MCU Luke Cage 8-C+ upgrade

[Dinobot1996]

In Spider-Man Homecoming, the opening scene made a point of showing that Chitauri metal can pierce other Chitauri metal, such as that on Chitauri Chariots, which we currently rate as having Building level+ durability.

In the Luke Cage series, Judas Bullets have great piercing capabilities that are attributed to them having been made using Chitauri metal.

While pre-amp Luke Cage could be pierced and critically injured by Judas Bullets, post-amp Luke became more durable to the point where when he got shot by a Judas Bullet, it bounced off his skin without piercing him.

So I believe that Luke Cage (though only in his Post-Amp key) and everyone who can solidly harm him (which should consist of Diamondback, who should also get 8-C+ piercing AP with Judas Bullets in his first key in addition to upgrading his full rating in his Power Suit key, Bushmaster, and all Iron Fist users) should be upgraded from 9-A to 8-C+.

Black Sky Elektra scaling to Luke might have to be considered an outlier, though it seems iffy to fully scale her to him regardless, as she mostly seems to use superior skill against him.
She could stagger Luke, and knocked him out when he was just waking up from being drugged, (though her sword strikes were still being completely blocked with his arms without causing damage), and took a direct Iron Fist hit on two occasions, so I'm not entirely sure what the best approach would be with that. (It should probably be noted Luke didn't really start trying to fully test his physical capabilities until season 2 of the Luke Cage series, which is post-Defenders). Black Sky Elektra could probably just keep her current 9-A rating by upscaling from Jessica Jones, maybe with a 'possibly higher' added on if we want to acknowledge any of the other higher scaling.

EDIT: Or we just make Elektra a Stone Wall.

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

Why not give Black Sky Elektra "At Least Building Level (Downscaling) or Building Level+ (Direct Scaling) Durability" since she seems to be a Stone Wall type of character in contrast to the Glass Cannon that is Iron Fist.

 

[Dinobot1996]

Why not give Black Sky Elektra "At Least Building Level (Downscaling) or Building Level+ (Direct Scaling) Durability" since she seems to be a Stone Wall type of character in contrast to the Glass Cannon that is Iron Fist.

That is also a good suggestion that I don't think has any contradictions that I recall.

 

[Dalesean027]

I mean it makes sense

 

[Aguywhodoesthings]

Makes sense to me

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

EDIT: Or we just make Elektra a Stone Wall.

INB4 someone says that her suit is what allows her to tank those hits

 

[Revan_Laha]

Good

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

I agree

 

[Lacku]

Beeg agree

 

[Dinobot1996]

Does this have enough approval then?

 

[OneBleachHurricane]

You currently got two staff members' approval and the unilateral support of MCU supporters.

Maybe a third or more staff members wouldn't hurt

 

[Lonkitt]

I agree with this. The Tier 8 stuff seems fair and I already believe that the 9-B+ scaling doesn't work

My suggestion is that guys like Daredevil get changed to "At least 9-B" (TBH, there's a ton of 9-B feats we haven't added yet that would help). Black Sky Elektra being a stone wall should work

 

[Dinobot1996]

I agree with this. The Tier 8 stuff seems fair and I already believe that the 9-B+ scaling doesn't work

My suggestion is that guys like Daredevil get changed to "At least 9-B" (TBH, there's a ton of 9-B feats we haven't added yet that would help). Black Sky Elektra being a stone wall should work

Should Black Sky Elektra's AP be downgraded to 'at least 9-B+', or would she be able to upscale from Jessica Jones enough to stay 9-A?

 

[Lonkitt]

Admittedly, I can't remember how well she does against Jessica (kinda funny since I could comment on everything else). Anyone got a clip?

 

[Dinobot1996]

Admittedly, I can't remember how well she does against Jessica (kinda funny since I could comment on everything else). Anyone got a clip?

Elektra pretty much floored Jessica with one blow during their first encounter.

Elektra knocked down Jessica multiple times while also outmaneuvering Luke.

Elektra quickly knocked out Matt, Jessica and a drugged and weakened Luke in quick succession.

Jessica still got tossed around multiple times when all the Defenders fought Elektra, with Jessica only getting one good hit in at the end while Elektra is staggering back from a kick by Daredevil.

 

[Lonkitt]

Thanks for jogging my memory

Yeah, 9-A should work for Black Sky Elektra. She was able to harm Jessica without much effort in their first encounter while knocking her out after Jessica was trying to defeat her through sheer power in another battle

 

[Lonkitt]

I deleted a message because I thought I messed up on timing, but I realized this was already approved by two staff members before I even stepped in. Yeah, this can be added now assuming my timing isn't way off

 

[Propellus]

I guess this should be fine. But shouldn't this also upgrade Jen due to her fight with DD?

 

[Lonkitt]

Nah since this thread is also taking away the Black Sky scaling from guys like Daredevil

 

[Propellus]

Rip

 

[Lacku]

So this good to be applied or nah?

 

[Revan_Laha]

It's good

 

[Dinobot1996]

I guess the main thing left to get sorted out here would be figuring out concise wording for the new justifications.

 

[Lonkitt]

I guess the main thing left to get sorted out here would be figuring out concise wording for the new justifications.

For Daredevil tier guys, their wording can mostly be the same. Just remove the Black Sky Elektra stuff and adjust the rating accordingly

 

[Dinobot1996]

Removing Black Sky Elektra from scaling for 9-B characters would slightly shorten Daredevil's AP section to:
Attack Potency: At least Wall level (Comparable to Kingpin, and managed to defeat him twice, almost beating him to death the second time.[18][22] Smashed Bakuto through concrete blocks. Broke walls by pushing Kingpin through them. Broke a door by kicking a man at it. Fought with Bullseye and broke walls by kicking him through it)
Durability: At least Wall level (Survived a two-floor fall with no visible injuries. Took hits from Bullseye throwing his baton which can pierce ordinary humans. Took multiple hits from Bakuto. Took multiple hits from the Kingpin. Was relatively unharmed after Kingpin pushed him through walls and a thick table.[22] Survived a building collapsing on him. Survived a thunderclap from She-Hulk that shattered nearby car windows). Higher with suit (His Daredevil suit is resistant to knives and gunfire, and his helmet is bulletproof)

Iron Fist would get:
Attack Potency: At least Wall level (Somewhat comparable to Daredevil. Has had years of physical training and can fight multiple opponents at the same time. Broke a small table by kicking a man into it), Building level+ with the Iron Fist (Harmed Luke Cage. Smashed a steel door and sent it flying several meters away. Completely trashed a building story)
Durability: At least Wall level normally. His fist has Building level+ durability while using the Iron Fist

Colleen Wing gets:
Attack Potency: At least Wall level (Fought Bakuto, broke open a door, can fight against multiple trained opponents. Can also trade blows with comparable characters), Building level+ as Iron Fist (Should be as powerful as Danny Rand with the Iron Fist)
Durability: At least Wall level (Was able to fight while poisoned, took hits from opponents larger than her with only minor injury). Her fist has Building level+ durability as the Iron Fist

Stick gets:
Attack Potency: At least Wall level (Easily decapitated a man. Is also able to fight Daredevil, and could fight numerous trained Hand ninjas)
Durability: At least Wall level (Withstood hits from Daredevil, survived being brutally tortured by the Hand)

Elektra should get changed to:
Attack Potency: At least Wall level (Was able to fight off highly trained Hand Ninjas, is comparable to Daredevil) | Small Building level (Superior to Jessica Jones and Daredevil)
Durability: At least Wall level | Building level+ (Tanked a direct hit from the Iron Fist on two occasions)

I guess the best approach for Luke Cage's profile would be something like:
Attack Potency: Wall level+ (Comparable to Jessica Jones) | Building level+ (Can trade blows with characters who can harm and draw blood from him, such as Diamondback and Bushmaster)
Durability: Wall level+ (Survived the destruction of his bar and walked out with no apparent injury and getting caught in a rocket launcher explosion that collapsed a building on him. Power saws and drills break against his skin) | Building level+ (Stated to be more durable than before, and was no longer harmed at all by Judas Bullets, which are made of Chitauri metal, which has been demonstrated to be capable of piercing other Chitauri metal, such as that of Chariots. Tanked an explosion. Unharmed by a grenade exploding in his hand)

Diamondback gets:
Attack Potency: Street level (Briefly fought an injured Luke Cage), up to Building level+ with weapons (Fire Judas Bullets, which are made of Chitauri metal, which has been demonstrated to be capable of piercing other Chitauri metal, such as that of Chariots.) | Building level+ (Overpowered Luke Cage and made him bleed)
Durability: Street level (Can survive falls from great heights. Took held-back hits from Luke Cage) | Building level+ (Withstood a beating from Luke Cage)

Bushmaster gets: (Though I'm not sure if the separate rating for bullets should be kept)
Attack Potency: Building level+ (Fought on par with Luke Cage after his second experiment, and even managed to stagger him with his blows), higher with increased doses (Easily defeated Luke Cage, and held the advantage against him and Misty Knight {with a prosthetic arm} at the same time)
Durability: Building level+ (Withstood multiple hits from Luke Cage. Survived the explosion of a Hammertech device while weakened, though he was critically injured), Wall level against Bullets (Bullets only embed themselves in his skin, dealing superficial damage), higher with increased doses

The remaining characters should all be 9-B characters that would just need to get their 'likely Wall level+' stuff removed from their AP sections (So Punisher, Bakuto, Zhou Cheng, Bullseye, Kingpin, Jigsaw, and John Pilgrim)

 

[Qawsedf234]

Spider-Man Homecoming came out in 2017 and Luke Cage S2 came out in 2018.

So even if we consider any Netflix canon stuff, the series when made would consider Spider-Man as canonical material.

To get to the point. I think the change is fine and I'd just recommend making Elektra a stone wall.

 

[Propellus]

So even if we consider any Netflix canon stuff, the series when made would consider Spider-Man as canonical material.

But then again currently speaking, this was confirmed in She-Hulk that the netflix stuff being canon to the MCU was the case

 

[Lonkitt]

The Netflix stuff is still canon, yeah

 

[Marvel_Champion_07]

Removing Black Sky Elektra from scaling for 9-B characters would slightly shorten Daredevil's AP section to:
Attack Potency: At least Wall level (Comparable to Kingpin, and managed to defeat him twice, almost beating him to death the second time.[18][22] Smashed Bakuto through concrete blocks. Broke walls by pushing Kingpin through them. Broke a door by kicking a man at it. Fought with Bullseye and broke walls by kicking him through it)
Durability: At least Wall level (Survived a two-floor fall with no visible injuries. Took hits from Bullseye throwing his baton which can pierce ordinary humans. Took multiple hits from Bakuto. Took multiple hits from the Kingpin. Was relatively unharmed after Kingpin pushed him through walls and a thick table.[22] Survived a building collapsing on him. Survived a thunderclap from She-Hulk that shattered nearby car windows). Higher with suit (His Daredevil suit is resistant to knives and gunfire, and his helmet is bulletproof)

Iron Fist would get:
Attack Potency: At least Wall level (Somewhat comparable to Daredevil. Has had years of physical training and can fight multiple opponents at the same time. Broke a small table by kicking a man into it), Building level+ with the Iron Fist (Harmed Luke Cage. Smashed a steel door and sent it flying several meters away. Completely trashed a building story)
Durability: At least Wall level normally. His fist has Building level+ durability while using the Iron Fist

Colleen Wing gets:
Attack Potency: At least Wall level (Fought Bakuto, broke open a door, can fight against multiple trained opponents. Can also trade blows with comparable characters), Building level+ as Iron Fist (Should be as powerful as Danny Rand with the Iron Fist)
Durability: At least Wall level (Was able to fight while poisoned, took hits from opponents larger than her with only minor injury). Her fist has Building level+ durability as the Iron Fist

Stick gets:
Attack Potency: At least Wall level (Easily decapitated a man. Is also able to fight Daredevil, and could fight numerous trained Hand ninjas)
Durability: At least Wall level (Withstood hits from Daredevil, survived being brutally tortured by the Hand)

Elektra should get changed to:
Attack Potency: At least Wall level (Was able to fight off highly trained Hand Ninjas, is comparable to Daredevil) | Small Building level (Superior to Jessica Jones and Daredevil)
Durability: At least Wall level | Building level+ (Tanked a direct hit from the Iron Fist on two occasions)

I guess the best approach for Luke Cage's profile would be something like:
Attack Potency: Wall level+ (Comparable to Jessica Jones) | Building level+ (Can trade blows with characters who can harm and draw blood from him, such as Diamondback and Bushmaster)
Durability: Wall level+ (Survived the destruction of his bar and walked out with no apparent injury and getting caught in a rocket launcher explosion that collapsed a building on him. Power saws and drills break against his skin) | Building level+ (Stated to be more durable than before, and was no longer harmed at all by Judas Bullets, which are made of Chitauri metal, which has been demonstrated to be capable of piercing other Chitauri metal, such as that of Chariots. Tanked an explosion. Unharmed by a grenade exploding in his hand)

Diamondback gets:
Attack Potency: Street level (Briefly fought an injured Luke Cage), up to Building level+ with weapons (Fire Judas Bullets, which are made of Chitauri metal, which has been demonstrated to be capable of piercing other Chitauri metal, such as that of Chariots.) | Building level+ (Overpowered Luke Cage and made him bleed)
Durability: Street level (Can survive falls from great heights. Took held-back hits from Luke Cage) | Building level+ (Withstood a beating from Luke Cage)

Bushmaster gets: (Though I'm not sure if the separate rating for bullets should be kept)
Attack Potency: Building level+ (Fought on par with Luke Cage after his second experiment, and even managed to stagger him with his blows), higher with increased doses (Easily defeated Luke Cage, and held the advantage against him and Misty Knight {with a prosthetic arm} at the same time)
Durability: Building level+ (Withstood multiple hits from Luke Cage. Survived the explosion of a Hammertech device while weakened, though he was critically injured), Wall level against Bullets (Bullets only embed themselves in his skin, dealing superficial damage), higher with increased doses

The remaining characters should all be 9-B characters that would just need to get their 'likely Wall level+' stuff removed from their AP sections (So Punisher, Bakuto, Zhou Cheng, Bullseye, Kingpin, Jigsaw, and John Pilgrim)

I think we can start applying the changes, yes?

 

[Dinobot1996]

I think we can start applying the changes, yes?

If someone can go through all the relevant profiles to apply the changes, then yes, I don't think there's anything else that needs to be figured out.