Ms. Marvel Upgrade

[LordTracer]

Maybe her statistics being Classic | Moder | Binary would be better?

 

[Milly_Rocking_Bandit]

Quite honestly, if it has this many instances, I agree. At very worst, POSSIBLY 4-B.

 

[Antvasima]

That seems better, yes.

 

[Antvasima]

Maybe her modern tier could set her power level as variable between 5-A and 4-B, depending on how much energy she has absorbed (and who the writer is)?

For her classic tier, is there a calculation of when Binary punched Rogue to the Moon at high speed?

 

[LordTracer]

I think plain 4-B should be perfectly fine, she only has one 5-A showing (Grey Hulk) and quite a lot of 4-B showings.

 

[Antvasima]

She was also unable to cause any damage whatsoever to the Doctor Green Hulk when really trying during Hickman's Avengers run, and was explicitly stated to only be class 90 after absorbing a lot of energy during Kurt Busiek's Avengers run, shortly after being depowered from her Binary state.

Again, other than in Bendis stories, she was not portrayed as nearly as powerful as Hulk, Thor, or the Silver Surfer until recently.

I am not comfortable with giving her a straight 4-B rating.

 

[LordTracer]

There's 4-Bs other than those three. Like I said in the OP, she's not as strong as them, but clearly comparable to other 4-Bs like She-Hulk, Iron Man and Wonder Man.

 

[Antvasima]

She-Hulk has had a very inconsistent power level depending on the writer, as has Iron Man. I do not have the impression that base Carol was generally intended to be much more powerful than The Thing, for example.

 

[Antvasima]

Still there are the 4 Bendis incidents (Count Nefaria, Sentry, Thanos, and the Hulkbuster). Those are legitimate 4-B enemies.

 

[LordTracer]

Also Blue Marvel. And Carol one-shotting Valkyrie. She also has a lot of 4-B dura feats where she survives hits from Ultron, Robbie Reyes and a Super-Skrull with Black Bolt's powers.

 

[Antvasima]

Well, her power level has stil varied a lot from writer to writer, and the handbooks did not list her as particularly powerful.

Still, I suppose that you have a point.

 

[LordTracer]

To be fair, some Marvel handbooks have listed the likes of Dormammu and Mephisto as only having metahuman levels of speed and lifting strength, I don't think those should take precedence over feats.

 

[Antvasima]

I suppose, but for lower-level characters they have tended to convey the editorial intent at the time.

 

[LordTracer]

So, are you fine with 4-B Modern Carol now?

 

[Newendigo]

Is not a Hulkbuster, is a Marvel Buster, and Bendis says that is stronger than any Hulkbuster. IDK how you take that statement.

Noting that in a alternative reality she was coma'd by Tony in that very armor, so Carol should not be listed as above him.

 

[LordTracer]

Why would the alternate reality affect 616 Carol, exactly? And Tony had to hit Carol from behind/while she was off-guard to KO her there.

 

[Newendigo]

Because is an alternative reality canon to the 616, similar to Cosmic Ghost Rider.

I have been told that being off guard should not matter at all when it comes to durability. Also that even Prime Armor K.O her through most of the battle (Note that Tony is not really going serious).

She is not that above him as the OP seems to imply.

 

[LordTracer]

Alright, well, the blog I made of her updated profile only notes her as comparable to Tony anyways.

 

[Antvasima]

I suppose that there are enough examples to rescale modern Carol to 4-B then.

However, we still have to find out how powerful Rogue and old-school Carol were.

Is there a calculation somewhere for withstanding the Moon punch?

 

[LordTracer]

I think all we have is this. Perhaps the KE can be calculated from this?

 

[Antvasima]

Yes. Would you be willing to ask some calc group members to take a look at it?

 

[LordTracer]

I made the request.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you.

 

[Antvasima]

You can also ask a few of them directly via their message walls in this case, since it is urgent.

 

[LordTracer]

It's already been calced at Small City level+. https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/3403260#210

 

[Antvasima]

That calculation needs to be posted in a blog and accepted though.

 

[LordTracer]

I requested for it to be put into a blog so it can be used on Carol and Rogue's profiles.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. Thank you.

 

[LordTracer]

I tried to calc it myself and got Small City level, no plus.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. Thanks again.

 

[Antvasima]

Should we scale them from some other character instead then?

 

[LordTracer]

Maybe giving her an 'At most 5-B' since Rogue was able to somewhat affect Magneto's barrier and Thor compared her punch to that of a Frost Giant's.

 

[Antvasima]

Maybe, but it isn't much to go by, and would basically be guesswork. Has she fought any tier 5 characters on even footing, without absorbing their powers?

 

[LordTracer]

Nothing that I can find. Perhaps she could have 'At least Low 7-B, at most 5-B?'

 

[Antvasima]

Maybe, but are any of our Marvel Comics powerhouses even 5-B right now, except for Magneto, and shouldn't he scale from Colossus (Marvel Comics) anyway?

Then again, as we have talked about in another thread, 5-A may have been an outlier for the Grey Hulk, which would downgrade the scaled characters to 5-B instead, so it is a bit of a mess all around.

I am open for the idea of "At least Low 7-B, at most 5-A" though.

 

[SuperAPM]

Carol and Rogue would be High 6-B at bare minimum, scaling above the Model 8 and all.

 

[LordTracer]

I was saying 5-B because I thought that downgrade had already been accepted, but if it hasn't then 5-A would be fine.

 

[LordTracer]

@Ant So, her statistics would look something like this.

Carol and Rogue would be High 6-B at bare minimum, scaling above the Model 8 and all.

Do Classic Carol and Rogue with those powers have anything that would imply they scale above the Model 8?

 

[Antvasima]

I do not think that they were supposed to be above Iron Man model 8 at the time. It was offically class 70, whereas they were class 50.

However, just "At most Large Country level (Almost comparable to Iron Man model 8)" should probably be fine.

 

[Antvasima]

Also, should we upgrade Magneto to 5-A?