Masadaverse Discussion thread 29

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

I just made 4-A as a spitball, I have more ground for the 5-A. And you are literally telling me to leave the entire forum due to a singular guess based upon a statement. This is a wiki for debating, not for ad hominid attacks. So calm down so we can have an actual discussion on the Discussio Thread.

 

[EMS-TC02_Phantom]

Point out where exactly i'm being angry? Though i'll ignore this in part to it being irrelevant to the discussion at hand

Your still bogus math that doesn't elaborate even a single shit.

Doesn't really change that fact that your calc is banking on a baseless assumption and using another mountain for "baseline value" still doesn't address the issue that we still don't know shit about Zahhak's topography to even being sure that calc is close to being accurate or not

Nothing burger is all you post so far, really.

Here's an easier task. Why don't you simply bring just one thing, anything, that can be contrued into Munsarat being anywhere close to being 4-A or Spenta Mainyu being 3-A? Should be easy enough if you're this much of a brick wall about this right?

Assuming you're also not a cheapskate who don't even back the novel on Enty as otherwise this entire fiasco is largely pointless because i'm literally talking to a guy who knows nothing about what hes talking about nor has he the access to it

 

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

"His gushing out life pressure surpasses that of the Workshop of Destruction from back when Bahlavan last clashed with him, 700 years ago"

"This was the shine of most luminous intensity in the entire universe, exceeding the energy a star may produce in its entire lifetime, and receiving direct fire from it will destroy even stars situated tens of thousands of light years away. And even then, that's just an after-effect."

This is where I get 3-A Spenta from, this was taken from Treflexa's summary here: https://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/shinza-banshou-respect-thread.315898/page-61

On Post #1511, from Chapter 5: The Hero's Festival

 

[EMS-TC02_Phantom]

******* actual excerpt from the novel

 

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

Where exactly:

"Do come back again when you have something much more concrete. Until that happened this is nothing more than your miscontrued fanfics garbage"

"Your still bogus math that doesn't elaborate even a single shit."

"here is this nonexistent math that you only mentioned but never elaborated then? Never mind that comparing Munsarat to the Locust is equally braindead given the latter were known to be actively grinding their powerlevel for at least 5 centuries"

"******* actual excerpt from the novel"

"Assuming you're also not a cheapskate who don't even back the novel on Enty as otherwise this entire fiasco is largely pointless because i'm literally talking to a guy who knows nothing about what hes talking about nor has he the access to it"

Huh, I wonder where it could come across that you're angry.

==========================
I am not angry that you disagree, I am just pointing out that you've been a complete arse from the start, and sound like you are absolutely livid. You call me a brick wall, but you are just saying, "lol fanfic, f*** off you poor noob" you're a bloody muppet you are.

===========================
I have read Trex's summaries, which are very in depth, to the point that they seem to include nearly everything apart from Masada's flowery text. I have also read all of the profile pages, scans that I could find, Summaries and Glossaries, etc.

 

[EMS-TC02_Phantom]

******* actual excerpt from the novel

Can you read? No? Then shut the hell up. You're bringing essentially nothing noteworthy with your fanfics thus far. Summary is summary, i asked you specifically for an actual excerpt, which a summary is not. Can you provide one? No? It's as simple as that

Let's for a second goes with what trexalfa also thinks then

https://forums.spacebattles.com/thr...onia-goddesses-gauntlet.827788/#post-65198443

Not even your idol you're so shamelessly banking on for your fanfic thinks the way you do

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

Chill man, no need to get angry and throw a fit just because he does not have the original text. This is all thus far speculations and nothing else based on the info he has available.

 

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

I literally took back what I said about 4-A Munsarat. Even when I said it before it was not a calc, my calc got to 5-A Munsarat, and even than I am aware its a guess.

You are so angry that you are ignoring the fact that I DON'T think that Munsarat is that high. And I do not Idolize Trexalfa, I got part of my knowledge on the evolution of the phonology of Germanic languages, but I do not idolize Jacob Grimm. I also never thought that he was comparable to the Locusts, I admit that I worded my statement wierd and I can see how you would misconstrue what I meant.

You also keep on saying Fanfic but you don't put the text up yourself to show that he is not at such levels. You are asking me for an excerpt, and denouncing everything as I could not give it, but you yourself feels as if you don't need anything to denounce it.

Anyway in the same thread that you showed he stated that Vahram couldn't beat Munsarat, and Vahram is the same guy who slew the previous 4th, 5th, and 7th Maou.

 

[EMS-TC02_Phantom]

I'm relatively chill. Though i admit it got pretty annoying when he just went on with using another user for a shield when i already asked him for an explicit excerpt, something we now know he can't necessarily provide.

A speculation which i've addressed. Him still being adamant on it when it's getting clear he doesn't really know what hes talking about is when it became an issue

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

Mate, no offense, but with the kind of responses you were posting you seem like a very angry and obnoxious person.

You know, there is a reason why this thread is a general discussion one, not a full on revision thread, this is to talk what you think about the works we see and the characters not to create profiles and implement everything everyone posts here.

In short, just knock down the angry/annoying responses

 

[EMS-TC02_Phantom]

Fanfics----
You also keep on saying Fanfic but you don't put the text up yourself to show that he is not at such levels. You are asking me for an excerpt, and denouncing everything as I could not give it, but you yourself feels as if you don't need anything to denounce it.

Anyway in the same thread that you showed he stated that Vahram couldn't beat Munsarat, and Vahram is the same guy who slew the previous 4th, 5th, and 7th Maou.

Fanfics not really worth addressing

I don't have to prove a negative. It's you who need to provide excerpt for literally every assertion you make. Which you're still not providing now

In the same thread i've linked the only think noted was how Varhram can't put down Munsarat, not that he can't beat the glasses Satsujinki. If you actually read the glossary and summary like you yourself claimed you'd notice how Varhram do what he did through Zamyad Yast, which trexalfa also noted in very much the same thread even

So not only you have a penchant for writing fanfics, you're also bad at reading comprehension now? Colour me surprised

 

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

You may think you are chill, but you came across as very pissed off from your very first message. You should just watch how you sound, as you just sound like an a**hole. That is why I am getting frusturated, is that you immediatly went to anger and mudslinging, and do not want to have any kind of conversation.

Tone is hard to get across on the internet, and you always come across as angry, even when I see your messages to others. If you actually didn't mean to be agressive from the start than I apologize for responding to you with agression.

Also, I am only giving numbers to the feats stated by Trex, I am not using him as a shield, but rather am giving numbers to the information he provided. If you want to attack somebody for fanfiction, you should go to him.

I also would go on ENTY, but I don't exactly have finances for a subscription service and my Japanese is only on the level of reading bloody Momotaro. Spoken it's higher, but my Kanji isn't the best. And Masada is known for being quite hard to read, and thus even if I paid on enty I wouldn't be able to read it without extensive use of Jisho and Google Translate, and we all know how accurate Google Translate is for complex texts.

 

[EMS-TC02_Phantom]

Excerpts. Provide one or simply drop your whole entire fiasco. Simple enough

 

[Infera28]

chill down EMS. no need to insulting people over thinking a character is 5-A or Reinhard erased mysteries of nights and not destroying them (in my case). also it isn't our fault. because according to summary Munsarat changed alignment of stars (maybe it was a hyperbole but we don't know. because we are reading summary not japanese untranslated story) and in no way, shape or form insulting someone overbeing misinformed is ok.

however i agree using Mount Fuji for tiering is wrong. if we don't know exact size of something then we need to using a average/small mountain for calculating not large mountain.

volume of small mountain: 7.586e14

subatomic destruction: 5.403E13 (j/cc)

7.586e14*5.403e13 = 4.0987158e28 or 6-A Continent level

now we know Munsarat also was capable of rotating saturn sized planet

but i can't calculate it. someone can ask a member of calculation group

 

[EMS-TC02_Phantom]

He didn't. You can check trexalfa's summary for chapter 4 part 1, CTRL+F "alignment" and it'll give you nothing. The only part when Munsarat pulls his pizza slicer and flare up his Power of Ego and that act having a direct consequence on Zahhak is merely ******* up its rotation. Nothing about knocking it away out of alignment. If you're going to work off of summary written by other people at least read them right

 

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

Anyway, this isn't a CRT, my Munsarat tier had more assumptions. I was mostly giving numbers for fun, and I already took back what I said about the stars, you seem to be the one with a low reading comprehension.

Lets just drop this subject, that way you will stop with your immature ranting. You can continue fuming all you want, but you won't hear another response out of me, it isn't worth the energy to try to get my point across,

 

[EMS-TC02_Phantom]

Yea let's drop all Avesta talk unless anyone who initiates it actually knows what they're talking about and/or at least have an access to the text itself, rather than posting just about anything based on secondhand info that they can't even confirm themselves

 

[Infera28]

according to one of my friends:

Saturns rotational energy around the sun in the solar system is 2.65 x 10^34 Joules you can find this by the equation (E = -GMm/r)

Saturn orbital energy is 1.22 x 10^34 Joules. You can find that with the equation ( 1/2 × moment of inertia × angular velocity squared )

this implies Munsarat feat is 5-B Planet level

but ******* rotation is vague tho

 

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

To Inferna, that would be for one mountain, and it said it was for a range. So I tried two values, the 48 Mountains in the Himalayas and the 156 of the Alps, which are the median of mountain ranges in terms of length. I got an average of 102. Lets round that to 100.

4e30 | Low 5-B

Or just go with the 48,

1.9e30 | Low 5-B

Lets look at one of the smallest ranges, the Balkan Mountain Range at 6 Mountains:

2.45e29 | 5-C

So I would say he is 5-C to Low 5-B, likely Higher. As due to Zamyad Yasht his power fluxuates depending on the situation.

I do agree I highballed it with using Fuji.

Yes, Rotation is vague, and as we don't know how the solar system that Zahak resides in is structured, or the length of their days, so we can only make an assumption based upon Saturn.

Anyway, I said I'll drop it so that is the last thing I would say.

 

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

We need somebody to change the Second Heaven's page to Magsarion, and change the Masadaverse link to Shinra Banshou. We did it to Mithra, but not Muzan's.

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

Are we completely sure Mags is Muzan?

 

[Infera28]

also now that concluded in IwKB Reinhard was destroying Methuselah and not erasing him we need to removing Methuselah's resistance to existence erasure? or it possibly can be remained? because even after destroying the very reason and core of his existence (mysteries of nights) for a specfic period of time he was keep alive and moving

 

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

He is literally refered to as muzan and muzanmuki and his idealolgy exactly lines up. It is so heavily foreshadowed that it might as well be confirmed. Magsarion has also started showing Hadou-like properties since The Hero's Festival.

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

He is literally refered to as muzan and muzanmuki and his idealolgy exactly lines up. It is so heavily foreshadowed that it might as well be confirmed. Magsarion has also started showing Hadou-like properties since The Hero's Festival.

For all I care they can call him God and he wouldn't be the second heaven. Being foreshadowed and all does not confirm he is Muzan. Let's just wait till we get confirmation he is (Unless you want info that may be wrong in the long run in the profiles)

 

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

Yeah, I just highly doubt that he won't turn out to be Muzan. Wouldn't you agree that it is very likely?

Even Japanese readers already consider them the same individuals.

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

M8, I'm like 90% sure he is Muzan or at the very least part of "Muzan"

Oh I'm excited to see how everything falls

 

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

I think that, due to his appearence in KKK, Muzan might be a combination of Magsarion and Sirius. Though that could be Samsara Vartin being either ignorant or just manipulating information.

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

Shush, I haven't read the summaries in a while so no spoilers

 

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

Okay, though I didn't spoil anything in my reply. Well, theories don't count as spoilers, I may be right, I may be wrong. We will just have to wait and see.

 

[Shining_Trapezohedron]

Heck, both Magsarion and Muzan have the same VA as well if Masada were to have the former be voiced. So its possible but then again, I am not exactly sure either as Sirius too is consider a candidate by some people.

 

[EMS-TC02_Phantom]

Are we completely sure Mags is Muzan?

There's no official clarification thus far IIRC. But we have several things to go by

Back when the Pantheon countdowns were coming out, some of the characters' name were abbreviated into some letters. In Muzan's case it was MGS, which kinda fits Magsarion

Magsarion within the story is described several times with words like muzanmuki and muzan, which all correspond to Muzan's law as a god

Prior to chapter 5, it was pretty widely accepted that Magsarion = Muzan by the fanbase

Things get weird when chapter 5 was released. Long story short, Magsarion turns out to still have some form of regret/remorse when Muzan's whole schtick is to be absolutely remorseless and shameless. Both Magsarion and Sirius have this distortion-like power which **** the principle of the universe itself, with the latter's effect being that the people under its influence turning into shameless people people who don't reflect back on their own life or the life of others (which is basically the universal principle behind Paradise Lost, the 2nd Heaven after Ahura Mazda). Description about how both Magsarion and Sirius are detached from the universe's principle. Imagery of Varhram sitting on a "Throne" of the Ruler (with the kanji Õ║º between apostrophe), followed by Sirius' thought about how Varhram would do better in taking down the god than he could ever do. Sirius wanting to become shameless and creating a shameless and remorseless world. The furigana above the word "world" was muzan when Magsarion was referring to the idea of world that Sirius envisioned. And probably some other stuff i'm forgetting right now

It becomes kinda muddled. The notion that Magsarion = Muzan becomes sort of shaky at that point. The most popular theory regarding Muzan's identity as a god right now is that the god we know as Muzan is some form of amalgamation between Varhram (Muzan's appearance), Magsarion (Muzan's personality) and Sirius (Muzan's Law and Hegemony)

So who knows

 

[Tony_di_bugalu]

And this is something I didn't knew, wew, shit is getting more interesting

 

[Sephiron000]

Lmao, Muzan's name in the Saoshyant Desatir script is literally written as Òâ×Òé░ÒéÁÒâ¬Òé¬Òâ│.

 

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

I think something would happen to make him regress to a stage of complete remorselessness. There are theories that Vahram went through Tentsui and became Aka Manah. Magsarion might see Aka Manah, as his brother, and through feelings of betrayal and the like lose the remorsefullness and shame he once felt.

 

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

Though I do see the combonation. In KKK he is shown as an old man, fitting with Sirius, and would give a reason for Samsara Vartin to depict him as such. We don't know what Magsarion looks like yet, and I don't see too much of a resembelance between Muzan and Vahram.

I think it might of just been Magsarion and Sirius amalgamating.

 

[Infera28]

we need to making a profile for Gladsheim (because now LLT has a profile too). especially seeing Gladhsheim's core/controller is a alive being callled Issak and Gladsheim also showed capability in independently speaking, thinking and moving (constantly speaking with Reinhard and giving his opinions to him, appearing as a obstacle against Reinhard and getting erased by him in Marie Route, attacking Kei and Ren in Rea Route and later talking with Ren and Rea).

his tier can be country level in IwKB, Mountain with 1-7 Swastikas and High Outerversal with Seals removed and starting to devouring creation/Atziluth.

 

[Infera28]

https://vsbattles.com/vsbattles/4125576

 

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

Why does @wiki give two CVs to various characters, like Tenma Tokoyo being listed as Fuka Hinami and Hitomi Nabatame? Is it that they got Nabatame to to the censored version? As I looked on her wikipedia and it does seem that way, as she was only listed as Rea in Amantes Amentes and only as Tenma Tokoyo on Akebeno no Hikari.

 

[IrrelevantTurtle]

Sirius was meant to be a vessel for Varhram's infinite miracles so it makes sense if he becomes a Hadou God's body.

 

[Zoey_of_Scadrial]

That does indeed make sense, diden't think of that, but that does work out quite well.

Though he is shown as being much younger in Saoshyant Desatir. Which is why it might be more complicated than that. Or just a retcon. But I am giving the benefit of the doubt and trying to find a way where both work out.