Major Fire Emblem Heroes Revisions (Part 6): Hax, Heroes Profiles/Keys + Clean Up

[TheGatememer]

Surtr could probably qualify for NEP, given the fact that he has no soul

Maybe, but I'm not quite sure how that would work

 

[JustSomeWeirdo]

I mean, if having a soul is the only thing stopping the other Hel residents from having NEP, it might not prevent Surtr from having it

Of course it's probably debatable at best

 

[TheGatememer]

So it seems that basically everything but the Hel NEP and Contract Porbability manip seems accepted so far.

 

[TheGatememer]

Bump

 

[TheGatememer]

bump (please I want my 2-A reinhardt)

 

[TheGatememer]

Bump

 

[Theglassman12]

Why would this be a regeneration thing and not a healing thing? If he needed healing spells to come back that doesn't sound like a regeneration thing that every single character would have.

affecting one's existence doesn't really tell me it's concept manipulation. The wording very much tells me it's mind control or body puppetry of some sorts if the character is directly controlling him to do whatever they please.

I don't exactly see how it being in the legacy or archanea book makes it canon, also Sakurai doesn't work for intelligence system and he even said if you include FEH so he's making a guesstimate there, so again I wouldn't use Sakurai for proof, if anyone in Intelligence system confirms WoG to exist then fine. Being summoned from the games doesn't automatically make it canon though, by that logic Xenoverse is canon to mainline dragon ball because you get to explore and get the main canon characters to help you in the game, again some word of god, or flat out mentions of the events in Heroes being canon in other games would help for the canonicity.

the abstract existence I don't really see it, at best it sounds like type 8 immortality if they're reliant on dreams to exist and some form of non corporeal.

Yeah no that's not nonexistent physiology, to get NEP you literally need a statement to not exist or to be a literal void. just saying they're in a weird state isn't enough for NEP.

the rest is fine.

 

[JustSomeWeirdo]

It would scale to the regeneration that some characters do have, as staves and skills like renewal are comparable, not a thing "everyone" has

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Yeah, Renewal and Imbue would be regeneration; obviously using heal staves and vulneraries are just healing. And in Radiant Dawn, simply holding staves causes regeneration. Thrones and Gates are also just game mechanics.

 

[TheGatememer]

Why would this be a regeneration thing and not a healing thing? If he needed healing spells to come back that doesn't sound like a regeneration thing that every single character would have.

Not everyone would have it, it would just apply to those with passive healing. Basically just see what JSW and DDM said.

affecting one's existence doesn't really tell me it's concept manipulation. The wording very much tells me it's mind control or body puppetry of some sorts if the character is directly controlling him to do whatever they please.

It's not mind manipulation since Eir herself doesn't want to obey Hel, since even in the quote I provided, it shows Eir doesn't want to carry out Hel's orders. The only reason that Eir follows her orders is because she believes that Hel is her mother. It's the entire reason why Hel erased Hel's memories, to make her believe that she was her mother, and make her compliant.

It's not body puppetry either, since Hel isn't actively controlling Eir, she is just making orders that Eir is incapable (or rather she thinks is incapable) of disobeying. And I already explained previously why that isn't Mind Manipulation. Eir's very being/existence was altered to make it impossible for Eir to actually oppose her.

I don't exactly see how it being in the legacy or archanea book makes it canon, also Sakurai doesn't work for intelligence system and he even said if you include FEH so he's making a guesstimate there, so again I wouldn't use Sakurai for proof, if anyone in Intelligence system confirms WoG to exist then fine. Being summoned from the games doesn't automatically make it canon though, by that logic Xenoverse is canon to mainline dragon ball because you get to explore and get the main canon characters to help you in the game, again some word of god, or flat out mentions of the events in Heroes being canon in other games would help for the canonicity.

I said this in a previous comment, but it's shown in Both the Legacy of Archanea book and Cipher banner (Both of which are from IS) that Heroes is listed alongside the rest of the mainline games. If Heroes wasn't considered a core game, or if the purpose was just to list all the games, in either of the things I just mentioned, either Heroes wouldn't be listed, or TMS #FE and Warriors would also be included alongside the rest of the games. But that isn't the case, and Heroes is listed alongside the rest of the mainline games.

Even if Sakurai doesn't work for IS, he is still a high ranking employee at Nintendo, and would probably know what IS considers mainline. He probably said "if you include FEH" , because most people in the Fire Emblem community consider FEH a spin-off. Not to mention, right afterwards, he mentions the remakes alongside Heroes, so he really isn't guessimating here, considering that the remakes are definitely canon. It's also said in the trailer that spin-offs are excluded, so Nintendo themselves is basically saying that Heroes isn't a spinoff. Keep in mind that this isn't like a tweet that Sakurai is making, it is included in an official Nintendo video presentation. It would probably not be included if what Sakurai was saying wasn't true. And all of what has been said here lines up with The Legacy of Archanea book, and Cipher banner.

the abstract existence I don't really see it, at best it sounds like type 8 immortality if they're reliant on dreams to exist and some form of non corporeal.

It's stated that they are a type of dream/nightmare themselves. As such, if people cease to dream, they will stop existing. It's not soley the fact that they are reliant on dreams to keep existing.

Yeah no that's not nonexistent physiology, to get NEP you literally need a statement to not exist or to be a literal void. just saying they're in a weird state isn't enough for NEP.

I mean, Corrin themselves says that either they truly exist, or they are just someone's dream. As I explained, the latter is true. They don't truly exist in a conventional sense due to existing as a dream/idea, which qualifies for NEP Type 1, as said on the page itself.

the rest is fine.

Okay. And thanks for responding.

 

[Theglassman12]

So It would only scale to the healers then? I’m fine with that.

again that’s way too vague to assume conceptual manipulation. Also saying they aren’t able to disobey orders and it not being mind manipulation sounds like body puppetry to me. You need an actual mention on his concept being affected in order for this to work as concept hax.

Again you need some of the other games in the series to acknowledge the existence of Heroes as well for this to be canon. It’s the main reason why Dissidia is accepted as canon in final fantasy because we have numerous games and extended lore flat out confirm Dissidia is a canonical game in the series. The remakes also take precedent over the original games so the original 3 games don’t exactly count anymore. Like I said we need an actual employee from IS to confirm it’s canonicity to have this be Valid. If Sakurai did the same thing for either Kirby or kid Icarus then his word holds weight since he’s the creator of those games, but he’s not for FE.

So again, type 8 immortality. Being a dream at best would make you non corporeal. If they’re stated to be the embodiment of dreams themselves then sure but that’s the most I’m seeing from these dreams.

That again isn’t NEP. The fact you agreed Corrin’s latter point is true when the former mentions him not existing doesn’t help your case. You need an actual statement that they blatantly don’t exist or be a literal void.

 

[JustSomeWeirdo]

FEH actually goes out of its way several times to make sure it's not mentioned in other games.

Summoning may take the character from any point, but when they get sent back home they're put in the exact point they were summoned from. (Also a good number of Heroes summoned are actually dead)

Also, in Lost Lore, the Order of Heroes is making sure that their actions aren't at all changing the events of the other games

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

Basically using feats from all other FE games can apply to Heroes; not that it matters too much since FE Heroes has its own feats far surpassing all those other games. But using FE Heroes feats to scale any other FE game is the part that is a hard no. But I don't think anyone is doing the latter.

 

[deonment]

So again, type 8 immortality. Being a dream at best would make you non corporeal. If they’re stated to be the embodiment of dreams themselves then sure but that’s the most I’m seeing from these dreams.

glass what do you mean, ae isnt limited to just concepts or being the embodiment of something, ae also extends to thoughts, ideas, emotions etc etc, dreams definitely fall under the things that are abstract mentally, something being called, pure thought, or in the case of FE, literal dreams of people would qualify for ae1 given 1)dreams themselves being abstract and 2)dreams are very much made of thoughts things that we very much treat as being abstract

 

[deonment]

Also i agree with the crt, the concept manip im neutral on however

 

[TheGatememer]

again that’s way too vague to assume conceptual manipulation. Also saying they aren’t able to disobey orders and it not being mind manipulation sounds like body puppetry to me. You need an actual mention on his concept being affected in order for this to work as concept hax.

It's not Body Puppetry, since Hel isn't actively controlling Eir. If that was the case, then Hel wouldn't constantly have to pressure Eir to obey her, and rather she would just be controlling her body. Not to mention, the Body Puppetry page itself is saying that it only affects the body, and not anything non-physical like the mind or soul. It's her very existence/being that is being tampered with to make it impossible for her to oppose Hel.

Again you need some of the other games in the series to acknowledge the existence of Heroes as well for this to be canon. It’s the main reason why Dissidia is accepted as canon in final fantasy because we have numerous games and extended lore flat out confirm Dissidia is a canonical game in the series. The remakes also take precedent over the original games so the original 3 games don’t exactly count anymore. Like I said we need an actual employee from IS to confirm it’s canonicity to have this be Valid. If Sakurai did the same thing for either Kirby or kid Icarus then his word holds weight since he’s the creator of those games, but he’s not for FE.

Other games acknowledging the existence of Heroes really isn't necessary, especially considering that the same could be said of Three Houses. I brought up Sakurai, since what he says is confirming what we see in the Legacy of Archanea Book, and Cipher Banner, where the spin-offs (TMS #FE and Warriors) are excluded, but Heroes is included with the rest of the mainline entries. This is basically showing that Heroes is considered a mainline entry, despite not there being a direct statement that says "heroes is canon."

And in an interview, one of the director claims it would be difficult to do a crossover between Heroes and TMS #FE (a spin-off) due to being "different settings and universes", something that Heroes did not have any issues with other mainline games. Of course, this is somewhat outdated, but the main point still stands that the mainline games did not have the issues crossing over with Heroes that TMS #FE, a spin-off did.

So again, type 8 immortality. Being a dream at best would make you non corporeal. If they’re stated to be the embodiment of dreams themselves then sure but that’s the most I’m seeing from these dreams.

The quotes I provided show that the fairies embody a type of dream (Ex: Plumeria says she is the lewd dream, Triandra says she is the nightmare), which is again, back up by the fact that they are reliant on dreams/nightmares to exist. So they are stated to be the dream itself, and are shown to be reliant on it to keep existing. And on the Abstract Existence page, it even says that one can embody a thought to qualify, which is essentially what a dream is. There are also characters like Hiiragi Yoshiya that have AE Type 1 for existing as a dream.

That again isn’t NEP. The fact you agreed Corrin’s latter point is true when the former mentions him not existing doesn’t help your case. You need an actual statement that they blatantly don’t exist or be a literal void.

Corrin is saying that either they actually exist, or they are just a dream, and by extension, the former would be false. It's one of the two possibilities, and we know that the latter is true. Ergo, it means that Corrin doesn't truly exist, as it's the only possible conclusion based on the two possibilities presented. Besides, existing as a dream should mean they don't exist in a conventional sense, since, well, they're a dream, ergo, not real.

 

[TheGatememer]

Basically using feats from all other FE games can apply to Heroes; not that it matters too much since FE Heroes has its own feats far surpassing all those other games. But using FE Heroes feats to scale any other FE game is the part that is a hard no. But I don't think anyone is doing the latter.

Yea no one is scaling stuff from Heroes to other games. Hence why we are making new profiles.

 

[Theglassman12]

I’ll comment here in a couple days or so, got some errands to take care of.

 

[TheGatememer]

I’ll comment here in a couple days or so, got some errands to take care of.

okay, take your time

 

[TheGatememer]

Bump

 

[TheGatememer]

forgot to bump dis

 

[TheGatememer]

bump

 

[Theglassman12]

@JustSomeWeirdo you do realize them not being able to acknowledge Heroes’ presence just further disproves its placement in the mainline series right? You need that or WoG confirmation that it’s canon.

@TheGatememer you do realize body puppetry can be done without physical contact with the individual right? Affecting someone’s being doesn’t equate to conceptual manipulation unless you have further statements of it.

3 houses is irrelevant since it’s not a crossover game, as opposed to Heroes which is a crossover game. TMS is also a crossover to SMT, something not comparable to a self crossover like fire emblem. Again Dissidia final fantasy is a crossover of the entire final fantasy franchise, however there’s plenty of statements both in the game and outside in mainline titles and extended canon that solidifies Dissidia being part of the mainline series, hence why anyone has a Dissidia key to begin with. You need that stuff to remotely give every single Fire Emblem character that doesn’t originate in Heroes an extra key for said game.

if that character seriously for AE1 just for that alone then I guess it’s fine?

A dream can exist in a conventional sense in fiction. You have characters interacting with dreams as if they’re real existing things in said verse. That doesn’t exactly prove NEP, especially when your Senshikan character you listed for AE1 doesn’t remotely have NEP despite being a dream. Like I said you need them being stated to be a literal void or that they don’t exist for them to have NEP.

 

[TheGatememer]

@JustSomeWeirdo you do realize them not being able to acknowledge Heroes’ presence just further disproves its placement in the mainline series right? You need that or WoG confirmation that it’s canon.

How exactly? It just shows that there is a canon reason why Heroes hasn't been acknowledged in other games yet.

And also, here is an official Fire Emblem timeline by IS that again, lists Heroes as a mainline game. It also separates TMS and Warriors as it's own thing. Lines up with the Legacy of Archanea Book, Cipher Banner, and Sakurai's word, 2 of which are from IS, and another from a high ranking Nintendo employee. A statement really isn't needed considering its literally shown by all official sources that Heroes is a mainline game.

@TheGatememer you do realize body puppetry can be done without physical contact with the individual right? Affecting someone’s being doesn’t equate to conceptual manipulation unless you have further statements of it.

Body Puppetry also means that you are controlling their physical BODY, and not something else. It's either concept manip, or information manip, since it's Eir's literal existence being altered, and not something physical.

3 houses is irrelevant since it’s not a crossover game, as opposed to Heroes which is a crossover game. TMS is also a crossover to SMT, something not comparable to a self crossover like fire emblem. Again Dissidia final fantasy is a crossover of the entire final fantasy franchise, however there’s plenty of statements both in the game and outside in mainline titles and extended canon that solidifies Dissidia being part of the mainline series, hence why anyone has a Dissidia key to begin with. You need that stuff to remotely give every single Fire Emblem character that doesn’t originate in Heroes an extra key for said game.

We're not giving every FE character a Heroes key, were creating new profiles for them.

A dream can exist in a conventional sense in fiction. You have characters interacting with dreams as if they’re real existing things in said verse. That doesn’t exactly prove NEP, especially when your Senshikan character you listed for AE1 doesn’t remotely have NEP despite being a dream. Like I said you need them being stated to be a literal void or that they don’t exist for them to have NEP.

It's a case of either A or B being true. If B is true, than that means A is false, and vice versa. In this case, Corrin states that either he truly exists, or he only exists as a dream. The latter is true, so the former has to be false, ergo, this Corrin doesn't truly exist. That is a statement of them not existing conventionally.

 

[JustSomeWeirdo]

There uh, is WoG

IS straight up lists it under the mainline games, the non canon games are excluded

I only brought up the fact that they intentionally keep their own shenanigans from effecting the other games. "They aren't mentioned in other games" can't really be used when IS goes out of their way to have them prevent exactly that. "They aren't mentioned" is just a neutral point that can go either way

 

[Edwellken]

TMS is also a crossover to SMT, something not comparable to a self crossover like fire emblem.

TMS is SMT backwards why am I only just now seeing this, a

Anyway neutral regarding the whole "canonicity" thing for a number of reasons but it still has yet to be shown where IS said FEH was "canon" or a "mainline game", and them excluding spinoffs from a section in that book doesn't mean anything without it being stated specifically what said section was for. Either way I'm not really sure why it being canon or not prevents profiles from being made when there are several examples of that not being a requirement. Or am I just missing something?

 

[TheGatememer]

TMS is SMT backwards why am I only just now seeing this, a

Anyway neutral regarding the whole "canonicity" thing for a number of reasons but it still has yet to be shown where IS said FEH was "canon" or a "mainline game", and them excluding spinoffs from a section in that book doesn't mean anything without it being stated specifically what said section was for. Either way I'm not really sure why it being canon or not prevents profiles from being made when there are several examples of that not being a requirement. Or am I just missing something?

The purpose of the page was to show off the timeline of Fire Emblem (by release date of each mainline game), and Heroes is included in it. It wouldn't make any sense for Heroes to be included but Warriors and TMS not being included if Heroes was treated as a spin-offs like the latter two. Besides, the Legacy of Archanea Book is not the only example.

In total we have The Legacy of Archanea Book (which I just mentioned), The Cipher Banner, An Official Timeline of Fire Emblem (by release date), and Sakurai's word. So that's at least 3 official sources, and 1 additional external source (Not really since it was on a nintendo video presentation) where Fire Emblem Heroes is listed as a mainline game, and Warriors + TMS are excluded due to being spin-offs. It doesn't matter if IS doesn't outright say "Heroes is canon", if they are literally listing Heroes as a mainline game in all official sources. It's like asking to prove that say, Three Houses is canon, by asking if there is a statement by IS that says it's canon. There of course isn't a statement, but it's listed as a mainline game, so the default assumption is that yes, it is canon.

 

[Edwellken]

Don't misunderstand, all of that is more than enough as far as I'm concerned, it's just that the absence of TMS and Warriors there doesn't really mean anything is all.

 

[JustSomeWeirdo]

In the JP timeline, however

Cipher, TMS, and Warriors are all listed separately

 

[TheGatememer]

bump

 

[Theglassman12]

@TheGatememer If the crossover game isn't referenced in any other game as an event that happened, why should we treat is as canon? Also the same timeline includes the original Shadow dragon and Mystery of the emblem and Gaiden despite these games having remakes, which are also listed, unless we're saying they're a separate continuity (which needs proof) I don't see why it being listed here is legit enough for it being canon when it includes older games that have remakes that take precedent.

No you need explicit statements that it's referring to their own concept or information, one's being is way too vague to give someone an ability like conceptual manipulation.

Are any of the characters in the other games that shows up in Heroes remotely different enough that they're not the same characters as they were in the game they originated from? If they lack this then I don't see why they can be added when last time I checked, having the same character, but in a different tier in a crossover game is prohibited for a while now.

You're not understanding what I'm saying, him existing as a dream still means he exists. Also dreams in fiction do exist and characters across can interact with them normally and act like they're real things, this isn't NEP and you need proof that they're literal voids or they lack existence. This isn't enough proof.

@JustSomeWeirdo Again, the mainline games also include the older games that have remakes that render them obsolete, them being mainline doesn't help prove it's canonicity.

@Edwellken We've had this being a rule for a while that you can't have crossover pages unless the characters in said crossover are distinguished from their canon counterpart that they're different people. Also a good chunk of these pages you listed aren't in crossover games which isn't a good comparison here.

 

[Edwellken]

The only one that wasn't from a crossover there was Ryuko actually. And can you link said rule please, because if going by how you worded it there I don't think any of the characters I linked qualify as "different people", as far as I know anyway.

I'm aware of that rule and vaguely remember the thread(s) where it got implemented, but as far as execution the line historically doesn't seem clear. I don't see what's different in this case from many noncanon and/or crossover characters historically being allowed profiles, but of course this is only worth bothering with if we don't end up treating FEH as canon anyway so it's more a secondary issue I guess?

Oh, and as far as having different abilities etc, characters in FEH have access to separate skills and weapons than their mainline counterparts.

 

[DarkDragonMedeus]

FE1 was also recently ported; not saying it gives it higher priority over Shadow Dragon. But Heroes also distinguishes having multiple versions of Marth when it comes to Famicon era vs DS era. And different routes from various FE games happen to all be canon to Heroes from what JSW told me. I kind of agree I have mostly seen and heard one-sided canon connections of every other FE game being canon to Heroes when we don't know of Heroes is canon to any other. But I'm willing to hear more from RTX or JSW.

 

[JustSomeWeirdo]

It's uh, still a timeline of main releases

FE1, 2, and 3 are definitely main releases

The point is that the non-canon spinoffs are listed separately from the main releases and that FEH is considered a main release by Intelligent Systems

 

[TheGatememer]

@TheGatememer If the crossover game isn't referenced in any other game as an event that happened, why should we treat is as canon? Also the same timeline includes the original Shadow dragon and Mystery of the emblem and Gaiden despite these games having remakes, which are also listed, unless we're saying they're a separate continuity (which needs proof) I don't see why it being listed here is legit enough for it being canon when it includes older games that have remakes that take precedent.

The thing is, FEH really can't be referenced in other games at the moment, as not only do they actively prevent history from being altered in other worlds, but the game isn't even finished yet. So all the Heroes that were summoned are still in Askr, as they are still under contract to keep fighting for Askr, so they can't go home, therefore have no chance to mention the events outside of Heroes. Either way, it's not a requirement for it to be mentioned in other games. If it's stated/shown to be canon, then, well, its canon.

Even assuming that the remakes make the original games non-canon, the timeline includes both the originals and the remakes, since it's a timeline of all mainline games, and at one point, the remakes didn't even exist. So the timeline really doesn't contradict the fact that both the original games and the remakes were at the very least considered "canon" at one point. Not that there is really anything that disproves both being canon. Unless you also want to argue that Awakening is non-canon for mentioning Gaiden's version of Alm (As Shadows of Valentia didn't even exist back then). And in Heroes, there includes a Mystery of the Emblem version of Marth, and references to Gaiden Alm and Celica in the form of their Brave outfits.

Besides, how else would we know what is considered canon by IS if we just completely disregard the list IS has shown multiple times that shows us just that? Statements isn't an option, since, well good luck finding direct statements that say any of the games are canon.

No you need explicit statements that it's referring to their own concept or information, one's being is way too vague to give someone an ability like conceptual manipulation.

What else would it be if it's stated that her literal existence is the thing being altered? Her very "being" in this case is her existence, so some fundamental aspect of her is being altered. Though, there is an ongoing crt that might just render this irrelevant later. So I don't mind dropping this point until that CRT concludes.

Are any of the characters in the other games that shows up in Heroes remotely different enough that they're not the same characters as they were in the game they originated from? If they lack this then I don't see why they can be added when last time I checked, having the same character, but in a different tier in a crossover game is prohibited for a while now.

Yea, they have access to completely different abilities and tiers, not to mention appearances for most characters.

You're not understanding what I'm saying, him existing as a dream still means he exists.

That goes against what Corrin is stating. He says that either he truly exists, or he's just a dream. The latter is true, so by default, the former is false. It can't be both, it's one or the other. So according to Corrin himself, he doesn't truly exist.

Also dreams in fiction do exist and characters across can interact with them normally and act like they're real things, this isn't NEP and you need proof that they're literal voids or they lack existence. This isn't enough proof.

That might be for different verses, but isn't the case here. I wouldn't be arguing this if Corrin didn't state that he doesn't truly exist due to being a dream.

 

[JustSomeWeirdo]

different routes from various FE games happen to all be canon to Heroes from what JSW told me

Yeah, route splits such as Birthright/Conquest/Revelation, and even things like who you choose to have marry Robin are all canon to FEH. This isn't anything new however, all paths are alluded to happening in alternate worlds even within their own games and/or DLC (except FE4, obviously. But FEH does, in a way, retcon the pairings mentioned in FE5 like Lewyn/Erinys, by talking about how the Ced summoned to Askr could or couldn't be Lewyn's son or even if the Erinys summoned to Askr is even his mom in her Forging Bonds supports)

IIRC Male Corrin is typically from Birthright and Female Corrin is typically from Conquest, Child Units are also intentionally left vague, and characters from each route in Three Houses exist simultaneously

 

[TheGatememer]

The Fates children are also heavily implied to be their Heirs of Fate counterparts, since they all say “it’s good to meet you” when summoned, which is a reference to the ending of Heirs of Fate.

 

[Theglassman12]

@Edwellken Guest appearances don't count in crossovers, when I say crossovers, I mean stuff like Marvel vs Capcom or Super Smash bros where the entire thing is a crossover, not a mainline game in the series that has a guest character. Also here's the crossover page.

@JustSomeWeirdo Main releases that become obsolete with the remakes the games have, so again a list of mainline releases just because Intelligent system made the game doesn't really help it's canonicity, go back to my dissidia point for an example of what I mean.

@TheGatememer So until the game is finished and until we get more proof from IS to prove the events of Heroes is canon, I don't see why we're suggesting adding a heroes page for the characters when the main difference I see is just stats. Do you have any examples of a character in the mainline games being completely different people in Heroes? If you do then that can help for whoever does follow this criteria to have their page, if not I don't see why literally every single character in Heroes needs an entire page when it devolves into a stat difference.
A timeline of game releases made by IS doesn't really help it's canonicity dude. If they were canon at one point but not anymore you do realize it shoots your argument in the foot that the timeline is reliable right? If the original is rendered obsolete by the remakes then why should we take the timeline of release orders for the games as legit canonicity? Not only is that outdated information since Echoes brings up Grima in the game but the fact that it's proven to be in the same world/universe as Shadow Dragon with Camus and the pegasus sisters being playable characters in the game doesn't really help here. And again my point is the older games are rendered obsolete because of the remakes.

What CRT exactly? If it can clarify what the hell the definition of the term existence would mean with these abilities I'd like to see it.

I'm talking about their in character personality and backstory, is it different like say Tekken's Akuma where he's just an assassin hired by Kazuya's mother to kill the rest of the family as opposed to having the exact same backstory as he does in original street fighter? Or is it just an ability and tier difference? If that's it I severely doubt this would pass.

Again, that's proof you need to provide that Dreams literally are nonexistent as him pondering if he exists doesn't mean literal Nonexistent Physiology, as by this logic anyone with an existential crisis about their existence being real or not in fiction would have NEP. And again dreams exist, having Corrin having a random thought doesn't prove NEP as you need statements that dreams are nonexistent things from a reliable source, and not from someone who has no idea what's going on.

 

[JustSomeWeirdo]

Main releases that become obsolete with the remakes the games have, so again a list of mainline releases just because Intelligent system made the game doesn't really help it's canonicity, go back to my dissidia point for an example of what I mean.

Cool, some games get retconned by remakes I guess, they're still main series releases and so is FEH, also literally nothing contradicts FEH that isn't already addressed

Also, FEH straight up has FE1/3 representation, such as Sword Draug

To be entirely honest, I don't think it matters whether or not FEH is canon (which it is) for us to have profiles on it, like...at all, it's really irrelevant and I swear we've gone over that they're allowed in several threads already

 

[Theglassman12]

Canonicity for crossovers is what prevented Dissidia from being scaled to all of final fantasy for the longest time. And everyone in the group managed to find a lot of evidence that dissidia’s canon. If the other characters from crossovers got accepted for very minimal reason then I would propose their pages being nuked as well if that’s all going for them, just a stat boost and nothing different from their background.