MonsterVerse Upgrade!

[Marvel_Champion_07]

I'd like see what the calc members think of the arguments.

I asked @KLOL506 to give input, but he hasn't responded yet

 

[Spaysi11]

It looks good.

 

[DarkGrath]

I don't know the details regarding Godzilla being amplified by nuclear weapons, which makes evaluating this a bit difficult. Doesn't he possess some form of inherent immunity to nuclear weaponry due to getting stronger from it? If so, how does it work?

 

[ThanatosX]

I don't know the details regarding Godzilla being amplified by nuclear weapons, which makes evaluating this a bit difficult. Doesn't he possess some form of inherent immunity to nuclear weaponry due to getting stronger from it? If so, how does it work?

Godzilla is able to absorb the radiations of nuclear weapons, but he is not immune to the sheer force of the blast. In this case, it's the blast of the explosion that caused the 6-B feat, and Godzilla took said blast at point blank range.

 

[Qawsedf234]

mean he tanked it point blank and he absorbs the radiation which buffed him by an extent. Don't see the issue here

50% of a nukes power comes from radiation, which heavily amps Godzilla. The most he could have withstood is 50% of the blast, but he's still being amped by the blast itself.

(1) 50% as blast;

(2) 35% as thermal radiation; made up of a wide range of the electromagnetic spectrum, including infrared, visible, and ultraviolet light and some soft x-ray emitted at the time of the explosion; and

(3) 15% as nuclear radiation; including 5% as initial ionizing radiation consisting chiefly of neutrons and gamma rays emitted within the first minute after detonation, and 10% as residual nuclear radiation. Residual nuclear radiation is the hazard in fallout.

Also if they used a radiation intensive warhead even less energybwould go into Godzilla

The distribution of weapon energy yield is altered significantly by the enhanced radiation nuclear warhead. In simplest terms an enhanced radiation warhead is designed specifically to reduce the percentage of energy that is dissipated as blast and heat with a consequent increase in the percentage yield of initial radiation. Approximate percentage energies are 30% blast; 20% thermal; 45% initial radiation; and 5% residual radiation.

Overall Godzilla just isn't getting hit by the bombs full power and he's getting amped when it is hitting him.

 

[Dark-Carioca]

I concur with Qaw

 

[Arceus0x]

50% of a nukes power comes from radiation, which heavily amps Godzilla. The most he could have withstood is 50% of the blast, but he's still being amped by the blast itself.

Also if they used a radiation intensive warhead even less energybwould go into Godzilla

Overall Godzilla just isn't getting hit by the bombs full power and he's getting amped when it is hitting him.

Well, wouldn't that just mean he's 50% of the 6-B calc? I mean however you see it, he did get hit by the explosion straight in the face and absorbed the readiation as it was the goal to feed him with it. It buffed him up to a notable but not large scale which means his older keys would downscale

 

[Qawsedf234]

Well, wouldn't that just mean he's 50% of the 6-B calc

If he's being amped then the damage he would receive would be negated as it happens.

 

[ThanatosX]

If he's being amped then the damage he would receive would be negated as it happens.

Even if that was the case, it wouldn't change much. If we assume that he wistood the blast because he got amped by the radiations, than they would still scale to it since not long after King Ghidorah was able to damage the same amped Godzilla that took that blast.

 

[Arceus0x]

If he's being amped then the damage he would receive would be negated as it happens.

why? he still took the explosion face first, he ain't gonna be amped as fast as the explosion hits him, a sponge doesn't suck up all the water that it hits instantly, a battery doesn't get charged to 100% instantly and when mothra sacrificed herself for Godzilla he didn't just suck it all up instantly either, its' energy went down and godzilla absorbed it and it started buffing him and it took a small bit before he went into his burning form. It took enough time for humans to react properly and such so it happened over several seconds, while the explosion moves at supersonic to hypersonic speeds so hundreds of times faster than what it took for him to absorb and integrate the energy into himself. it's not like he is constantly taking some energy beam to the face while buffing himself with it. the fact that he wasn't disintegrated by the explosion itself shows that he scales.

 

[Qawsedf234]

why?

Because attacks that amp you don't scale to your natural durability.

 

[Arceus0x]

Because attacks that amp you don't scale to your natural durability.

i literally explained that the explosion would hit him hard way before he could even absorb the energy, let alone integrate it enough to actually use it, and yet you still say this. Also aren't you contradicting yourself here? So the amp negates the damage but he can't scale to it even though he absorbs only 50% of the energy? the explosion hits him all at once so it'd need to buff his durability well enough for him to survive 50% of the energy at once as otherwise he'd get pulverized.

 

[Gasper]

Because attacks that amp you don't scale to your natural durability.

You missed like, the whole comment though

 

[ThanatosX]

Because attacks that amp you don't scale to your natural durability.

Yeah, but it's not like he is getting amped by the blast of the explosion, and this is also acknowledged in the first movie. In there, the plan of the humans was to attract Godzilla and the MUTOs with the radiations of a nuclear bomb, and than try to kill them with the sheer force of the explosion. Obviously that wouldn't have been enough to actually kill them, but it is a known fact in universe that the blast of the nuclear explosions can still damage the Titan, regardless of their ability to absorb radiations.

 

[Apex_Predator_GX]

I can recall the force of nuclear weapons can still damage Titans as shown in the Novel. Despite Titans being able to absorb radiation.

 

[Gasper]

I can recall the force of nuclear weapons can still damage Titans as shown in the Novel. Despite Titans being able to absorb radiation.

So they are not nuke proof?

 

[Arceus0x]

So they are not nuke proof?

depends on the power of the nuke lmao

 

[Apex_Predator_GX]

So they are not nuke proof?

Shinomura died despite having the Best radiation absorption from the Verse.

 

[Eseseso]

I agree with nuke scaling

 

[Qawsedf234]

yet you still say this.

Yes, because that's how we treat absorption feats with attacks that hit the person. If you absorb radiation and are hit by a weapon that has radiation, it doesn't scale to your base durability. For the same reason blasting Superman with sunlight wouldn't scale to Superman's base durability.

So the amp negates the damage but he can't scale to it even though he absorbs only 50% of the energy?

I mean, yeah. 50% - 50% = 0%.

Godzilla also got stronger after the explosion, meaning the amount he got would immediately be > the nukes output.

 

[Apex_Predator_GX]

Because attacks that amp you don't scale to your natural durability.

I have to remind you that before Godzilla could absorb the radiation from the nuclear bomb, he had to endure the blast.

 

[ThanatosX]

Yes, because that's how we treat absorption feats with attacks that hit the person. If you absorb radiation and are hit by a weapon that has radiation, it doesn't scale to your base durability. For the same reason blasting Superman with sunlight wouldn't scale to Superman's base durability.

As I said in the previous comment, it's acknowledged in Universe that Titan only absorb the radiations of a nuclear bomb, while the blast can still damage them. Blasting Superman with sunlight wouldn't work because it would only be sunlight, here there are two factors: the blast of the explosion and the radiations of the bomb. Godzilla and the Titan are able to absorb the radiations, one part of the bomb, but have to withstand the blast, the second part of it. Again, this is clearly explained in universe, so this argument must be countered if you want to refute the feat.

Godzilla also got stronger after the explosion, meaning the amount he got would immediately be > the nukes output.

And as I said before that wouldn't change anything, since even if we assume that he tanked the explosion because he got amped by the radiations then immediately after the amped Godzilla was damaged by King Ghidorah, meaning that the attacks from the latter would scale above the blast of the bomb.

 

[Qawsedf234]

I have to remind you that before Godzilla could absorb the radiation from the nuclear bomb, he had to endure the blast.

Radiation travels at light speed. An explosion doesn't. Godzilla is hit by radiation first and then the explosion follows.

radiations, one part of the bomb, but have to withstand the blast, the second part of it. Again, this is clearly explained in universe, so this argument must be countered if you want to refute the feat.

I already countered it. The portion Godzilla absorbs counters the portion that harms him. Especially if it's a radiation based bomb.

Godzilla was damaged by King Ghidorah, meaning that the attacks from the latter would scale above the blast of the bomb.

It wouldn't scale above the bombs blast. It would scale to some amount between 20% and 50% of the bomb's blast.

 

[Gasper]

Radiation travels at light speed. An explosion doesn't. Godzilla is hit by radiation first and then the explosion follows.

So you're saying godzilla has light speed reaction time?

 

[Qawsedf234]

So you're saying godzilla has light speed reaction time?

Godzilla's passive absorption has no bearing on his reaction speed. You don't have lightspeed reactions for your eyes photo-recepters or getting cancer from radiation for the same reasons.

 

[ThanatosX]

I already countered it. The portion Godzilla absorbs counters the portion that harms him. Especially if it's a radiation based bomb.

I feel like I am repeating myself, but that's not how it works in Universe. It's said clearly that the radiations doesn't counter the blast from the bomb, since the plan from the human was in the first place to attract the Titan with radiations and then try to kill them with the blast. If it's like you say and the radiations absorption counter the blast, than they wouldn't even try that plan in the first place. And, as Apex_Predator_GX explained, Shinomura, someone that had an even better radiations absorption than Godzilla, dies from a nuclear bomb exactly because the radiations don't counter the blast.

 

[Gasper]

Godzilla's passive absorption has no bearing on his reaction speed. You don't have lightspeed reactions for your eyes photo-recepters or getting cancer from radiation either.

Godzilla having light speed Absorption is pure headcanon

 

[Arceus0x]

Godzilla having light speed Absorption is pure headcanon

sure is, this man wildin

 

[Qawsedf234]

. It's said clearly that the radiations doesn't counter the blast from the bomb, since the plan from the human was in the first place to attract the Titan with radiations and then try to kill them with the blast.

Which failed against Godzilla and when the bomb in the movie was sued on Godzilla it merely made him stronger. What works for another monsters doesn't work for Godzilla.

Godzilla having light speed Absorption is pure headcanon

Radiation hits Godzilla first and he absorbs it. The blast wave hits Godzilla second and he withstands it. Godzilla is being amped before the shockwave hits him.

If it's like you say and the radiations absorption counter the blast, than they wouldn't even try that plan in the first place.

It doesn't matter what the plan was, it's how it works with our system. Ghidora scaling to the bomb can work, but he wouldn't scale to its full output. It would only be 20-50% of its total energy.

 

[Arceus0x]

Yes, because that's how we treat absorption feats with attacks that hit the person. If you absorb radiation and are hit by a weapon that has radiation, it doesn't scale to your base durability. For the same reason blasting Superman with sunlight wouldn't scale to Superman's base durability.


I mean, yeah. 50% - 50% = 0%.

Godzilla also got stronger after the explosion, meaning the amount he got would immediately be > the nukes output.

what are you even on about rn?

like cool, a nuclear explosion is an instant wave of radiation+explosion and he absorbed the radiation part. I already proved that he wouldn't get amped instantly, it took time for him to absorb and integrate Mothra's energy into himself to go thermonuclear, in fact, the people in the movie literally had to distract ghidorah until godzilla managed to use the energy for an amp. You can't keep ignoring this mate. Even if he could absorb energy at light speed he wouldn't be able to integrate this energy into himself faster than the explosion would hit him.

Also wtf is this 50-50 shit? Like what the hell do you even mean? The explosion is instant, it expands and hits whatever is next to it. You need 6-B durability to withstand this. For arument's sake let's say that godzilla could integrate all the energy so fast that he would be able to boost himself to withstand the explosion...that would still be 6-B durability whether you like it or not because he doesn't use the energy to create some barrier around himself with it to counter the blast and the explosion isn't going to apply bits and pieces of 6-B overtime for the bits and pieces of the radiation amp to counter them. He didn't use up that energy did he? He literally used that shiz to evolve further and fight Ghidorah. Like you said, 50% of the explosion is radiation which he absorbed, so why are you suddenly saying that this exact energy would counter the explosion energy?

Your arguments make 0 sense.

 

[Apex_Predator_GX]

Radiation hits Godzilla first and he absorbs it. The blast wave hits Godzilla second and he withstands it. Godzilla is being amped before the shockwave hits him.

That argument is wrong in that Godzilla's absorption has never been that fast, proof of that is that in his temple there was enough radiation to kill Serizawa in minutes and yet it was said that it would take years for his body to fully recover.

 

[Qawsedf234]

You can't keep ignoring this mate

You never brought this up to me before.

Also wtf is this 50-50 shit? Like what the hell do you even mean?

It's the energy of a nuke that's a blast that Godzilla would have to take. The remaining portion of the nuke is energy Godzilla can absorb and process.

You need 6-B durability to withstand this. For arument's sake let's say that godzilla could integrate all the energy so fast that he would be able to boost himself to withstand the explosion...that would still be 6-B durability

I didn't say it wasn't. I said Ghidora would scale to 20-50% of the blast's value since that's the portion Godzilla took, he just wouldn't scale to the full value.

so why are you suddenly saying that this exact energy would counter the explosion energy?

Because any damage he got from the blast can be healed with or withstood with the amp he got from the Radiation.

Which is why I said multiple times thst Ghidora scales to that reduced portion and not the full blast. Because 50% of the blast is energy Godzilla is literally not harmed by.

 

[Arceus0x]

You never brought this up to me before.

and when mothra sacrificed herself for Godzilla he didn't just suck it all up instantly either, its' energy went down and godzilla absorbed it and it started buffing him and it took a small bit before he went into his burning form.

i literally explained that the explosion would hit him hard way before he could even absorb the energy, let alone integrate it enough to actually use it

bruh
bruh
bruh
bruh

Which is why I said multiple times thst Ghidora scales to that reduced portion and not the full blast. Because 50% of the blast is energy Godzilla is literally not harmed by.

then what the hell are we even arguing about at this point?

I am all for scaling Godzilla and Ghidorah to 50%+ of the explosion's full value and downscaling all other monsters.

 

[Da3ggman]

I feel like Godzilla would still have to tank the damage of the Radiation despite being able to absorb it, since it takes time for him to actually absorb the radiation and transform.

 

[ThanatosX]

It doesn't matter what the plan was, it's how it works with our system. Ghidora scaling to the bomb can work, but he wouldn't scale to its full output. It would only be 20-50% of its total energy.

Wait, so you do agree that they should scale to 50% of the total energetic output, so around 27,25 teratons? Than it's fine for me, I was of the idea you disagreed even with that because you thought that for some reason the radiation absorption nullified the blast of the explosion.

 

[Arceus0x]

I feel like Godzilla would still have to tank the damage of the Radiation despite being able to absorb it, since it takes time for him to actually absorb the radiation and transform.

I mean you can argue for that but you do you.

 

[Da3ggman]

Oh yeah, I agree if it wasn't obvious.

 

[Apex_Predator_GX]

Which is why I said multiple times thst Ghidora scales to that reduced portion and not the full blast. Because 50% of the blast is energy Godzilla is literally not harmed by.

I agree scaling Godzilla and Ghidorah to 50%+ of the explosion's full value.

 

[Qawsedf234]

then what the hell are we even arguing about at this point?

I said Ghidora would scale, but when you said would base Godzilla would scale I said no, since the explosion would amp him. Base Godzilla would however downscale from Ghidora who scales to 50% of the Blast due to Burning Godzilla.

was of the idea you disagreed even with that because you thought that for some reason the radiation absorption nullified the blast of the explosion.

The only part is disagreed with was base Godzilla scaling to it. He'd downscale from the value through Ghidora.

 

[Arceus0x]

I said Ghidora would scale, but when you said would base Godzilla would scale I said no, since the explosion would amp him. Base Godzilla would however downscale from Ghidora who scales to 50% of the Blast due to Burning Godzilla.

you don't seem to understand.
the nuke amp buffed him permamently, burning godzilla is a state he got from absorbing mothra.
Basically
Godzilla 2014 =< Godzilla 2019 pre-evo =~< Ghidorah < Post-Amp Godzilla < Amped Ghidorah <<< Burning Godzilla (mothra absorbed)
Godzilla 2019 post-amp = Godzilla in GvK