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Lotr tiering revision 2.0

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Okay. I suppose that seems reasonable. Are you willing to carry out the agreed upon statistics changes (the 3-B ones included)?
 
I might not be the right one to implement the edits, since I'm still quite inexperienced with the source editor, but I can make a list of the needed changes for someone more capable.

Upgrade true forms to "At least 5-C, possibly 4-C:" Balrogs, Olorin, Saruman, Radagast, Sauron, Gothmog, Carcharoth, Feanor, Fingolfin, Osse

Upgrade the physical manifestations of all Valar to "At least 4-A, likely 3-B" with Morgoth becoming weaker over time

I'm still waiting for that 4-B Silmaril calc to be accepted, so Solar-System Ancalagon and Carcharoth will have to wait.
 
You can change your standard settings to the classic/source code editor, and then inspect, and strictly follow, the instructions here: Standard Format for Character Profiles

I do not think that there is anybody else, who seems reasonably reliable, that has the time to handle the edits.
 
Okay. I will temporarily unlock the pages. Tell me here when you are done.
 
Should all their stats be upgraded?

Lifting strength, striking strength and durability would all be effected by this.

Also should the Valar's manfestations and Arien have Sub-Relativistic speed?
 
@MasterOfArda Yep

@Antvasima Should I add a True Form key to Saruman while I'm at it? Right now he only has his Istari manifestation and his powerless version.
 
I do not know why they should have sub-relativistic speeds. Striking strength and durability would be affected by this, yes, but I am not certain about lifting strength.

A true form key for Saruman seems reasonable.
 
It still isn't working...I go to the page, then all the text disappears and it retracts into a space about a centimeter wide. I'll try switching computers real quick.
 
Antvasima said:
I do not know why they should have sub-relativistic speeds. Striking strength and durability would be affected by this, yes, but I am not certain about lifting strength.
A true form key for Saruman seems reasonable.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately they don't have any striking strength. Its a missing statistic. Can i fix it?
 
I think that you can give them scaled striking strength values, yes.

Scaling the lifting strengths from Arien seems fine as well.
 
Preferably check out the thread that I linked to first.
 
Hat mchat said:
On Sauron's page it says he is vastly superior to Arien, could you please provide a source for this?
Click to expand...
He became Morgoth successor with all the power he obtained as Eye Sauron, which should put as strong as his weakened form, which is comparable to Fingolfi.
 
Note: Base Sauron is 4-C while Eye Sauron is at least 4-C and comparable to Weakened Morgoth.
 
Eye Sauron only actually happened in the movies. In the books he still had a physical body during the War of the Ring, it was just weaker without the Ring itself. His consciousness was referred to as "The Eye" because he could see all over Middle-earth with his mind.
 
TheVividen said:
Eye Sauron only actually happened in the movies. In the books he still had a physical body during the War of the Ring, it was just weaker without the Ring itself. His consciousness was referred to as "The Eye" because he could see all over Middle-earth with his mind.
Click to expand...
That is actually a common misconceptio

I remember reading it myself. The eye of Sauron was visible and quite tangible. Its power is unknown, though it seemed to serve as an avatar for Sauron, and it would seem more likely that it should scale to Gandalf, not Morgoth.


Sauron's key is sorely lacking however. Eye Sauron scales to Gandalf, and so is 5-C to 4-C. Weakened Sauron is at least 4-C. Sauron with all his power and the ring was far higher. He even fought against the winds of Manwe, and required divine intervention to kill.


Another misconception is that Sauron needs the ring to maintain a body. He doesn't. When he lost the ring he wasn't actually defeated, but rather "fled"
 
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