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One Piece: Luffy Greater Accelerated Development

I'm not really sure about this one. Luffy laughs a lot as a character just generally and if this was truly in play, there should be more explicit call outs throughout the story if that was part of why he developed so rapidly.
 
I mean it makes sense. He went from getting mid-diffed by Hybrid Kaido to fighting on par and forcing him into Shuron Hakke just because he was 'having fun'. There's proof of it that Luffy got way stronger during the Kaido battle and the only difference that caused it was his enjoyment.
 
That is super incorrect, Luffy also got stronger from figuring out Advanced Conquer's Haki which was what allowed him to first really start going toe to toe with Hybrid Kaido. Then, after losing and getting a refill thanks to food, a newly reinvigorated Luffy kept going toe to toe with Kaido. Then Kaido got buffed through getting drunk, with Luffy on the backfoot, then Luffy lost. Nowhere in there is a noticeable buff to Luffy from just laughing. The only time we would really shown Luffy getting a buff from laughing would be after he enters Gear 5.

Going to have to go with a disagree for this for Base Luffy.
 
Duedate8898 said:
That is super incorrect, Luffy also got stronger from figuring out Advanced Conquer's Haki which was what allowed him to first really start going toe to toe with Hybrid Kaido. Then, after losing and getting a refill thanks to food, a newly reinvigorated Luffy kept going toe to toe with Kaido. Then Kaido got buffed through getting drunk, with Luffy on the backfoot, then Luffy lost. Nowhere in there is a noticeable buff to Luffy from just laughing. The only time we would really shown Luffy getting a buff from laughing would be after he enters Gear 5.

Going to have to go with a disagree for this for Base Luffy.
Click to expand...
You do realize he was laughing then he went from struggling to base w/ Ulti to base w/ Kaidou all without Advanced Conquerors right?
 
What? Luffy got shat on the only time he fought Kaido in base on the roof top pre-AC. And besides that Kaido dodged the only attack that Luffy threw out while in base. Luffy didn't struggle in base against Kaido, he got ****** and just loss.
 
Duedate8898 said:
What? Luffy got shat on the only time he fought Kaido in base on the roof top pre-AC. And besides that Kaido dodged the only attack that Luffy threw out while in base. Luffy didn't struggle in base against Kaido, he got ****** and just loss.
Click to expand...
https://cdn.****************.com/file/CDN-M-A-N/opc_1026_009.pnghttps://cdn.****************.com/file/CDN-M-A-N/op_1027_006.png

Didn't use infusion here and he was fine.

He even took attacks better without infusion.

Reread Luffy vs Kaidou, all of their fights. I didn't say "before he learned Advanced Hao", I said "without using Advanced Hao"
 
I actually responded to this bit, this is a newly reinvigorated Luffy who just got fed and even had a bit of break after learning AC. This is not at all enough support to act like Luffy is getting empowered just from laughing. Especially since Pre-AC Haki was soft-confirmed able to hurt Kaido with just Beyond Advanced Armament Haki, as seen below:
https://cdn.****************.com/file/CDN-M-A-N/op_1009_10%20redraw%20fin%20wm%20lvl.png

So that also isn't support for your point.
 
Duedate8898 said:
I actually responded to this bit, this is a newly reinvigorated Luffy who just got fed and even had a bit of break after learning AC. This is not at all enough support to act like Luffy is getting empowered just from laughing. Especially since Pre-AC Haki was soft-confirmed able to hurt Kaido with just Beyond Advanced Armament Haki, as seen below:
https://cdn.****************.com/file/CDN-M-A-N/op_1009_10%20redraw%20fin%20wm%20lvl.png

So that also isn't support for your point.
Click to expand...
Literally you just sent luffy using a dura neg move of red hawk as justification while not using any armament haki at all, when he and the other fighters said "we can't hurt him" and Luffy was in base.

Luffy in the beginning of the raid was equal to Ulti, now he can hurt Kaidou with regular punches.

I quite literally don't see what you're on about
 
Duedate8898 said:
Especially since Pre-AC Haki was soft-confirmed able to hurt Kaido with just Beyond Advanced Armament Haki, as seen below:
Click to expand...
That Luffy could hurt Kaidou internally due to durability negation, even with his strongest gear 4th attacks back then he was unable to draw blood from Kaidou's actual skin/scales.

Base Luffy did that with his Buso AP after returning to the roof.
 
KingTempest said:
Literally you just sent luffy using a dura neg move of red hawk as justification while not using any armament haki at all, when he and the other fighters said "we can't hurt him" and Luffy was in base.

Luffy in the beginning of the raid was equal to Ulti, now he can hurt Kaidou with regular punches.

I quite literally don't see what you're on about
Click to expand...
Yeah, but the Luffy you're showing is one whose just gotten advanced conquer's Haki, and has been refuelled. Luffy's accelerated development has already taken effect before any laughing nonsense has occurred. To try and attribute this all to his laughing doesn't make any sense, especially since Luffy getting empowered through laughs is not a concept at all anywhere before this in the series.

I quite literally don't see what you're on about.
 
Damage3245 said:
It looks like he did use infusion here. You can see him not making contact with Kaido when he punches him away in dragon form.
Click to expand...
You know that's... armament... right? Not conquerors
Duedate8898 said:
Yeah, but the Luffy you're showing is one whose just gotten advanced conquer's Haki, and has been refuelled. Luffy's accelerated development has already taken effect before any laughing nonsense has occurred. To try and attribute this all to his laughing doesn't make any sense, especially since Luffy getting empowered through laughs is not a concept at all anywhere before this in the series.

I quite literally don't see what you're on about.
Click to expand...
You keep saying "this is the one who got advanced conquerors haki".
That's like saying Usopp's punches are stronger because he got a new slingshot. If he's not using it, it doesn't matter.

Luffy being refueled doesn't matter either, because the one who fought Ulti was barely touched and Ulti and Kaidou are worlds apart.

Luffy's laughing happened before he got advanced Haoshoku, which is what Kaidou was mentioning, which is what I noted in the OP. Kaidou noting Luffy's laughter was revealed to be that his laughter made him stronger.
 
If we have multiple direct statements that Luffy laughing makes him stronger, and that this is implied to be applicable in his base form, not just his Gear 5 state then i don't see the problem in accepting this.

Especially since i haven't really seen any inherent contradiction to these statements at all. Even if you make the argument that Luffy doesn't seem to gain a noticeable amp to his physicals after laughing it doesn't mean he isn't gaining an amp at all. You'd have to prove he didn't gain any form of an amp to his physicals after laughing to contradict the fundamental assertion made by KT.

So i'm in agreement with both base Luffy and Gear 5 Luffy having this form of AD, i'll change my mind if direct counter evidence is provided to the contrary.
 
Deceived said:
If we have multiple direct statements that Luffy laughing makes him stronger, and that this is implied to be applicable in his base form, not just his Gear 5 state then i don't see the problem in accepting this.

Especially since i haven't really seen any inherent contradiction to these statements at all. Even if you make the argument that Luffy doesn't seem to gain a noticeable amp to his physicals after laughing it doesn't mean he isn't gaining an amp at all. You'd have to prove he didn't gain any form of an amp to his physicals after laughing to contradict the fundamental assertion made by KT.

So i'm in agreement with both base Luffy and Gear 5 Luffy having this form of AD, i'll change my mind if direct counter evidence is provided to the contrary.
Click to expand...
We don't have multiple direct statements is the problem. We just have one translation for gear 5 Luffy and a retranslation that has Kaido hinting at something more going on with Luffy. Not to mention that my point of contradiction is that throughout all of the series, we lack any correlation in power between Luffy laughing and growing stronger. And since Luffy can be found laughing quite often throughout One Piece, to make the assertion that he's been getting powered up from these laughs should be substantiated through multiple instance throughout the series. The idea that in order to say that an argument can only be proven ad wrong through direct contradiction only works if the argument in question also has substantial evidence supporting it.
 
I agree with DueDate. Luffy growing stronger in his fight against Kaidou can be attributed to his Haki blooming in battle when fighting a strong opponent which is a thing we know happens. We don't need to attribute this specifically to Luffy just laughing.

Especially when Kaidou made that statement, Luffy has barely been doing laughing since his fight with Ulti. Like one "Hee hee" and that's it as far as I'm aware.
 
Duedate8898 said:
We don't have multiple direct statements is the problem
Click to expand...
"The more you laugh, the stronger you get"

"The more he laughs, the stronger he gets"

These are direct statements Duedate, no matter what your opinion on this situation is. These are direct statements.

Duedate8898 said:
Not to mention that my point of contradiction is that throughout all of the series, we lack any correlation in power between Luffy laughing and growing stronger
Click to expand...
Provide evidence of contradiction, don't just assert shit without providing evidence. Especially since you're the negative in this debate that's trying to debunk the positive claims made by KT.

Duedate8898 said:
And since Luffy can be found laughing quite often throughout One Piece, to make the assertion that he's been getting powered up from these laughs should be substantiated through multiple instance throughout the series
Click to expand...
No, that's just directly wrong. If we don't have any form of counter evidence to the multiple, canon statements about Luffy's laughter granting him greater power then the onus is on you to prove the counter.

KT's already provided the evidence for his burden, you have to do the same

Duedate8898 said:
The idea that in order to say that an argument can only be proven ad wrong through direct contradiction only works if the argument in question also has substantial evidence supporting it
Click to expand...
It does have substantial evidence, two uncontradicted statements that's >>>> then anything you or Damage have provided.

Until you can provide counter evidence for your claim then my mind isn't being changed on this topic.
 
Deceived said:
"The more you laugh, the stronger you get"

"The more he laughs, the stronger he gets"

These are direct statements Duedate, no matter what your opinion on this situation is. These are direct statements.
Click to expand...
The latter is for Gear 5, not base Luffy. Which is what my argument is agaisnt.
The former itself mentions nothing about Luffy getting stronger in that scene with Kaido. It's just talking about the translation from Road to Laughtale, which is also about Gear 5 Luffy. Base Luffy is never brought up.

And this is exactly why I see no point in just going through all of One Piece and getting all the instances of just Luffy laughing and no difference in his strength of power being noticed. The argument KT is trying to have isn't even on the right basis.
 
Duedate8898 said:
The latter is for Gear 5, not base Luffy. Which is what my argument is agaisnt.
The former itself mentions nothing about Luffy getting stronger in that scene with Kaido. It's just talking about the translation from Road to Laughtale, which is also about Gear 5 Luffy. Base Luffy is never brought up.

And this is exactly why I see no point in just going through all of One Piece and getting all the instances of just Luffy laughing and no difference in his strength of power being noticed. The argument KT is trying to have isn't even on the right basis.
Click to expand...
After re-reading the scans again i agree with you that it seems to be only applicable to his Gear 5 state since the Kaido statement itself is in reference to his Gear 5 state, which is supported by the Road to Laugh guide.

If your only contention is that this isn't applicable to base Luffy but is applicable to Gear 5 Luffy then i'm in agreement with that.
 
Damage3245 said:
It looks like he did use infusion here. You can see him not making contact with Kaido when he punches him away in dragon form.
Click to expand...
There's no conqueror's streaks there. Just a black arm. The inking around it seems like Kaido's blood (visible on his cheek too)
 
Okay. Though it is just Buso, it's more advanced than Luffy's earlier Buso attacks. It doesn't particularly matter regarding the specific proposal of this CRT.
 
Wasn't his buso the exact same? You don't go far beyond unlocking buso emission and dura negation. There's no real clew how or why Luffy got strong enough to go from getting blitzed, to easily dispatched and even disappointing Kaido, to fighting him on par and earning his respect in just minutes-- unless it's accelerated development granted by his laughter.
That might just be how his mythical zoan works, similiar to Carnivore's getting more deadly through bloodlust.
 
He got a stronger form of emission when he unlocked his Conqueror's Haki infusion. He wasn't doing the "no touch" punches until then, and he started using them in the fight once he got back up to the rooftop.

Besides, Luffy already had accelerated development for his Haki and he was using Conqueror's Haki infusion in other parts of the fight. Not to mention the biggest issue is that there was a lack of laughter in the scenes around when Kaidou made his comment.
 
SnookB said:
Wasn't his buso the exact same? You don't go far beyond unlocking buso emission and dura negation. There's no real clew how or why Luffy got strong enough to go from getting blitzed, to easily dispatched and even disappointing Kaido, to fighting him on par and earning his respect in just minutes-- unless it's accelerated development granted by his laughter.
That might just be how his mythical zoan works, similiar to Carnivore's getting more deadly through bloodlust.
Click to expand...
I have an answer for everything you said because well I just do. If your asking if his armament haki was on the same level, no it was not we actually get conformation that when haki is at used one piece characters haki become far stronger. We also see multiple times in the serious by just fighting for a bit in one piece can quite literally make you have more endurance, durability, strength and even speed. He kept up with kaido b4 gear 5. Kaido was getting outclassed even though his haki was superior, luffy kept growing far more than him even though kaido was growing and getting stronger too.

So anyone in one piece can get significantly stronger by fighting a bit no matter what your df is or who you are. Its just that in some cases a zoan user will get more stronger at a faster pace and a larger amount. There's also burndi world who can amp himself. Im pretty sure zoans get amped the lowest, than ancient than mythical.
 
Damage3245 said:
Not to mention the biggest issue is that there was a lack of laughter in the scenes around when Kaidou made his comment.
Click to expand...
He was laughing when he pulled Kaido off Momo, and grinning like a mad man when Kaido was making those comments. Pretty much from the start of the last round Luffy was having fun. There was an exchange off screen clearly, otherwise Kaido wouldn't mention Luffy smiling/Laughing out of the blue
Trax said:
I have an answer for everything you said because well I just do. If your asking if his armament haki was on the same level, no it was not we actually get conformation that when haki is at used one piece characters haki become far stronger. We also see multiple times in the serious by just fighting for a bit in one piece can quite literally make you have more endurance, durability, strength and even speed. He kept up with kaido b4 gear 5. Kaido was getting outclassed even though his haki was superior, luffy kept growing far more than him even though kaido was growing and getting stronger too.

So anyone in one piece can get significantly stronger by fighting a bit no matter what your df is or who you are. Its just that in some cases a zoan user will get more stronger at a faster pace and a larger amount. There's also burndi world who can amp himself. Im pretty sure zoans get amped the lowest, than ancient than mythical.
Click to expand...
Then Luffy's development just gets faster if he laughs more, is the simpler answer. Otherwise Kaido would constantly be ahead.
 
Damage3245 said:
He got a stronger form of emission when he unlocked his Conqueror's Haki infusion. He wasn't doing the "no touch" punches until then, and he started using them in the fight once he got back up to the rooftop.

Besides, Luffy already had accelerated development for his Haki and he was using Conqueror's Haki infusion in other parts of the fight. Not to mention the biggest issue is that there was a lack of laughter in the scenes around when Kaidou made his comment.
Click to expand...
I'm still confused on what oda kept meaning by luffy fights in any way he fantasizes. Luffy is able to defy common sense(being both logic and physics) by fighting or how luffys df is about freedom. Does that mean in the future luffy will be able to release his limits? Free himself from being bounded by everything. Especially since its oda you can't tell what he will do. Even the gorosei says its the most ridiculous power in the world.
 
SnookB said:
He was laughing when he pulled Kaido off Momo, and grinning like a mad man when Kaido was making those comments. Pretty much from the start of the last round Luffy was having fun. There was an exchange off screen clearly, otherwise Kaido wouldn't mention Luffy smiling/Laughing out of the blue
Click to expand...
The thing is im pretty sure when he pulled kaido off of momo he didn't awaken his df nor have gear 5. He only gets amped when hes in gear 5.
SnookB said:
Then Luffy's development just gets faster if he laughs more, is the simpler answer. Otherwise Kaido would constantly be ahead.
Click to expand...
Yes or it could just automatically make him far more stronger. Like the rtl thing says.
Screenshot-2022-09-15-6-25-33-PM.png



The more he laughs the stronger he gets.
 
SnookB said:
He was laughing when he pulled Kaido off Momo, and grinning like a mad man when Kaido was making those comments. Pretty much from the start of the last round Luffy was having fun. There was an exchange off screen clearly, otherwise Kaido wouldn't mention Luffy smiling/Laughing out of the blue
Click to expand...
But Kaido mentioned that well, well before those scenes.
 
Damage3245 said:
But Kaido mentioned that well, well before those scenes.
Click to expand...
He mentioned Luffy laughing, and while it's true we haven't seen him laugh we see him smiling and enjoying things. He was laughing off screen- . Kaido wouldn't randomly mention that if Luffy was pissed the whole time
 
SnookB said:
He mentioned Luffy laughing, and while it's true we haven't seen him laugh we see him smiling and enjoying things. He was laughing off screen- . Kaido wouldn't randomly mention that if Luffy was pissed the whole time
Click to expand...
Well, the Viz translation didn't mention Luffy laughing. Just smiling. And Luffy spent a lot more of the fight serious & pissed off than he was laughing.
 
Damage3245 said:
Well, the Viz translation didn't mention Luffy laughing. Just smiling. And Luffy spent a lot more of the fight serious & pissed off than he was laughing.
Click to expand...
If you guys are talking ab gear 5 luffy. There are some off screen moments where hes laughing.
 
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