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Mario 3-A/Low 2-C Upgrade

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The guide says he was going to destroy and recreate the universe to rule over it with peach for 10000 years

The game makes no mention of this and his goal was much lower end. The guide is stating completely unmentioned information in an attempt to hype up the battle. In other words its hype text and shouldn't be used
 
ChocomilkAlex said:
Didn't Rosalina recreate the entire universe in Mario Galaxy because of the black hole that Bowser created at the end of the game? If so then Mario being able to kick Bowser's ass would justify at least a 3-A rating.
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It's actually not stated in the game or the guide that she recreated the universe, she only shielded Mario and Peach from the destruction of it
 
Mephistus said:
Explain how all the celestial bodies in the sky facing us that used to be there are gone show its only galactic level then.

Again its explained in 1st person.
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That's the blackhole thing bowser does after you win that Rosalina has to save you from so even if it was universal it wouldn't scale to anyone's physical stats.

Also just showing the celestial bodies that we can see disappear doesn't mean its univeral at all. Unless you mean to say that we can see every celestial body in the entire universe there
 
The universe was literally being destroyed. If Rosalina didn't re-create it, why was the universe fine and dandy 20 seconds after the black hole? If you continue to say that she didn't, this just further proves that the Galaxy Reactor can re-create the universe.
 
Unoriginal Memes said:
The universe was literally being destroyed. If Rosalina didn't re-create it, why was the universe fine and dandy 20 seconds after the black hole? If you continue to say that she didn't, this just further proves that the Galaxy Reactor can re-create the universe.
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So do you have scans or a part of a video where it is stated in game that the universe was being destroyed because right now for universal there is literally only the guide
 
"fate of the universe" is the name of the level for gosh sakes.

The entire universe is at the end getting nommed by the black hole and remade.
 
"Big bang attack" is the name of an attack Vegeta has. Do you see the problem with just using names?

The black hole at the end isn't shown or stated to be eating the whole universe though.

If it is please provide scans besides the guide which support that it is universal in scale instead of the scale which Bowser himself states it is
 
You haven't shown that the guide is unreliable given you are stating its misquoting Bowser, when its 1st person exposition about his plans.

The universe being affected is apparent.

If he's bringing about a new cosmos, a new galaxy being made is part of that. It contradicts nothing.
 
We have shown that the guide is unreliable though based on the fact it's not actually supported by what happens in game, the claims it makes go against what Bowser said etc.

The universe being affected isn't shown at all though. Celestial bodies disappearing in no way supports universal scale especially when the stated scale was around galactic anyway
 
That's what is supported by in game statements for the machine and what could reasonably be assumed for the black hole without jumping up to universal with almost no backing
 
Like, the effects of the black hole reached Mario's planet, which was remade.

The distance between the levels / to the center of the universe from mario's planet are easily multi galactic.

To state its not universal in scale in the ending scene and to call the name of the final level hyperbole is pretty reaching.
 
It could be called "fate of the universe" because Bowser was planning to conquer the universe with his army.
 
Starship Mario crosses through portals and along the way goes through a galaxy and a galactic cluster level in SMG2 to reach the same center location. Its not limited to galactic distances affected, that much is certain.
 
So then it's multi galaxy distances that the game supports like we already agreed

@generic

There is no universal stuff to downgrade though? He is currently rated 3-C max for this key
 
Since you're arguing that the black hole is only multi-galaxy level it would effect Rosalina and A Gentle Pull who scale to being superior to multiple Luma who were able to recreate the world after the black hole destroyed everything
 
Genericstickman said:
Since you're arguing that the black hole is only multi-galaxy level it would effect Rosalina and A Gentle Pull who scale to being superior to multiple Luma who were able to recreate the world after the black hole destroyed everything
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Well that might be needed since the scan used to justify Rosalina's ap is also from a strategy guide that I'm pretty sure isn't backed by in game stuff.

In addition to the fact its from a strategy guide the actual scan doesn't say anything about destroying or recreating the universe it only states that the blast "threatened the fabric of the universe" and that Rosalina shielded Mario and basically reality warped to save stuff

None of that actually actually warrants low 2-C ap unless I missed something
 
First of all, the universal feat is Low 2-C. The scans said something about the Universe being "Reset". Which "resetting" a universe inherently implies warping time and space; and it's the same feat Rosalina has. However, I disagree with including it on the Power Stars key. For one, Mario didn't use the power of the Power Stars in the fight; only the ship was but that's more so increase in range and stamina. Power star is High 4-C to 3-C based on the feats from the Lumas and Bowser still has his 3-C low end with Grand Star.

Anyway, I don't think any changes need to be made here.
 
The scan for the Rosalina thing actually doesn't mention a reset

It mentions the cycles of life, birth, death etc and then talks about Rosalina saving Mario and sending him into a bright light and the universe showing its power and him waking up

again this scan comes from a strategy guide too and isn't supported by in game stuff
 
It did say "Fabric of Existence"; which Fabric of the Universe according to this article does imply space-time. Edit, noticed it was already brought up. Also, I believe there've been multiple discussions about this; and I noticed Azathoth is one of the people who implied she's Low 2-C. She was 3-A a long time ago, but Azzy upgraded it a long time ago.
 
As pointed out in this thread "fabric of the universe" has many different possible meanings based on different theories of our universe

If wanna be specific it also says the blast threatened the fabric of existence and as we saw in the Bill threads threatening something isn't enough for a rating.

It never specifies that the blast actually managed to destroy everything and it especially doesn't state that Rosalina remade it, infact it specifies that it was the universe's power not her power.
 
In a general consensus, and especially in Japan; the modern definition of Universe is all time and space. Ultima Reality and Sera explained this in good detail. Dragon Ball is one of the few Japanese universes that has Universe described as a giant collection of galaxies or what's supposed to be the definition of Cosmos. And Goku's feat outright only says all physical matter in the universe; not the entire universe. Which of course is different. Here, it's literally the entire universe is being reset.

Also, Rosalina is still the one warping the Universe in the first place. Meaning if it's mentioning the universe's power, hers is even greater.
 
^ this

It is not stated anywhere in the scan that she is responsible for anything other than protecting Mario
 
I'm pretty sure Cal might have more to say whom I informed via Discord; I know Dino is really tired of discussing that topic.
 
I pretty much disagree with this upgrade mostly because of what other scans said about Rosalina protecting the main cast and the Inconsistency of Mario's feats.
 
People, pay attention. This is for the Power Stars. Not base stats. Anyway, I'm only going to reply the following for the time being:

@VioletVoid100 Poor analogy. King Boo is one of the most formidable recurring opponents in the franchise, especially in the Luigi's Mansion series. And the only reason Mario was caught in SPP is the Vibe Septer, which the Hammer Bros (Not Koopa) were able to use to raid the kingdom. Also, stop using the "random mook beat protagonist" PIS in a franchise where the characters clearly are stronger. It's not a valid argument in any verse and it's outright downplay.

@DDM Actually, Bowser with the Grand Star is simply just 3-C. He's only Low 2-C with the black hole. I do agree with many of the issues you brought up, hence why I'm rather hesistant about this myself.

Ask for the feat, I'm not to sure about the Power Stars itself due to the fact they weren't involved in the battle. I'm going have to look back to make sure but for now, I'm going to have to decline on the upgrade. On the other hand, this does mean we can make Bowser with the Grand Star outright 3-A/Low 2-C now. We can also note it in Rosalina's page due to her association with them via creator/owner. I'll use these scans on my day off when I begin editting the pages since I have a conference to attend this afternoon.
 
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