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I'll just give my two cents right off the bat and say that Rock Lee still wins. There're multiple reasons for this. One, Rock Lee already knows everything about Neji and has seen his fighting style more than anyone else, so he knows exactly what to expect. Neji, on the other hand, is still very arrogant and haughty and has no knowledge of the Eight Inner Gates technique, so he probably wouldn't take Lee very seriously and just toy around with him like he did with Hinata. Since Lee already knows what to expect from Neji, he probably won't waste any time and just immediately go to unleashing the Fifth Gate, which would overwhelm Neji. And knowing how much Guy understands Lee and the inferiority complex he feels towards Neji, he'd likely allow Lee to go all out from the get-go. Furthermore, Neji showed clear shock and awe at Lee's speed and strength during his fight with Gaara, implying he was uncertain if he could overcome this level of strength and speed. For all these reasons, I think Lee would win.
 
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That is a weird match TBH , rock lee says that neji is konoha strongest genin , but he also implies that he was planning to use the fifth gate to defeat neji ( neji was even sweeting a little bit from seeing it ) , so you can go either way on the narrative argument
Feats wise i think lee is better
 
I'll just give my two cents right off the bat and say that Rock Lee still wins. There're multiple reasons for this. One, Rock Lee already knows everything about Neji and has seen his fighting style more than anyone else, so he knows exactly what to expect. Neji, on the other hand, is still very arrogant and haughty and has no knowledge of the Eight Inner Gates technique, so he probably wouldn't take Lee very seriously and just toy around with him like he did with Hinata. Since Lee already knows what to expect from Neji, he probably won't waste any time and just immediately go to unleashing the Fifth Gate, which would overwhelm Neji. And knowing how much guy understands Lee and the inferiority complex he feels towards Neji, he'd likely allow Lee to go all out from the get-go. Furthermore, Neji showed clear shock and awe at Lee's speed and strength during his fight with Gaara, implying he was uncertain if he could overcome this level of strength and speed. For all these reasons, I think Lee would win.
Are we assuming Lee vs Gaara didn't happen?
Because if we assume that happened, Neji will definitely go serious right off the bat. Though it probably won't change the outcome too much
 
Are we assuming Lee vs Gaara didn't happen?
Because if we assume that happened, Neji will definitely go serious right off the bat. Though it probably won't change the outcome too much
Yes, this is assuming that Lee was paired with Neji instead of Hinata for the first match.
 
Okay let me give my two cents on this. Firstly, assuming that he skips all the other Gates, and goes straight to 5th Gate, I don't believe that Neji's arrogance will be used against him in this match or really at all. Even against Naruto as he still took him seriously when he pulled out KN0 and would have beat him if it wasn't for the underground technique. Especially if Lee pulls out a form/technique that he's never seen before, signifying that he's going to be fighting seriously, Neji will respond in turn moreso after seeing his chakra massively increase via Byakugan.

Next, on Rock Lee's page it states that with the 5th Gate he is likely comparable to Neji due to saving the Reverse Lotus for him, which makes me believe that it isn't until 5th Gate that they are comparable (which is backed up by the profiles). So it is in this form that Lee is actually stands a chance against Neji. Now if you take a look at Neji's speed and Lee's speed with Gates, Neji actually has the SPEED advantage (better reactions AND combat speed), while his regular speed is comparable to 5th Gate Lee's speed in general. Which means Neji will actually be the one who has the advantage. And because of this, not only will Neji be able to see through Lee, he also can counter attack with his own Gentle Fist, even if Rock Lee runs or jumps at Neji and jumps away before Neji's hits connect, Rock Lee would be the one wasting stamina- NOT Neji. Lee will be constantly losing stamina/chakra and Neji can easily see that AND exploit that.

And finally, Kaiten just easily blocks any and every attack Rock Lee throws at him so he should be able to fight just fine.


My vote goes to Neji
 
Okay let me give my two cents on this. Firstly, assuming that he skips all the other Gates, and goes straight to 5th Gate, I don't believe that Neji's arrogance will be used against him in this match or really at all. Even against Naruto as he still took him seriously when he pulled out KN0 and would have beat him if it wasn't for the underground technique. Especially if Lee pulls out a form/technique that he's never seen before, signifying that he's going to be fighting seriously, Neji will respond in turn moreso after seeing his chakra massively increase via Byakugan.

Next, on Rock Lee's page it states that with the 5th Gate he is likely comparable to Neji due to saving the Reverse Lotus for him, which makes me believe that it isn't until 5th Gate that they are comparable (which is backed up by the profiles). So it is in this form that Lee is actually stands a chance against Neji. Now if you take a look at Neji's speed and Lee's speed with Gates, Neji actually has the SPEED advantage (better reactions AND combat speed), while his regular speed is comparable to 5th Gate Lee's speed in general. Which means Neji will actually be the one who has the advantage. And because of this, not only will Neji be able to see through Lee, he also can counter attack with his own Gentle Fist, even if Rock Lee runs or jumps at Neji and jumps away before Neji's hits connect, Rock Lee would be the one wasting stamina- NOT Neji. Lee will be constantly losing stamina/chakra and Neji can easily see that AND exploit that.

And finally, Kaiten just easily blocks any and every attack Rock Lee throws at him so he should be able to fight just fine.


My vote goes to Neji
I still feel like Lee was a special case for Neji in how much he underestimated and belittled him, though I suppose you're right that Neji wouldn't hesitate in seeing the massive increase in chakra. However, on the profiles, Neji's regular speed is Massively Hypersonic, while Lee's speed is stated to be Massively Hypersonic while only in the First Gate, and the speed increase is significantly higher. I feel as though the topic of whether or not Lee actually needed the Fifth Gate to keep up with Neji or if it was just the Gate he needed to confidently overwhelm Neji is debatable, and the CRT for Part 1 Naruto didn't discuss it enough. I also believe that Lee is indeed faster than Neji in the Fifth Gate since Kakashi needed to use his Sharingan to keep up with his movements, whereas he had no problem following Neji's movements in his match with Hinata. Neji was also so shocked by Lee's strength and speed that he wondered if it was actually Lee, being in pure denial at the feat of strength he was witnessing.

But probably the biggest piece of evidence I forgot to mention is Guy's commentary. As Lee unleashes the Fifth Gate and uses the Hidden Lotus, Guy internally says to himself that Lee's taijutsu combination is delivered at such blinding speed that not even Neji could defend against it. Considering Guy is their mentor and has trained them both personally, he'd know their skills better than anyone and his input is the most reliable. Lee would probably go all out from the start. Neji'd probably be prepared and take a defensive stance, but he'd probably be too shocked by Lee's speed and be taken by surprise before Lee kicks him in the air and unleashes the Reverse Lotus. Neji also can't use his Kaiten midair, so he'd be unable to protect himself from Lee's onslaught.
 
the CRT for Part 1 Naruto didn't discuss it enough.
I agree with this.
Kakashi needed to use his Sharingan to keep up with his movements, whereas he had no problem following Neji's movements in his match with Hinata.
He actually had his Sharingan to look at his chakra while he was opening his gates, not to keep up with him. He did say he was fast, but he's just stating that the fourth gate gives a massive boost in speed, he didn't seem to have an issue with keeping up.
Neji was also so shocked by Lee's strength and speed that he wondered if it was actually Lee, being in pure denial at the feat of strength he was witnessing.
I think that'd be attributed to the fact that he's never seen Lee this fast or strong before.
But probably the biggest piece of evidence I forgot to mention is Guy's commentary. As Lee unleashes the Fifth Gate and uses the Hidden Lotus, Guy internally says to himself that Lee's taijutsu combination is delivered at such blinding speed that not even Neji could defend against it. Considering Guy is their mentor and has trained them both personally, he'd know their skills better than anyone and his input is the most reliable.
Could you show me the scan of that? Cause I can't find it. The obvious point here is if he manages to hit him in the air, then Neji wouldn't be able to defend himself, because he doesn't have Kaiten in the air, so he'll have no choice but to eat those hits. But my argument is that since 5th Gate arguably makes him comparable to Neji in speed, but still not enough for reactions or even combat speed, Neji should be able to dish out more attacks than Lee could and not get knocked into the air.. (hell Neji's more durable than Gaara's Sand Armor anyway.)

Hell, Lee used 4th Gate to beat the crap out of Gaara and was already threatening his body, but when he used Reverse Lotus his arms and legs were in immense pain from hitting Gaara's Sand Armor , which is less durable than Neji himself (as well as exerting his body).

I don't believe Lee will get any good hits in before his body starts to take a hit, due to Neji being more durable, Kaiten, faster reactions and combat speed, and the Gates weakness.
 
Could you show me the scan of that? Cause I can't find it. The obvious point here is if he manages to hit him in the air, then Neji wouldn't be able to defend himself, because he doesn't have Kaiten in the air, so he'll have no choice but to eat those hits. But my argument is that since 5th Gate arguably makes him comparable to Neji in speed, but still not enough for reactions or even combat speed, Neji should be able to dish out more attacks than Lee could and not get knocked into the air.. (hell Neji's more durable than Gaara's Sand Armor anyway.)
Here's a page where Guy says it. It's an alternate translation of the page, but it basically confirms that Lee's high-speed combo would've been enough to defeat Neji. Even the translation you showed implies the same thing, where Guy says the Lee's speed renders him untouchable. He didn't say, "Only Neji's Kaiten would be fast enough to withstand that high-speed combo." Guy very clearly knew of Lee's rivalry with Neji and knew how much he wanted to prove himself, so it would only make sense he taught him the moves and technique he'd need to overcome Neji's Kaiten. I believe that Neji could easily deal with Lee in the First or Second Gate, but I believe the boost of speed and strength that even the Third and Fourth Gates provided would be enough to pressure Neji into using his Kaiten, and then as soon as he stopped the Kaiten, the Fifth Gate would finish him off. I believe the profiles stating that only Fifth Gate Lee is a match for Neji are just plain wrong and ignore the reactions and statements of everyone implying that Fifth Gate Lee is stronger and faster than Neji. For instance on Neji's page, some of the evidence that's used is that Neji defeated him in past sparring matches, not taking into consideration how long ago those matches were, whether or not he had his training weights on during those matches, and if he ever used the Gates during those sparring matches.
 
Even the translation you showed implies the same thing, where Guy says the Lee's speed renders him untouchable. He didn't say, "Only Neji's Kaiten would be fast enough to withstand that high-speed combo."
He doesn't even mention Neji, like at all. He was referring to Gaara, and he was right cause clearly Gaara couldn't react.
 
Okay, so I wanna clear something up real quick.

We kinda messed up slightly on the profile. There's definitely no good reason for Neji to scale to the 5th Gate's AP, at all. Lee was planning to use it to defeat Neji, not to match him.
Not to mention, Neji's own reaction to the 4th Gate says it all, lol.
He has no business scaling to the 5th Gate, and probably not the 4th either.

Let's also think about it from a scaling perspective. Lee's 3rd and 4th Gate upscale to 8-A via being significantly superior to the 1st Gate and completely overwhelming Gaara, the 5th is even higher than that.

Neji's 8-A for overwhelming base Naruto (who somewhat scales to Gaara, to an extent) and matching a KN0 Naruto who's significantly above his base.

This would make Neji around the upscaled 3rd/4th Gate AT MOST, not the 5th. This is consistent with Lee planning to use the Reverse Lotus to beat Neji.

Speed wise, he also shouldn't scale to the 4th or 5th Gate at all. There's no reason for him to.

Not to worry, we'll fix the profiles soon to reflect what I said here pretty soon. We'll revise Part I's speed soon, and the AP part only needs a very minor adjustment.

Personally, I think Neji would shit on base and 1st Gate Lee. I also think Kaiten can probably take anything Lee can dish out. I think the 4th and 5th Gate would be too much for Neji, though.
 
Unless lee opens the 3rd gate VERY early in the match he loses. Plus the OP said the prelims so if that means he is starting with his weights on he loses clearly, mix that with the fact that nejis attack shut down the chakra network and lee is a close combat fighter and things can get bad for lee
 
Unless lee opens the 3rd gate VERY early in the match he loses. Plus the OP said the prelims so if that means he is starting with his weights on he loses clearly, mix that with the fact that nejis attack shut down the chakra network and lee is a close combat fighter and things can get bad for lee
Lee is painfully aware of this, he'd never hold back against Neji.
 
Okay, so I wanna clear something up real quick.

We kinda messed up slightly on the profile. There's definitely no good reason for Neji to scale to the 5th Gate's AP, at all. Lee was planning to use it to defeat Neji, not to match him.
Not to mention, Neji's own reaction to the 4th Gate says it all, lol.
He has no business scaling to the 5th Gate, and probably not the 4th either.

Let's also think about it from a scaling perspective. Lee's 3rd and 4th Gate upscale to 8-A via being significantly superior to the 1st Gate and completely overwhelming Gaara, the 5th is even higher than that.

Neji's 8-A for overwhelming base Naruto (who somewhat scales to Gaara, to an extent) and matching a KN0 Naruto who's significantly above his base.

This would make Neji around the upscaled 3rd/4th Gate AT MOST, not the 5th. This is consistent with Lee planning to use the Reverse Lotus to beat Neji.

Speed wise, he also shouldn't scale to the 4th or 5th Gate at all. There's no reason for him to.

Not to worry, we'll fix the profiles soon to reflect what I said here pretty soon. We'll revise Part I's speed soon, and the AP part only needs a very minor adjustment.

Personally, I think Neji would shit on base and 1st Gate Lee. I also think Kaiten can probably take anything Lee can dish out. I think the 4th and 5th Gate would be too much for Neji, though.
Thank you! I agree that Neji could easily take out base Lee and probably 1st Gate Lee, but as you said, Neji would be utterly overwhelmed by the 4th and 5th gates, and possibly the 3rd gate as well.
 
Okay, so I wanna clear something up real quick.

We kinda messed up slightly on the profile. There's definitely no good reason for Neji to scale to the 5th Gate's AP, at all. Lee was planning to use it to defeat Neji, not to match him.
Not to mention, Neji's own reaction to the 4th Gate says it all, lol.
He has no business scaling to the 5th Gate, and probably not the 4th either.

Let's also think about it from a scaling perspective. Lee's 3rd and 4th Gate upscale to 8-A via being significantly superior to the 1st Gate and completely overwhelming Gaara, the 5th is even higher than that.

Neji's 8-A for overwhelming base Naruto (who somewhat scales to Gaara, to an extent) and matching a KN0 Naruto who's significantly above his base.

This would make Neji around the upscaled 3rd/4th Gate AT MOST, not the 5th. This is consistent with Lee planning to use the Reverse Lotus to beat Neji.

Speed wise, he also shouldn't scale to the 4th or 5th Gate at all. There's no reason for him to.

Not to worry, we'll fix the profiles soon to reflect what I said here pretty soon. We'll revise Part I's speed soon, and the AP part only needs a very minor adjustment.

Personally, I think Neji would shit on base and 1st Gate Lee. I also think Kaiten can probably take anything Lee can dish out. I think the 4th and 5th Gate would be too much for Neji, though.
Okay thank you for the clarification.

My vote goes to Lee then FRA
 
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