Metal Knight upgrade

[Tural2004]

AP Upgrade

Personally, I think this should be a new key but anyway. In One Punch Man chapter 149 Child Emperor states that Metal Knight's weapons are beyond any lone hero. While this can't be used to scale him to Genos or Tatsumaki since Child Emperor has never seen them at full power, it still should be enough to scale him to other feats he witnessed such as base flip and Tatsumaki stopping a barrage from Boros' ship which is this powerful. Both calculations are low 6-B which is consistent.

This will not be accepted but Metal Knight can somehow be scaled to Wave Motion Cannon IMO. At least, we should discuss it here for future reference. I think it is enough for Metal Knight to get "likely far higher". There are several other reasons for that.

1. Besides scaling to Wave Motion Cannon, Child Emperor's statement means from his perspective Metal Knight is superior to King in general who is usually seen as much more impressive than Tatsumaki who scales to low 6-B.

2. He is rumored to have an immense arsenal of weapons and a robotic army, to the point where the Hero Associaton fears the idea of him going rogue (I found this one in OPM wiki)

3. He stated what he fears isn't MA itself but another evil. Metal Knight seems to be preparing for this greater evil which means he possesses weaponry strong enough to consider himself above MA.

4. He also possesses Boros' ship

I am pretty sure all these combined is enough for "likely far higher"

Lifting strength upgrade/downgrade

Gargantuan's own weight cannot be used to determine lifting strength. So it should be changed to "unknown".

Or

Child Emperor also witnessed Tatsumaki lifting Monster Association base which is this heavy and this was before his statement. Metal Knight was able to remove Boros' ship which is 1.6e14 kg. Both are class T.

Speed

He taught Child Emperor everything he knows. So Metal Knight's speed can reasonably be scaled to Underdogman.

Range

When Metal Knight fired his missiles to blast the meteor, it was over 33 seconds away. That requires way more than hunderds of meters range. It is at least tens of kilometers. Besides, when the missiles of MK hit the meteor, its altitude was higher than clouds. AFAIK the wiki usually accepts clouds to be 2km high.

 

[ImposingTiger]

Following.

1. Besides scaling to Wave Motion Cannon

Child Emperor was low on sugar.

Metal Knight was able to remove Boros' ship which is 1.6e14 kg. Both are class T.

With multiple days and multiple robots.

 

[Kachon123]

Personally, I think this should be a new key but anyway. In One Punch Man chapter 149 Child Emperor states that Metal Knight's weapons are beyond any lone hero. While this can't be used to scale him to Genos or Tatsumaki since Child Emperor has never seen them at full power, it still should be enough to scale him to other feats he witnessed such as base flip and Tatsumaki stopping a barrage from Boros' ship which is this powerful. Both calculations are low 6-B which is consistent.

I agree

This will not be accepted but Metal Knight can somehow be scaled to Wave Motion Cannon IMO. At least, we should discuss it here for future reference. I think it is enough for Metal Knight to get "likely far higher". There are several other reasons for that.

WMC isn't even real. I don't think in this instance, Child Emperor is as reliable as he usually is (Sugar Levels?)

3. He stated what he fears isn't MA itself but another evil. Metal Knight seems to be preparing for this greater evil which means he possesses weaponry strong enough to consider himself above MA.

Link doesn't work.

4. He also possesses Boros' ship

I am pretty sure all these combined is enough for "likely far higher"

Agree

Child Emperor also witnessed Tatsumaki lifting Monster Association base which is this heavy and this was before his statement. Metal Knight was able to remove Boros' ship which is 1.6e14 kg. Both are class T.

Neutral

He taught Child Emperor everything he knows. So Metal Knight's speed can reasonably be scaled to Underdogman.

Neutral

When Metal Knight fired his missiles to blast the meteor, it was over 33 seconds away. That requires way more than hunderds of meters range. It is at least tens of kilometers. Besides, when the missiles of MK hit the meteor, its altitude was higher than clouds. AFAIK the wiki usually accepts clouds to be 2km high

Neutral

 

[Tural2004]

doesn't work

Does this one work?

 

[Tural2004]

With multiple days

Was it even stated how much time it took? From what I remember all we know is that it is less than two days.

and multiple robots.

Yeah, I just realized that it is shown he carries it in pieces with several kind of robots so this is invalid. But how did he even manage to take it pieces? Maybe he can damage Boros' ship by unknown means

 

[Kachon123]

Does this one work?

yes

 

[ImposingTiger]

But how did he even manage to take it pieces?

It was already destroyed at the end of the Saitama vs Boros fight.

 

[Kachon123]

Okay, now that I've read the scan, I can say that MK was definitely just saying that he would rather perserve his arsenal for enemies that will strike when humanity is weakened. He didn't imply that those "enemies" are stronger.

 

[Tural2004]

I guess that's one way to interpret it. I always take it as Bofoi means "that evil" is stronger than MA since he doesn't fear it.

 

[ImposingTiger]

I guess that's one way to interpret it. I always take it as Bofoi means "that evil" is stronger than MA since he doesn't fear it.

He's either referring to God or The Organization.

 

[GyroNutz]

I think a lot of this is too vague to give an exact tier, especially the stuff about lifting strength. "Likely far higher" AP seems fine to me though.

 

[Tural2004]

He's either referring to God or The Organization.

I bet it is The Organization. The second link I gave refers to multiple evils but the original one(Official one I guess) says "another kind of evil lurking in shadows, watching... waiting." This seems more like the style of Organization. Especially since it says it will attack when humanity is weakened.

 

[SunDaGamer]

Class T is invalid (already discussed above), an exact tier upgrade based on Child Emperor's statement and him looking out for another threat is too vague but "likely far higher" would be more valid

 

[Tural2004]

Huh? How an upgrade based on Child Emperor's statement is too vague? Child Emperor was his assistant and is an extraordinary genius. I am pretty sure his statement is solid enough to scale MK to low 6-B. And this scaling wouldn't condradict with anything

 

[SunDaGamer]

Huh? How an upgrade based on Child Emperor's statement is too vague? Child Emperor was his assistant and is an extraordinary genius. I am pretty sure his statement is solid enough to scale MK to low 6-B. And this scaling wouldn't condradict with anything

Child Emperor was low on sugar and was buttering up to Bofoi

 

[Tural2004]

Being on low sugar wouldn't affect his judgement that much. It is not like he suddenly became an idiot just because of it. Imagining a move that doesn't exist is one thing and I get why people don't want to scale MK to Wavemotion Cannon. But sugar level isn't excuse to why we can't scale MK to low 6-B.

was buttering up to Bofoi

Not only this is out of character for Child Emperor, he should be more than aware that he can't convince MK just like that

 

[ImposingTiger]

He's also taken brain damage

 

[Tural2004]

Lol

 

[Kachon123]

But sugar level isn't excuse to why we can't scale MK to low 6-B.

Sugar lvls is the reasoning for not scaling MK to WMC

 

[Tural2004]

But WMC is also an imaginary move which is another big reason. Sugar level alone can't nerf CE to the point where he can't judge anything correctly. Also in the panel where he says his sugar level is low, he also says he is still capable of coming with a good plan. And Atomic Samurai mentions how fast he did it. As I said above, a low sugar level doesn't suddenly make him an idiot.

 

[Qawsedf234]

1. Besides scaling to Wave Motion Cannon, Child Emperor's statement means from his perspective Metal Knight is superior to King in general who is usually seen as much more impressive than Tatsumaki who scales to low 6-B.

This doesn't work in my view, because CE hasn't seen King full strength and Tornado's full power is so far beyond everyone else you need something more behind it for scaling. Its a statement without proper information behind it.

2. He is rumored to have an immense arsenal of weapons and a robotic army, to the point where the Hero Associaton fears the idea of him going rogue (I found this one in OPM wiki)

Means nothing really. They can still stop them with their best heroes, but him going rogue means that the vast swath of their defenses and major key locations are put offline due to relying on him. Its more than just "Is strong" its "He's vital to the current running of the world order".

3. He stated what he fears isn't MA itself but another evil. Metal Knight seems to be preparing for this greater evil which means he possesses weaponry strong enough to consider himself above MA.

He hasn't seen what a fully unleashed Tornado, Orochi or Black Sperm can do. He would also have no idea about Neuron Psykos or any of the hidden monsters like the ninjas. Its a estimation based off of a lack of proper evidence.

4. He also possesses Boros' ship

This is probably fine for a "likely higher" rating

Child Emperor also witnessed Tatsumaki lifting Monster Association base which is this heavy and this was before his statement. Metal Knight was able to remove Boros' ship which is 1.6e14 kg. Both are class T.

It took metal knight hundreds of robots and multiple days to clear the ship. To scale him to either thing is like saying a group of construction workers are Class M for making a skyscraper.

So Metal Knight's speed can reasonably be scaled to Underdogman.

The reasoning here is bad but the idea behind it is fine. The wording needs to be changed basically.

When Metal Knight fired his missiles to blast the meteor, it was over 33 seconds away. That requires way more than hunderds of meters range. It is at least tens of kilometers. Besides, when the missiles of MK hit the meteor, its altitude was higher than clouds. AFAIK the wiki usually accepts clouds to be 2km high.

Also fine.

 

[Tural2004]

Wait a minute. Why are you talking about full power Tatsumaki? I am not saying he scales to her but her low 6-B feats. Elder Centipede is possibly 7-A because of Genos' statement and he is not even known for being the most reliable guy

 

[LordTracer]

Elder Centipede is possibly 7-A because of Genos' statement and he is not even known for being the most reliable guy

Y’know, there’s quite a few reasons why Genos’ statement is used there.

 

[Tural2004]

The only other reason I can think of is Gouketsu saying something along the lines of some monsters being comparable to him. But my point still stands about MK scaling to low 6-B. Why are you guys so against it anyway?

According to statements page:

A character CAN be upgraded by word of mouth alone. You just have to double check to see by how much, as well as:

• If the source of the statement is reliable? (Yes)
• If the statement conflicts with the story or feats of the character? (No, it doesn't conflict at all)
• If the statement is only valid in the context of its setting, or if it holds up in comparison with other settings?(This one isn't related)

And the story itself seems to imply that his full arsenal is a cut above most of S-class

 

[Qawsedf234]

am not saying he scales to her but her low 6-B feats.

You're going to need more evidence to scale so high without proper support. Tornado is vastly above everyone that scaling needs more evidence first.

Genos' statement and he is not even known for being the most reliable guy

Here Genks fought both Goketsu and EC and is making a comparison between the two. MK's statement is made without him knowing about the full power of multiple people in both the HA and MA.

If the source of the statement is reliable? (Yes)

That's where the issue comes from. Some of these statements are made without relevant information that would effect his scaling

 

[Tural2004]

I don't get why you bring up "full power" argument multiple times. I am not saying he scales to their full power. But Child Emperor wouldn't just say "beyond any lone hero" when he knows that Tatsumaki is above an attack that can devastate entire A-city.

Here Genks fought both Goketsu and EC and is making a comparison between the two.

I am not saying Genos is incorrect. But still he is not most realiable guy. Fighting against someone isn't only way to measure the strength. Child Emperor has been the assistant of Metal Knight and knows him very well. I don't get the point of making a baseless claim if he didn't have anything to back it up.

that would effect his scaling

Like what?

 

[Kachon123]

MK should scale to possibly Low 6-B

 

[Tural2004]

I think he should get a new key(full arsenal). And it can be something like:

Likely small country level+ (Child Emperor stated he is beyond any hero despite seeing Tatsumaki doing this and stopping a barrage from Boros' ship), possibly higher (According CE he is superior to King who is usually put above Tatsumaki. Insert other reasons)

 

[GyroNutz]

Technically if we're judging Metal Knight based on what CE thinks of other heroes, doesn't he and the other heroes believe that Tatsumaki brought down Boros' ship? Just a thought.

 

[Kachon123]

Technically if we're judging Metal Knight based on what CE thinks of other heroes, doesn't he and the other heroes believe that Tatsumaki brought down Boros' ship? Just a thought.

Boros' ship takedown was the majority of the S-class together in CE's eyes. His statement was that MK is stronger than any lone hero.

 

[GyroNutz]

Boros' ship takedown was the majority of the S-class together in CE's eyes. His statement was that MK is stronger than any lone hero.

But no other hero (apart from maybe TTM) were contributing to bringing down the ship. The other heroes even name-dropped Tatsumaki.

 

[Armorchompy]

eeeeeeh i think this is pretty damn vague, way too much to upgrade a character, disagree

 

[Tural2004]

I don't get what about the statement is vague

 

[Armorchompy]

A single character's estimation of another's strength with a very generic comparison that we interpret as an explicit statement of superiority over everything that character has seen? Pretty vague

 

[Armorchompy]

Plus "power" is hella generic, especially when spoken between two tech geniuses. For all we know MK's trump card is mustard gas or some other kinda hax

 

[Kachon123]

A single character's estimation of another's strength with a very generic comparison that we interpret as an explicit statement of superiority over everything that character has seen? Pretty vague

CE was taught by MK, possibly knows the most about him than anyone else in the S-Class, and possible even the whole HA. I think CE is reliable.

 

[Armorchompy]

Yeah so what? The concept of "power" is still too vague to be used for scaling, it could mean a dozen different things, nevermind that since CE is unable to create the same technology as MK he clearly doesn't 100% understand it.

 

[Kachon123]

Yeah so what? The concept of "power" is still too vague to be used for scaling, it could mean a dozen different things,

And what else could power in that context mean? CE prior to the statement was talking about how Cadre levels monsters are now on the surface, and how things are looking grim. He said that, since his power is above any lone hero, they need his cooperation. I'm still confused on what power could mean?

since CE is unable to create the same technology as MK he clearly doesn't 100% understand it.

The fact that he went as far as to say that is showing that CE has enough understanding to know that his power is > and standalone hero. Also, why would he need to know 100% of MK's arsenal?

 

[Armorchompy]

And what else could power in that context mean? CE prior to the statement was talking about how Cadre levels monsters are now on the surface, and how things are looking grim. He said that, since his power is above any lone hero, they need his cooperation. I'm still confused on what power could mean?

The fact that he could make like 5000 drones attack at once while every other hero is just one hero? The fact that he could have a variety of hax abilities which the heroes do not have access to? A billion other things that we can't know for sure?

The fact that he went as far as to say that is showing that CE has enough understanding to know that his power is > and standalone hero. Also, why would he need to know 100% of MK's arsenal?

CE thinks his power is > any standalone hero. If he did know his supposed tier 6 stuff so well, he'd be able to replicate it.

 

[Kachon123]

The fact that he could make like 5000 drones attack at once while every other hero is just one hero? The fact that he could have a variety of hax abilities which the heroes do not have access to? A billion other things that we can't know for sure?

These are all mental gymnastics and stretches. On the flip side, we could just take "power," as what power means.

CE thinks his power is > any standalone hero.

He knows. He saw two Low 6-B feats, and still said that MK is > them.

he'd be able to replicate it.

What? Why would CE be able to replicate it? MK was literally CE's teacher, and is implied to be one of the greatest minds in the OPM universe.