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My Hero Academia General Discussion Thread #18

ShigarakiShimura said:
I still don't see why we shouldn't use mach 4 for calcs
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If all we knew about Lady Nagant's bullets were that they were faster than Mach 4, then we'd use Mach 4 as a substitute to calc them.

But if that is actually a gross misrepresentation of her speed and she's actually 1500 times faster than that, which we accept, then the usage of Mach 4 becomes totally inaccurate.

It'd be like calcing Deku's catching an entire skyscraper that's falling on him and substituing in the weight of a small pile of bricks as a low end for his Lifting Strength. The result you'd get from that would be useless and a misrepesentation.
 
Damage3245 said:
If all we knew about Lady Nagant's bullets were that they were faster than Mach 4, then we'd use Mach 4 as a substitute to calc them.

But if that is actually a gross misrepresentation of her speed and she's actually 1500 times faster than that, which we accept, then the usage of Mach 4 becomes totally inaccurate.

It'd be like calcing Deku's catching an entire skyscraper that's falling on him and substituing in the weight of a small pile of bricks as a low end for his Lifting Strength. The result you'd get from that would be useless and a misrepesentation.
Click to expand...
So you're telling me, if we have to choose between a lowball and nothing, we should choose nothing? All you're saying is that it would be a big lowball, but that literally just means he would scale way higher. How would ignoring the entire feat be any better? Especially when there's no other option.
 
ShigarakiShimura said:
So you're telling me, if we have to choose between a lowball and nothing, we should choose nothing? All you're saying is that it would be a big lowball, but that literally just means he would scale way higher. How would ignoring the entire feat be any better? Especially when there's no other option.
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We're not ignoring the feat. On Deku's profile he has this:

far higher with 100% (His Faux 100% was fast enough to travel many times faster than Nagant's fastest bullet)
Click to expand...

Are you telling me it would be better to list him as "At least Mach 100" than "far higher than Sub-Relativistic"?
 
Damage3245 said:
We're not ignoring the feat. On Deku's profile he has this:



Are you telling me it would be better to list him as "At least Mach 100" than "far higher than Sub-Relativistic"?
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The issue people are bringing up is calc stacking and not specifically this Deku feat. After all this entire conversation is about Bakugo in the first place.

I'm sure there's many who would love to use Mach 100, Mach 1K, and even Sub-Rel or whatever for Nagant's feats but that obviously won't be allowed so people settle for the Mach 4 low-ball.
 
Kingofwolves999 said:
Repeating this.

The alternative to using a lowball is to calc stack, which is obviously not allowed.
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There is another option besides lowballing and calc stacking which is that we just don't use it... And funnily we don't use the calc on the profiles anyway.
 
Kingofwolves999 said:
Re-doing my horrible calc because .25 meters is an obscenely big number actually. That’s 25 cm, his hands did not move that far at all.

So, I did a bit of research and found that, if AFO is pulling AM in half, and doesn’t manage to do it before 2nd Gear Bakugo blitzes him, he would not have been able to tear the ligaments in his stomach significantly, as that is the center point for how he’s ripping AM.

The biggest ligament in the stomach is the Sacrotuberous Ligament which, in men, is about 64 mm. Ligaments can stretch about 6% their size before they tear, so using two ends for “AFO hasn’t torn anything yet” (6%) and “he’s started tearing them significantly” (so like 10%)

64x.06 = 3.84 mm distance = .00384 m
64x.1 = 6.4 mm distance = .0064 m

.00384/1422 = 0.000002700421941 seconds

9570/0.000002700421941 = 3,543,890,624 m/s = 11.8x SoL (FTL+)

.0064/1422 = 0.000004500703235 seconds

9570/0.000004500703235 = 2,126,334,375 m/s = 7.09x SoL (FTL)

So it’s comparable to frozen time.

Gonna stop now and just wait for the actually intelligent people to do it now before I give Damage more heart attacks 🗿
Click to expand...
BTW for some reason you're only using the distance from deku to AFO, you should be using the distance from bakugo to deku and deku to AFO put together I believe. Which is just a bit higher at 11 km according to the other guy. But he was using raw scans to scale it so it's smaller than it should be, using the the tcb translations that came out an hour ago I got it to 14519.626 meters or just above 14.5 km.
 
Damage3245 said:
There is another option besides lowballing and calc stacking which is that we just don't use it... And funnily we don't use the calc on the profiles anyway.
Click to expand...
So if a character dodges an attack from a super powered sniper rifle, and we want to calculate his speed for dodging said sniper rifle, rather than using a lowball of a normal sniper rifle, we ignore the feat entirely?

Nagant’s calculated speed is irrelevant due to our calc stacking rules, the only thing that matters is the feat itself which is “Deku dodges super powered sniper rifle, how fast is he.”

And it’s not even ABOUT that specific calc, using 1422 m/s reactions is literally the basis for anything 45% or higher related. It’s used in the 45% reactions calc as well for Nagant’s bullets because it is the lowest value we can feasibly use for her weapon.

vsbattles.fandom.com

MHA: Deku vs Bullets

vsbattles.fandom.com vsbattles.fandom.com

I know you know this Damage. Lowballing characters reactions/speed even if they’re calculated as something different is a site standard and is used in probably every single verse on the wiki.

Should this calc be removed because Luffy considers light speed slow so the calc uses baseline light speed reactions?
 
ShigarakiShimura said:
BTW for some reason you're only using the distance from deku to AFO, you should be using the distance from bakugo to deku and deku to AFO put together I believe. Which is just a bit higher at 11 km according to the other guy. But he was using raw scans to scale it so it's smaller than it should be, using the the tcb translations that came out an hour ago I got it to 14519.626 meters or just above 14.5 km.
Click to expand...
Well that would be two separate feats, the feat of Bakugo moving to Deku in that timeframe would scale to his normal speed and then him blitzing over after getting amped by Gearshift would be it’s own thing.
 
Kingofwolves999 said:
Should this calc be removed because Luffy considers light speed slow so the calc uses baseline light speed reactions?
Click to expand...
I'm pretty sure I advocated for that calc to be removed a long time ago.

Kingofwolves999 said:
So if a character dodges an attack from a super powered sniper rifle, and we want to calculate his speed for dodging said sniper rifle, rather than using a lowball of a normal sniper rifle, we ignore the feat entirely?
Click to expand...
No. Did you miss the part where I said this:

If all we knew about Lady Nagant's bullets were that they were faster than Mach 4, then we'd use Mach 4 as a substitute to calc them.
Click to expand...

Kingofwolves999 said:
Nagant’s calculated speed is irrelevant due to our calc stacking rules, the only thing that matters is the feat itself which is “Deku dodges super powered sniper rifle, how fast is he.”

And it’s not even ABOUT that specific calc, using 1422 m/s reactions is literally the basis for anything 45% or higher related. It’s used in the 45% reactions calc as well for Nagant’s bullets because it is the lowest value we can feasibly use for her weapon.
Click to expand...
Yes, and I would disagree with that other 45% calc being used too.
 
Confirmation that the vestiges don't look like their real self until the person is dead.

A combo from both Gearshift and Bakugo's speed isn't normally enough to cross that distance before AFO kills All Might. It required the same effect that changed Nighteye's vision from before, which doesn't surprise me since that's been build up ever since we saw these people watching.

Wishing/Belief seems to be a genuine force in MHA that can subtlety effect the world.

I'm curious on if Izuku used Gearshift on himself or Bakugo. If he used it on Bakugo that would mean the blowback hits him regardless of if he uses it on himself or not. I imagine we'll get more information on this once these battles finally get going. But this means Izuku's been stalemating Complete Shigaraki without using Gearshift, he'd probably be able to crush him easily if he had complete mastery over that Quirk.

Also, Bakugo being able to make up for his self-belief that he ended All Might by saving him here is some good stuff.

Not a whole lot happens this chapter, but this is great to see.

An Armored All Might key is perfectly fine at this point, but we'd likely need a small CRT to discuss on how he'd be rated. Shouldn't be anything controversial either since it'd just be scaling discussion and no calculations. No, I refuse to bring up the laser thing right now.
 
Damage3245 said:
I'm pretty sure I advocated for that calc to be removed a long time ago.


No. Did you miss the part where I said this:




Yes, and I would disagree with that other 45% calc being used too.
Click to expand...
Mach 4 comes from a commercial sniper rifle.

The 220 Swift is the fastest firing sniper rifle available conventionally, so I see no reasons why you would advocate that Nagant’s sniper rifle should not be comparable. Her shots are far more powerful, her effective range is obscenely higher and in her first appearance she could shoot a bullet from over 1km in less than a second while Deku was still trying to block her first bullet.

Her rifle, bare minimum, is wildly superior to a 220 Swift. So using that rifle’s muzzle speed as a baseline/lowball should be well within logic.

Also considering One Piece is still using that calc, I’m gonna assume your attempts to remove that calc were met with resistance.
 
Kingofwolves999 said:
Mach 4 comes from a commercial sniper rifle.

The 220 Swift is the fastest firing sniper rifle available conventionally, so I see no reasons why you would advocate that Nagant’s sniper rifle should not be comparable. Her shots are far more powerful, her effective range is obscenely higher and in her first appearance she could shoot a bullet from over 1km in less than a second while Deku was still trying to block her first bullet.

Her rifle, bare minimum, is wildly superior to a 220 Swift. So using that rifle’s muzzle speed as a baseline/lowball should be well within logic.
Click to expand...
In a circumstance where we didn't have an accepted speed for Lady Nagant's bullets, yes.

Do you think I'm arguing that her bullets are supposed to be slower than a commerical sniper rifle or something?

Kingofwolves999 said:
Also considering One Piece is still using that calc, I’m gonna assume your attempts to remove that calc were met with resistance.
Click to expand...
It was over a year ago so I can't remember if there was ever a CRT for it or just a discussion in general.
 
Damage3245 said:
In a circumstance where we didn't have an accepted speed for Lady Nagant's bullets, yes.

Do you think I'm arguing that her bullets are supposed to be slower than a commerical sniper rifle or something?


It was over a year ago so I can't remember if there was ever a CRT for it or just a discussion in general.
Click to expand...
For any instance of characters dodging or reacting to her bullets, yes, you are. That or you’re just trying to ignore it.

Your logic dictates that Nagant shouldn’t have Mach 5941 bullet speed either since Deku shouldn’t be moving Blackwhip at supersonic speeds because he’s rated higher than that.

And again: you’re claiming anyone who has higher or lower reaction speed than a human cannot have normal human reaction speed as a lowball for calcs.
 
TheRustyOne said:
Confirmation that the vestiges don't look like their real self until the person is dead.

A combo from both Gearshift and Bakugo's speed isn't normally enough to cross that distance before AFO kills All Might. It required the same effect that changed Nighteye's vision from before, which doesn't surprise me since that's been build up ever since we saw these people watching.

Wishing/Belief seems to be a genuine force in MHA that can subtlety effect the world.

I'm curious on if Izuku used Gearshift on himself or Bakugo. If he used it on Bakugo that would mean the blowback hits him regardless of if he uses it on himself or not. I imagine we'll get more information on this once these battles finally get going. But this means Izuku's been stalemating Complete Shigaraki without using Gearshift, he'd probably be able to crush him easily if he had complete mastery over that Quirk.

Also, Bakugo being able to make up for his self-belief that he ended All Might by saving him here is some good stuff.

Not a whole lot happens this chapter, but this is great to see.

An Armored All Might key is perfectly fine at this point, but we'd likely need a small CRT to discuss on how he'd be rated. Shouldn't be anything controversial either since it'd just be scaling discussion and no calculations. No, I refuse to bring up the laser thing right now.
Click to expand...
Thoughts on a calc for Bakugo crossing that distance since AFO is actively tugging?

Can probably find a distance AM could be tugged before he’s ripped in half, then use that full distance to see 2nd Gear + Bakugo’s normal speed without using wishing power, since the implications seem to be he’s moving a bit faster due to that.
 
Kingofwolves999 said:
For any instance of characters dodging or reacting to her bullets, yes, you are. That or you’re just trying to ignore it.
Click to expand...
Then you've just misunderstood my argument.

I'm not going to continue this discussion in a general discussion thread any longer. If I want to get it off the verse page, I'll make a CRT for it.

Kingofwolves999 said:
Your logic dictates that Nagant shouldn’t have Mach 5941 bullet speed either since Deku shouldn’t be moving Blackwhip at supersonic speeds because he’s rated higher than that.
Click to expand...
That is a somewhat funny point you've raised.

Lady Nagant's bullets get their speed in the Dark Hero Arc by being 5941 times faster than Deku's Blackwhip.

But 45% Deku's kicks are apparently 7.844 times faster than Lady Nagant's bullets.

So is 45% Deku physically 46601 times faster than his own Blackwhip?
 
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Damage3245 said:
There is another option besides lowballing and calc stacking which is that we just don't use it... And funnily we don't use the calc on the profiles anyway.
Click to expand...
We can extrapolate a speed to use for calcs based on what we know about Nagant’s bullets from statements alone (without any calcs).

We both know this is done to avoid calc stacking. I see no issue with that. Doesn’t really matter that it’s not used, it’s a matter of principle
 
I'm reading fights to look for details and feats and I realized that the comic that Yoichi and Afo read is Captain Hero.


If anyone has Yoichi's in better quality I would appreciate it.
Icono del Capitán Héroe | La casa de los dibujos, La casa de los dibujos animados, Dibujos animados
Haleighsloth — Bien, entonces Yoichi Shigaraki representa a ambos...
Click to expand...
 
Kingur_RG3 said:
I'm reading fights to look for details and feats and I realized that the comic that Yoichi and Afo read is Captain Hero.


If anyone has Yoichi's in better quality I would appreciate it.
Click to expand...
Hori really knows some obscure comics cause I never even heard of this comic.

I always thought it was something that was made up in the story.
 
Forgot the phrasing I used originally, which was far better, but it was something like this:

Shigaraki states Bakugo won't make it in time after getting thrown by Deku with gearshift.
Yet after everyone is praying for All Might, Bakugo is still able to catch AFO completely off guard with his speed.
Either Shigaraki severely overestimated AFO, or Bakugo changed speed while on his way there (due to the praying?).
As I stated previously, this doesn't really matter if it becomes a calc, but I think it's worth noting storywise.
 
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My running interpretation of the “wishing energy” is it changed reality enough that the fate of “he isn’t fast enough” became “he is fast enough.” Idk how tf that works, like is Bakugo permanently slightly faster now or was it only for that moment, but that’s what I got. The characters are unaware of “wishing energy” so to them 2nd Gear Bakugo is just built different.
 
I think shigaraki said that bakugo won't make it in time because he knew that Allmight was fully forming inside deku (seems like afo and ofa have gotten more connected since there's no way he should have known) so he thought that it was too late for bakugo to do anything. Plus he could just be overerestimating afo's speed. But the feat was pretty clear, I doubt that "wishing power" somehow helped speedwise. It's clear that it was thanks to deku using gear 2nd.
 
Damage3245 said:
We don't know for certain, but by this point it's got to be less than 20 chapters. It's most definitely ending in 2024 provided there are no major hiatuses.
Click to expand...
It's definitely ending in 2024 but I think it's gotta be more than 20 chapters. We still have the aizawa side arc and the sero side arc left to see what happened with them, and then we have the bakugo vs afo fight and then the main event of deku vs shigaraki, and then the aftermath.
 
TheRustyOne said:
Just noticed this, what does this mean?

I missed something?
Click to expand...
You snipped but I assume you’re talking about FTL.

The distance and speed at which 2nd Gear Bakugo blitzes AFO here has, with my horrible calculating skills, gotten to FTL. So when the officials drop and someone properly calculates it, it’s going to be very funny.
 
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