Molecule Man CRT

[Confluctor]

The Post-Cosmic Cube Retcon should get a varied tier. "Varied, up to 2-A". I have explained it in this album here.

To summarise: his mental (and emotional) state plays a role in his power levels, which is then later on expanded in Dark Avengers where he is emotionally unstable and he even talks about how he has limited power at this moment in time. I would recommend reading Dark Avengers #11 - #12 to see it in full context (I don't want to post the whole comic here lol, but I have included the relevant scans)


New powers to add: All of these are from Dark Avengers 2009 #10 - 12

• Petrification (shown here)
• Deconstruction (shown here)
• Mind manipulation (shown here)
• Breaks up Venom from his host (here)
• Pocket reality manipulation (shown here)
• Teleportation (shown here)
• Possible: time stop

His profile is pretty bad, so I am going to revise one key at a time. So, I have a question/request; in which comic does he get retconned as a cosmic cube being?

 

[ElixirBlue]

Following Blizzard Group’s leader’s CRT

 

[The_Impress]

@Antvasima @Eficiente @Qawsedf234

:v

 

[The_Impress]

Also can we maybe list a low-end for him? Like, he has to have harmed Reed 'n' stuff, no?

 

[Confluctor]

I am not sure if he has in this key. But iirc, he does have a fight against avengers. I will need to try and find those.


I was thinking of scaling his AP from Daken since he struggled a bit against his healing.

So, something like at least "Daken tier", up to 2A

 

[PsychoWarper]

Would this remove the Physically 10-B part of it? Or is this just concerning the powers part?

Either way the changes proposed seem pretty reasonable and the profile definitely needs work.

 

[Confluctor]

No, that's for his physical self. Without powers basically.

But the "at least 8-C" part (unless I find a better feat) will be for his powers. So, like this;

10-B Physically. Varies from 8-C to 2-A with powers.

 

[LordTracer]

@Antvasima @Eficiente

Only staff are able to ping.

 

[PsychoWarper]

No, that's for his physical self. Without powers basically.

But the "at least 8-C" part (unless I find a better feat) will be for his powers. So, like this;

10-B Physically. Varies from 8-C to 2-A with powers.

Alright then yeah I agree with this.

 

[DaReaperMan]

I agree with this

 

[Qawsedf234]

The varied addition and powers are fine.

 

[Antvasima]

I suppose that this mostly seems fine, but I am very uncertain regarding the lower border for his attack potency.

@Zensum @C2_of_Omegon @SuperAPM @Firestorm808 @EmperorRorepme @Newendigo @Ehnkr2beboh @Tllmbrg @Elizio33 @LordTracer

What do you think?

 

[Antvasima]

LordTracer was already here. My apologies.

 

[Tllmbrg]

This seems fine

 

[Confluctor]

I have a question/request; in which comic does he get retconned as a cosmic cube being?

About this... Does anyone know?

 

[Ehnkr2beboh]

The proposals seem fine. As for the Cube retcon, I believe it's this from Fantastic Four #319.

 

[Confluctor]

The proposals seem fine. As for the Cube retcon, I believe it's this from Fantastic Four #319.

Thanks. I will start reading his stuff after this to find more stuff for his key.

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, Tom DeFalco hated The Beyonder, so when he became editor-in-chief for Marvel Comics, he made it a high priority to completely mess up Jim Shooter's legacy in that regard.

Personally, I found the Beyonder to be a rather realistic interpretation of what would happen if a transdual entity that only knows completeness is introduced to the flawed, splintered, and insane nature of humanity. The story toned down the culture shock involved, but nevertheless.

 

[Eficiente]

Having only read some issues of Secret Wars 2 I can tell it's a good story and it's disappointing knowing that it all will be retcon'd later, that even takes away part of the full enjoyment I can have reading it.

Petrification, Deconstruction and Mind Manip need evidence of Owen being the one doing it for his profile.

Mind Manip seems like Illusion Creation and Perception Manip too.

Breaks up Venom from his host is TK.

Possible time stop we put as Status Effect Inducement when we have no evidence of it being Time Stop.

I'm pretty sure Owen would need 2 profiles like the Beyonder.

 

[Confluctor]

Petrificationn, Deconstruction and Mind Manip need evidence of Owen being the one doing it for his profile.

That was all Owen's doing and nobody else's in this comic. The other people are just constructs he made with no powers whatsoever. Just standing there and talking to him.

Breaks up Venom from his host is TK

Okay

Possible time stop we put as Status Effect Inducement when we have no evidence of it being Time Stop.

Make sense.

 

[Confluctor]

Mind Manip seems like Illusion Creation and Perception Manip too.

I wasn't sure about that. But that seems about right

But here is the proper context to what he did: Dark avengers #12


He basically rearranged his molecules in his brains and made him see all that stuff

 

[Eficiente]

That was all Owen's doing and nobody else's in this comic. The other people are just constructs he made with no powers whatsoever. Just standing there and talking to him.

I know, but accuracy one needs to trust like this is badly copied by newer users into inaccuracy they also tell others to trust. They believe the weirdest sh*t that we end up accepting if we're not careful, so, I prefer feats to always have their full context so that those type of users only have those standards to imitate.

 

[Antvasima]

I do not mind if we split up the Molecule Man into 3 different profile pages (original/cosmic cube/multiversal bomb), but do not know if it is unnecessary work.

 

[Confluctor]

I feel like the way his profile is perfectly fine. His abilities are more or less the same in every incarnation.

It's a lot more easier to explain show his retcons in one profile

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, that is a very good point.

 

[PsychoWarper]

Yeah I feel like we dont need to split up Owens profile like we did for Beyonder cause the changes just werent as severe, he overall had pretty much the same power set the difference was just scale.

Yes, Tom DeFalco hated The Beyonder, so when he became editor-in-chief for Marvel Comics, he made it a high priority to completely mess up Jim Shooter's legacy in that regard.

Personally, I found the Beyonder to be a rather realistic interpretation of what would happen if a transdual entity that only knows completeness is introduced to the flawed, splintered, and insane nature of humanity. The story toned down the culture shock involved, but nevertheless.

Ive always had a weird relationship with Beyonder and Secret Wars tbh, I really enjoyed the series but I disliked Beyonder himself as I just found him annoying, I do however agree its a pretty realistic representation of what would likely happen in that situation.

The retcon itself was pretty unnecessary as well.

 

[Antvasima]

I personally find the character quite interesting, given the more realistic angle regarding how a being like "God" would likely view mortals. Somebody only used to completeness, rationality, and perfection would likely not look kindly on human madness and rampant imperfection.

 

[The_Impress]

Not to interrupt but this may be derailment.

What has Efciente not completely verified yet?

 

[Antvasima]

Yes. My apologies.

 

[Confluctor]

What has Efciente not completely verified yet?

Petrification and deconstruction are rejected because it lacks context

He also said mind manip is not exactly mind manip but rather perception manipulation and illusion creation.

And time stop is not time stop, but status effect inducement

 

[The_Impress]

Have you provided counterarguments or do you accept these assertions too?

It's a really arbitrary distinction between Perception Manipulation and Mindhax tbf

 

[Confluctor]

Have you provided counterarguments or do you accept these assertions too?

For the rejected ones? I don't really know what else to do other than provide the scans, which are already in the proposal. He wants the specifics of how it was done, but we don't get that in the comic so eh

 

[The_Impress]

I see... so the accepted stuff should be applyable then?

 

[Confluctor]

I suppose so.

The accepted stuff are:

• Varied tier up to 2A
• Pocket reality manipulation
• Perception and Illustion manipulation
• Status Effect Inducement
• Teleportation
• Telekinesis

 

[Antvasima]

That is probably acceptable, yes, although I am personally fine with petrification and deconstruction as well. They seem blatant enough to me from what I remember of that story.

 

[Oliver_de_jesus]

bump?

 

[Confluctor]

Oh yeah. I need to update the profile.

Can the page be unlocked?

 

[Antvasima]

Yes. Tell me here when you are done.

 

[Confluctor]

And it's done.

 

[Antvasima]

Thank you. Should I close this thread then?