord creating armors that have nullifying abilities, and seem to imply that these powers ought to be held by the Overlord himself.

Even if he is a conceptual being, you would need to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that his concept was destroyed. This "true form" stuff is fine and all I suppose, but simply being destroyed is not the same as the concept of the Darkness being destroyed. It would require significant evidence to prove that the concept as a whole was wiped out, more than his representation/visage/what have you being destroyed.

WoG is considered a lower form of evidence compared to something actually in the media itself- we have countless historical precedents set regarding Death of the Author. It being logical is one thing- it being certain is another.

I also want to ask. If character existed before the World (which in the verse means all of existence, 'cause before the Creation [which appeared in the First Realm] there were nothing that can be considered as Light), does it grants Immortality type 5?

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

You mentioned the Overlord creating armors that have nullifying abilities, and seem to imply that these powers ought to be held by the Overlord himself.

Even if he is a conceptual being, you would need to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that his concept was destroyed. This "true form" stuff is fine and all I suppose, but simply being destroyed is not the same as the concept of the Darkness being destroyed. It would require significant evidence to prove that the concept as a whole was wiped out, more than his representation/visage/what have you being destroyed.

WoG is considered a lower form of evidence compared to something actually in the media itself- we have countless historical precedents set regarding Death of the Author. It being logical is one thing- it being certain is another.

First of all, what is your opinion on Resistances? You didn’t address them, so I don’t know if I changed your mind or not regarding them.

Armors have passive Power Nullification, meanwhile Overlord can create them, so although not passive, he still has it for his Dragon Form.

“simply being destroyed is not the same as the Concept of the Darkness being destroyed” This would be true if Golden Master was just another vessel like Dragon Form, but this is not the case. Since it is his true free form, he IS the concept of Evil in the flesh, so the destruction of him equals destruction of the concept because he IS the concept as the Golden Master. Overlord in his true form is not just a “representation”, he is the Evil itself. (Which is why I also proposed GM having Abstract Existence type 1)

From what I know, WoG cannot be used only if it contradicts the series, and since the series logically support WoG statement, it should work. Bill Cipher, for example, got Acausality via Journal 3 and Reddit “Ask anything” statements, not the show itself.

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Also to back up “extreme heat”, it was also stated by WoG that Kai could’ve been able to use fire under the water if he wanted, so this makes “extreme heat and cold” more reasonable.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

First of all, what is your opinion on Resistances? You didn’t address them, so I don’t know if I changed your mind or not regarding them.

Neutral, you're arguing he's not rock but he really looks like rock, and you provided some evidence that he was. Like I said, I can see some level of resistance to heat/cold, although you use the word "extreme" in the OP whereas I wouldn't describe this as such.

Armors have passive Power Nullification, meanwhile Overlord can create them, so although not passive, he still has it for his Dragon Form.

Does he wear the armor?

“simply being destroyed is not the same as the Concept of the Darkness being destroyed” This would be true if Golden Master was just another vessel like Dragon Form, but this is not the case. Since it is his true free form, he IS the concept of Evil in the flesh, so the destruction of him equals destruction of the concept because he IS the concept as the Golden Master. Overlord in his true form is not just a “representation”, he is the Evil itself. (Which is why I also proposed GM having Abstract Existence type 1)

The big one. Yes, to an extent I believe you, but we would need more- explicit evidence that the concept itself was destroyed. Showing the body of the creature being destroyed or whatever, is not sufficient to show that what may be a perhaps unseen element of the creature- that is, the concept- was also destroyed. One would need to see that, for example, Darkness no longer exists in the world during the time of the creature's death. This is what is required.

From what I know, WoG cannot be used only if it contradicts the series, and since the series logically support WoG statement, it should work. Bill Cipher, for example, got Acausality via Journal 3 and Reddit “Ask anything” statements, not the show itself.

It might, if the statements were more certain. These aren't. The creator is saying "hm, maybe", essentially.

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Neutral, you're arguing he's not rock but he really looks like rock, and you provided some evidence that he was. Like I said, I can see some level of resistance to heat/cold, although you use the word "extreme" in the OP whereas I wouldn't describe this as such.


Does he wear the armor?


The big one. Yes, to an extent I believe you, but we would need more- explicit evidence that the concept itself was destroyed. Showing the body of the creature being destroyed or whatever, is not sufficient to show that what may be a perhaps unseen element of the creature- that is, the concept- was also destroyed. One would need to see that, for example, Darkness no longer exists in the world during the time of the creature's death. This is what is required.


It might, if the statements were more certain. These aren't. The creator is saying "hm, maybe", essentially.

I showed that he made out of Crystals and not rocks, and that Fire can petrify beings who are clearly not a rock though? And also Fire being capable to exist under the ocean. But okay I guess.

No, but he is capable of creating it, although we do not know how fast. May be I can add Power Null via Preparation to his Dragon Form then?

If Overlord is the evil in his true form and got destroyed, why wouldn’t it mean that it is gone? It doesn’t make sense to me. Like, Golden Master = concept of Evil in its true form, so destroying him would be equivalent to destruction of Evil as well, because he literally is Evilness? Your words would make sense if I was showing Dragon Forms or Crystal King who are just shells, but you already said that you believed me about true form (to extent).

You would be right, but under the exact same tweet, other people ask if this is the case with Wu and Garmadon, and Tommy says “maybe, but not sure, we haven’t worked out that yet”. This means that (at least in this context) he would specify if there is a probability of Overlord being uncontrolled by Cloud Kingdom not being the case, just like he did with Wu and Garmadon. Also he uses phrase “I doubt it” as “no” very often. And again, putting this with the fact that it is logical within the show as a back-up, Acausality Type 4 is pretty clear.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Crystals are literally still essentially rocks- it's all minerals Even normal fire can exist under the correct conditions (normally this would require forcing those conditions)- this is not necessarily a measure of unearthly heat. Also, again, your WoG is using stuff like "probably", which is not great

This is the exact reason I brought up our rules about the creators of items not being given the abilities of the things they create.

Okay. Bear with me. Darkness, as a concept, is wide-reaching in the world of Ninjago, yes? It is likely in places that this representation of the Overlord is not. Even though the two are the same essential thing, showing a destroyed representation of the Darkness does not necessarily mean all of him was actually destroyed- that being the fundamental concept he is a representation of (Darkness). If he was fully destroyed, then Darkness was too- I want to see proof of this, rather than just the image used to represent him being destroyed, before accepting this element of the CRT.

"Maybe" "probably" this guy has never said anything concrete in any of the scans you're offering me, he talks like I do when I'm the DM trying to share secrets but not tell everything. So I remain against.

 

[Overlord_Darkness]

Okay. Bear with me. Darkness, as a concept, is wide-reaching in the world of Ninjago, yes? It is likely in places that this representation of the Overlord is not. Even though the two are the same essential thing, showing a destroyed representation of the Darkness does not necessarily mean all of him was actually destroyed- that being the fundamental concept he is a representation of (Darkness). If he was fully destroyed, then Darkness was too- I want to see proof of this, rather than just the image used to represent him being destroyed, before accepting this element of the CRT.

"...Darkness feeds on Creation. It need life to make evil."

"The Overlord cannot be destroyed. Not really. He is the embodiment of evil. He is fed by hatred, anger and conflict..."

"... and the Overlord represents the Darkness."

Destroying the Overlord seems like destroying the concept of Darkness itself.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

This isn't really what I'm asking, it just clarifies that he does indeed represent Darkness. I appreciate that, but what I'm asking for is something stating that when he was destroyed, there was no Darkness- because he is a representation of his greater whole, I'm looking for evidence that when they destroyed that representation, the greater whole was completely erased. This is necessary to give High-Godly.

 

[Overlord_Darkness]

This isn't really what I'm asking, it just clarifies that he does indeed represent Darkness. I appreciate that, but what I'm asking for is something stating that when he was destroyed, there was no Darkness- because he is a representation of his greater whole, I'm looking for evidence that when they destroyed that representation, the greater whole was completely erased. This is necessary to give High-Godly.

When the Overlord is defeated, it seems like the world itself are purging from Darkness.



EDIT: I tried to coppie URL of second video with time, but it seems buggy. 17:34 is a timecode.

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Crystals are literally still essentially rocks- it's all minerals Even normal fire can exist under the correct conditions (normally this would require forcing those conditions)- this is not necessarily a measure of unearthly heat. Also, again, your WoG is using stuff like "probably", which is not great

This is the exact reason I brought up our rules about the creators of items not being given the abilities of the things they create.

Okay. Bear with me. Darkness, as a concept, is wide-reaching in the world of Ninjago, yes? It is likely in places that this representation of the Overlord is not. Even though the two are the same essential thing, showing a destroyed representation of the Darkness does not necessarily mean all of him was actually destroyed- that being the fundamental concept he is a representation of (Darkness). If he was fully destroyed, then Darkness was too- I want to see proof of this, rather than just the image used to represent him being destroyed, before accepting this element of the CRT.

"Maybe" "probably" this guy has never said anything concrete in any of the scans you're offering me, he talks like I do when I'm the DM trying to share secrets but not tell everything. So I remain against.

Either way I showed how Fire already petrified another being who is clearly not made out of stones or minerals, which proves it is strong enough. So this shows that Fire already can get to those temperatures.

Okay, but it can still be grant via Preparation to his Dragon Form, no?

You need a proof that Zane actually destroyed Golden Master? It is both shown in the scene itself and stated in the official LEGO description. (Also in case you are still in doubt of Golden Master being his real form: Overlord complains about “pathetic mortal bodies” and wants the real one, which further backs up what I showed in the OP). So the logic is: Golden Master = True Form of Overlord = the concept of Darkness itself in flesh. Destruction of Golden Master = destruction of the concept of Darkness. Yet Overlord still comes back as a Crystal King.

I think you did not understand what I said. If he says “maybe” in a sense that he is not sure, he specifies it. But with the Overlord he didn’t. He just gave the tone with the Overlord, yet with Wu and Garmadon he straight up said “we did not work that out yet”, implying they did work out with the Overlord.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Your other piece of evidence is visibly not stone, it's metal that melted over the guy. He's even still making noises underneath it.

Does his dragon form wear the armor?

No, I need proof that this representation being destroyed is equivalent to the greater whole- the Darkness in its entirety- being destroyed. I'm not doubting the Golden Master being the "true form" or whatever.

I don't think that implies that strongly, really.

 

[Overlord_Darkness]

No, I need proof that this representation being destroyed is equivalent to the greater whole- the Darkness in its entirety- being destroyed. I'm not doubting the Golden Master being the "true form" or whatever.

What do you think about two clips that I've sent?

 

[Overlord_Darkness]

No, I need proof that this representation being destroyed is equivalent to the greater whole- the Darkness in its entirety- being destroyed

Also I want to add that Overlord is not representation of the greater whole - he is the greater whole, since all of the Darkness and Evil came from him.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I feel as though we have begun to unnecessarily go in circles.

There has been no good evidence to suggest Darkness itself was destroyed. What evidence even begins to imply it never once confirms it or states it plainly, thus leaving the ability of High-Godly to be more or less entirely speculation on the part of this thread. I will firmly reject this ability at this time.

 

[Lloydblitzed]

Your other piece of evidence is visibly not stone, it's metal that melted over the guy. He's even still making noises underneath it.

Does his dragon form wear the armor?

No, I need proof that this representation being destroyed is equivalent to the greater whole- the Darkness in its entirety- being destroyed. I'm not doubting the Golden Master being the "true form" or whatever.

I don't think that implies that strongly, really.

Its implied here that getting rid of Overlord (referred as "O" here) would upset the Balance too much

What does the Balance need in order for Ninjago to remain balanced? Overlord and FSM. What will happen without FSM or Overlord? Bye Bye Realms

Also WOG implied here he is evil itself. Get rid of him = get rid of evil

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Your other piece of evidence is visibly not stone, it's metal that melted over the guy. He's even still making noises underneath it.

Does his dragon form wear the armor?

No, I need proof that this representation being destroyed is equivalent to the greater whole- the Darkness in its entirety- being destroyed. I'm not doubting the Golden Master being the "true form" or whatever.

I don't think that implies that strongly, really.

Fair enough. Can we just remove the “extreme” part then?

No, but he is capable of creating it with Preparation.

He IS the Evil in its entirety though? He was stated to be the source of it, to be the evil itself, and the embodiment of evil. Everything leads to that.

Altogether should work given that he confirms it second time. But ah your opinion.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I've given my position on the High-Godly regen, the foundation for it relies on far too many assumptions and generous interpretations of half-assed replies from a creator. It's rejected.

Fair enough. Can we just remove the “extreme” part then?

No petrification, and yeh, I'm fine with temperature resistance.

No, but he is capable of creating it with Preparation.

Dude's never worn it, we don't allow for that. No dice.

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

I've given my position on the High-Godly regen, the foundation for it relies on far too many assumptions and generous interpretations of half-assed replies from a creator. It's rejected.


No petrification, and yeh, I'm fine with temperature resistance.


Dude's never worn it, we don't allow for that. No dice.

I think that you don’t understand that Overlord is evil itself and the source of it (confirmed here too), not “representation of the greater evil”. Hence destroying Overlord in his true form would destroy the evil too. But Overlord still came back. How is this not High-Godly Regeneration?

Also I found some things that can justify “extreme” part. (No petrification is fine) Kai was capable of melting the Golden Armor into Golden Weapons. The names pretty much imply that it is made out of gold, and to melt gold you need 1064.18 Calvins. If that’s still not convincing, then there is also a fact that Firstborn’s fire melted Dragon Armor + the sword, which is implied to be made out of gold by WoG.

So you are saying that given time, Overlord would not be able to create armor with Power Null and use it?

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I think that you don't understand what I understand, being perfectly honest, because we've been discussing the same thing over and over. Yeah. Overlord is evil. Literally equatable. You haven't once actually given me the evidence I want on the follow-up stuff, though, so I reject it. I understand the funny toy TV show fine.

Kelvin, and that's not really extreme. Yellow-orange fire averages over that heat. That's still just fire temperature. It's a resistance feat, I don't know why we need to harp on the word "extreme".

I'm saying it's against our standards to give them equipment they've never used themselves. You may reword that and reshape it to seem as silly as you like, if that's your poison.

Ciao.

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

I think that you don't understand what I understand, being perfectly honest, because we've been discussing the same thing over and over. Yeah. Overlord is evil. Literally equatable. You haven't once actually given me the evidence I want on the follow-up stuff, though, so I reject it. I understand the funny toy TV show fine.

Kelvin, and that's not really extreme. Yellow-orange fire averages over that heat. That's still just fire temperature. It's a resistance feat, I don't know why we need to harp on the word "extreme".

I'm saying it's against our standards to give them equipment they've never used themselves. You may reword that and reshape it to seem as silly as you like, if that's your poison.

Ciao.

If you concede on that Overlord is Evil, then how destruction of Overlord doesn’t lead to destruction of Evil too?

I wanted to say Celsius, sorry. But okay, let’s just put temperature resistance then.

Okay.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

I don't think you've read a word I've written, because I've elaborated on this already. The entire time I've been here I've done little more than elaborate on it.

The big one. Yes, to an extent I believe you, but we would need more- explicit evidence that the concept itself was destroyed. Showing the body of the creature being destroyed or whatever, is not sufficient to show that what may be a perhaps unseen element of the creature- that is, the concept- was also destroyed. One would need to see that, for example, Darkness no longer exists in the world during the time of the creature's death. This is what is required.

Okay. Bear with me. Darkness, as a concept, is wide-reaching in the world of Ninjago, yes? It is likely in places that this representation of the Overlord is not. Even though the two are the same essential thing, showing a destroyed representation of the Darkness does not necessarily mean all of him was actually destroyed- that being the fundamental concept he is a representation of (Darkness). If he was fully destroyed, then Darkness was too- I want to see proof of this, rather than just the image used to represent him being destroyed, before accepting this element of the CRT.

Maybe you'll understand by way of example. D&D gods work much the same way- they are the concepts they represent. God of secrets dies, secrets no longer exist. God of magic dies, magic does not exist. There was an incident wherein the goddess of Magic, Mystra, was assassinated by another god, Cyric. However, magic remained existent, despite the same thing described above- magic disappearing with her full death- happening as well. This is because Mystra was killed, but not in her entirety- magic was horrifically damaged and Mystra herself shattered, but she was in some esoteric way alive.

I have been asking for evidence of Darkness being gone over, and over, and over again. It's a huge deal, the entire verse hinges on this, and yet you cannot summon to me an ounce of evidence that with the destruction of that physical manifestation, so too was darkness literally destroyed in its entirety. Not a shred of it. Instead, you insist upon the same point over, and over, and over again. I no longer have the patience to play ball. I see no reason to assume that he was literally entirely destroyed based on the evidence put before me and, quite frankly, too much of the evidence relies on "maybes" and "possiblies" and "probablies" from the show's writer anyhow.

As such, I reject this. Because I cannot accept it. There is no evidence.

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

I don't think you've read a word I've written, because I've elaborated on this already. The entire time I've been here I've done little more than elaborate on it.



Maybe you'll understand by way of example. D&D gods work much the same way- they are the concepts they represent. God of secrets dies, secrets no longer exist. God of magic dies, magic does not exist. There was an incident wherein the goddess of Magic, Mystra, was assassinated by another god, Cyric. However, magic remained existent, despite the same thing described above- magic disappearing with her full death- happening as well. This is because Mystra was killed, but not in her entirety- magic was horrifically damaged and Mystra herself shattered, but she was in some esoteric way alive.

I have been asking for evidence of Darkness being gone over, and over, and over again. It's a huge deal, the entire verse hinges on this, and yet you cannot summon to me an ounce of evidence that with the destruction of that physical manifestation, so too was darkness literally destroyed in its entirety. Not a shred of it. Instead, you insist upon the same point over, and over, and over again. I no longer have the patience to play ball. I see no reason to assume that he was literally entirely destroyed based on the evidence put before me and, quite frankly, too much of the evidence relies on "maybes" and "possiblies" and "probablies" from the show's writer anyhow.

As such, I reject this. Because I cannot accept it. There is no evidence.

Okay, understood

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

was asked to help evaluate Acausality type 4

I'm kinda out of the loop and lacking context but upon reading some profiles and seeing Golden Weapon grats Acausality because they are unaffected by any changes in time (Type not mentioned)
I want to ask for the scans for this since it has no reference + scans in the profiles where it was mentioned + other stuff like the degree of the time change hax/history changing hax

whether it is Acausality type 4 or not needs to be discussed because being immune to time changes can be either
Acausality Type 2 or Type 4 or simply Causality resistance.
so I need further context for it to be Aca type 4

 

[Overlord_Darkness]

I'm kinda out of the loop and lacking context but upon reading some profiles and seeing Golden Weapon grats Acausality because they are unaffected by any changes in time (Type not mentioned)
I want to ask for the scans for this since it has no reference + scans in the profiles where it was mentioned + other stuff like the degree of the time change hax/history changing hax

Golden Weapons, as I understood, have Acausality Type 1 because of Season 2 when Ninja traveled back in time and Megaweapon (which consists of 4 Golden Weapons) was able to coexist with original 4 Golden Weapons without any paradoxes

As for Acaus Type 4, it should be exclusively for the Overlord due to the fact that he is not only immune to temporal paradoxes, but also doesn't submit to fate manip from the monks of the Cloud Kingdom and is higher than fate

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

was asked to help evaluate Acausality type 4

I'm kinda out of the loop and lacking context but upon reading some profiles and seeing Golden Weapon grats Acausality because they are unaffected by any changes in time (Type not mentioned)

This is not why I am proposing Overlord Acausality Type 4 though. Also shouldn't Overlord have Acausality Type 1 via BDE type 1.
I propose Acausality Type 4 via what Overlord_Darkness said above. Here is also how Monks of Cloud Kingdom work btw.

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Bump

 

[TheGreatJedi13]

I don't believe it is sufficient for Type 4 for said reasoning


at least I can see it as a higher level or on the same level as golden weapons
The monks write fate as it happens and there isn't much causality involved only destiny and fate to even consider it Type 4

I'd go with Type 2 for Overlord if I'm being honest. unless there is a confirmation in the series that blatantly explain or say Fate and Causality are one of the same /sides of the same coin