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Naruto: Light Fang Revision

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AstralKing7 said:
Everyone and I mean everyone has yin or yang release. Every jutsu uses a form of yin or yang release which is what your not understanding.

Also in Naruto yin and yang mean many different things. They can also stand for mental and physical energy.
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Where is this stated? Because Yin release is Genjutsu and Yang Release is literally any other jutsu that's non elemental.
 
Where is this stated? Because Yin release is Genjutsu and Yang Release is literally any other jutsu that's non elemental.

No...

Things like the Nara clan's shadow possession falls under the broad category of Yin release in addition to genjutsu. Even the Yamanaka clan's secret technique has some relation to Yin release since it converts their consciousness to spiritual energy (This this last bit is somewhat conjecture and a bit headcanon-y)

Yin and Yang release are basically the building blocks of chakra, but every technique contains some ratio of Yin and Yang, some of which favor one over the other as such is the case with some Hiden.
 
I think staff should be invited to have a say on this, even those not familiar with Naruto.

If it doesn't abide by our light rules then it shouldn't even be accepted as light speed. I initially always accepted Light Fang as light speed on other battleboards due to it being called a beam of light that moves at light speed; however, those battleboards did not have standards for what can or cannot be accepted.

It would seem Light Fang doesn't fit from this thread so I guess it can't be accepted. But it would be nice to have more staff opinions as well as they interpret and apply the rules/standards just like recently with Type 3 Abstract Existence.
 
In fact, there are some problems with our standards for light and lasers attacks being lightspeed, like "Light can't bend". I have some arguments in favor of light ca bend
 
M3X said:
In fact, there are some problems with our standards for light and lasers attacks being lightspeed, like "Light can't bend". I have some arguments in favor of light ca bend
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This. I honestly dislike the "bending" argument if im gonna be honest.

But with that being said, im not taking a side in this so staying neutral as well.
 
Just gonna add (And I hope I don't sound d*ckish cause I'm not trying to).

Honestly, for all those saying that Light Fang isn't light based on that small curve, you would then have to assume that Kishimoto made that curve on purpose; a curve so minuscule and insignificant that it's only apparent purpose is to be used as supposed evidence against Madara's Light Fang being light...

Right.
 
On a page full of straight lines, the only significant one somehow isn't straight, and is deliberately and notably bent in accord with a lengthy object when swung being subjected to force?

Assuming authorial intent is pretty akin to headcanon I'd argue.
 
I mean every other line on the panel is straight, and being bent has been argued as major point against most light based attacks. There is even a note on the page for how to get past it via proving refraction and what not. Unless there is a certain degrees minimum rule for a beam to be bent the argument is valid imo.
 
That seems callous and rude, honestly. I'd insist you either participate and defend a point or simply not bother intruding upon an actual, meaningful discussion around what I gather is a pretty heavily-debated feat.
 
You can call it whatever you want dude. It does not change the fact that you can't even bring a decent argument, and still using the "LF bend" argument, while me and Jvando already explained that this us just art. Is does not matter if the all lines are straight, LF still straight and is not an line that will disprove this
 
Xulrev said:
On a page full of straight lines, the only significant one somehow isn't straight, and is deliberately and notably bent in accord with a lengthy object when swung being subjected to force?

Assuming authorial intent is pretty akin to headcanon I'd argue.
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You are quite literally assuming the author's intent by saying that it was drawn that way deliberately which, according to you, is akin to headcannon. I'm merely saying that Kishimoto had no intent in curving it and that it can actually be attributed to simple human error. Also note that while all the movements lines go in the exact same direction, Light Fang doesn't so its much easier to assume he screwed up when drawing it and made a minuscule, nearly unnoticeable, mistake.

@Sigurd, I suppose my question would then by how bent does it have to be to no longer be considered light? If it's bent by a nearly unnoticeable 1, 2, or 3 degrees, something easily attributed to human error, then is it not light despite evidence suggesting it is? Cause Light Fang's apparent bending looks to be much less than 1 degree
 
It is important for both sides to remain civil and patient. More staff input would be appreciated yes, but how are they suppose to deal with it when they all come and find there's no thread left to post on. Anyway, TakaHakai is great with calculations so he'd be a good person to ask for sure.
 
"You can call it whatever you want dude. It does not change the fact that you can't even bring a decent argument, and still using the "LF bend" argument"

You sound like someone who just doesn't want Naruto to be downgraded at all costs and as such resort to namecalling to make the thread close faster.

Also I myself never really used the "Light Fang Bends!" Argument, more the fact that the very name "Storm Release" contradicts what it's supposedly composed of.


"while me and Jvando already explained that this us just art."


No, you and Jvando just interpreted it as just art. Just like how I and everybody else can interpret it as not art.


"Is does not matter if the all lines are straight, LF still straight and is not an line that will disprove this"


That's not how debates and responsibility of evidence works M3X.

"That's not always true. A lot of Nature Transformation Kekkei Genkai don't make any sense when looking at their composite elements.

-Magnet Release = Earth + Wind -Ice Release = Water + Wind -Explosion Release = Earth + Lightning u -Dust Release = Earth + Wind + Fire

I don't really believe those are explainable, but hey, feel free to do so."

I will simply quote myself in my above message.

"Explosion release is a combination of Earth+Lightning and I'm not so sure that works in reality"

Lightning is pretty explosive both in verse and in real life. Apply it to a rock and you have an explosion from the force. I think that's the principle Kishimoto was going for at least. The point of Explosion Release is to emulate Explosions so I'm not sure why this doesn't work in reality?

"Ice release is a combination of water+wind release which also doesn't work unless your talking about wind from the arctic in which case it's more the temperature that's freezing the water"

Fast moving winds are naturally cooler (I know this from experience. Fast moving winds even in hot climates are COLD), so fast moving winds + water would = ice. Eventually. Slowly. In a normal climate.

"Magnet release is wind+earth...I don't make sense of that either."

This is never actually confirmed and it's only suggested to be Wind+Earth. Longshot but it could possibly be that the Earth is the actual magnet and the wind symbolizes the Attractive/Repulsive forces I guess?"
 
I am sorry, but using the argument of it being just chalked up as being "art" doesn't seem to a valid point given this is the only time this technique seems to be used. No other instances of this ability has been shown in a different scan other than the ones shown here.

Attempting to use headcanon is also something one will argue to using a logical Fallacy here.
 
If it was a notable curve, I would agree, but it's insignificant and nearly unnoticeable. Also, is it headcanon to assume it was done intentionally or that is was a mistake? Anyway, gotta nap but hopefully we get more input from admins by the time I wake up.
 
Problem is it doesn't seem like an artistic curve like most others would. The beam is curving in response to Madara's head being punked to the side, implying it has mass and thereby making it so it no longer qualifies as light.
 
M3X said:
Ok some one move this to Fun and Game please, it is getting ridiculous
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Dude, you asked others not to be rude and actually participate in your thread. It'd be nice if you could do the same.

That said I'm indifferent about the light fang, all it is is gonna go with supporters not budging and non supporters not budging and ad nauseam everywhere per every Naruto thread.

@Jvando

Could you link scans for this on my wall as to not derail? Because admittedly besides Shadow Possession and Genjutsu, there's been little to say that all Jutsu possesses Yin and Yang Release.
 
Jvando said:
If it was a notable curve, I would agree, but it's insignificant and nearly unnoticeable. Also, is it headcanon to assume it was done intentionally or that is was a mistake? Anyway, gotta nap but hopefully we get more input from admins by the time I wake up.
Click to expand...
Pretty much since we, the reader, can chalk it up as intentional or not if we gonna interpret a scene like this.
 
I just don't want Naruto to be downgraded here? I can tell the opposite to you. You just bring wall of text of debunked arguments and call it just interpretation, really, the bend stuff is getting ridiculous and we can clearly see that there is no curve there, it is JUST THE ART
 
The reason I state the bend is deliberate is due to the fact that every other straight line on the page wherein the feat takes place....exists. Obviously, straight lines are within the capabilities of Kishimoto and on the very same page even, so if the Light Fang were meant to be straight...why would it not be so?

My interpretation simply goes by what is shown to us. The only interpretation that relies upon non-canon thought is 'art mistake'.
 
Sasuke Uchiha has shown he can use wind style to freeze water vapor in the novels in order to create an imitation of ice style if I remember correctly. So yes that implies the elemental combination is quite literal in verse.

"When you extinguish a fire with Suiton, it produces a high-temperature water vapour"

"Sasuke spoke to Konohamaru, who felt overwhelmed: " And so, when you combine together Fuuton and Suiton, the resulting water vapour becomes frozen over."

"So that's not Suiton, but rather 'Hyouton'...?"

"It's close, but it's not the very thing itself. In the past, I fought an enemy who could, but it's an imitation of the technique. It's not even comparable to that guy's power at all."
 
Arguing against literal author intent now? Seriously?

Let me just ask you guys straight up, what do you guys think is Kishi's intention for LF given the feat is only 1 panel and based off his description?

Should be extremely obvious the intention is for LF to be LS.
 
Like Matthew, I also think that the beam looks straight enough in the image linked in the first post. The artist likely did not have an entirely steady hand when he drew it.
 
Yes we need more staff approval....can get as many staff as possible? I do want to say though that we do however take words from manga that just say "Speed of Light" and give it to them like Date a Live or Trinity 7

It wouldn't be fair if they get a free pass with just words from a book but Naruto series can't...
 
Antvasima said:
Like Matthew, I also think that the beam looks straight enough in the image linked in the first post. The artist likely did not have an entirely steady hand when he drew it.
Click to expand...
You say as said beam of light is absolutely surrounded by straight lines huh...
 
>the artist did not have steady hands

Did you not see the other dozens of straight lines in that same panel? Also unless Kishimoto is an idiot he knows what a ruler is.

Edit: also being straight enough is not good enough since we have the strictest rules for light feat
 
Sigurd Snake in The Eye said:
Correct me if i'm wrong, but doesn't the wiki disregard author's intent?
Click to expand...
Iirc, no. Just that what's shown and stated take priority.

And let's break that down.

1.)LF is shown in one panel And Naruto is shown to be dodging it. (2 equal possibilities are Madara either swung to cut Naruto or Shot first then swung to cut. The Latter being most logical and has less assumptions)

2.)LF is stated in the DB to a Beam of Light that cuts at LS. (Cut here having emphasis put on it. All I will say is that a 1 Inch beam would cut a 1 inch pole in half).

3.)Kishimoto's intention (Which is obvious) supports LF (The Technique itself) being LS.

Thus, LF being LS is the logical and most reasonable conclusion.
 
I think you're mixing up Noticeable and Serious, Final.

The bend in the beam of light in the manga panel above is very noticeable to anyone paying any semblance of attention to the image brought before them.

It is however, not seriously bent that it turns into a whirly turly.
 
Sure if you look at it for a second it looks straight, but it's not. Hell i'm pretty sure the beam got wider too if you look at it from top to bottom.

So we have...

  • It's not 100% straight.
  • Seems to be expanding at the bottom.
Bend
 
Oh god damnit why is it expanding near the bottom, why is that a thing, that shouldn't be there.

Reeeeeee

Well at least we can probably explain this away as Artistic laziness since drawing parallel lines that bend is hard so some deviation can be expected (A problem that could've been solved if the lines were made straight).
 
Debunking the "Bending Argument

As we can see here the full scan of Naruto and Madara's position befire shooting LF.

  • In the LF scans posted in the OP, he attempts to draw attention to the arc of the swing to give the impression LF was bent to try and debunk it but this is false and intentionally misleading. As we can see in my scan provided, there is some noticable distance between Naruto's TSB staff and his Headband strands. The LF panel is viewed at an angle slightly raised from behind Naruto and Madara was aiming up at it. The path of the arc wouldn't appear Linear at all fir the simple fact of Depth Perception. The Headband strands would be slightly raised in the scene as they are closer to the viewer.
  • This entire notion of LF bending is unreliable under extremely basic things. The scan I posted already illustraights the Strands are not stationary. They involuntary move in the wind. Ontop of this, Naruto is in motion in the LF panel, his body movement would not allow his hands (Thus the TSB Staff) to stay stationary and his already non-stationary Headband strands wouldn't all of a sudden become stationary with the added movement of his body / head.
Any argument based on the notion LF is Bent is predicated on an unreliable observation, which is quite clearly a desperate reach.
 
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