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And that is disregarded as there are feats that contradict that, meaning its a case of writers being unable to do math
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Lapis Flight Speed Upgrades
- Thread starter Chartate101
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Esentially it would take thousands of years for Lapis to perform the feats she did if she werent traveling at faster than light speeds
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Inb4 201 megaton planet busting in Kirby.
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Do you agree Cal?
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Si.WeeklyBattles said:
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Are you mocking me? That doesn't get your point across whatsoever. Size only determines a tier in some cases. The logic of your comparison because it doesn't even correlate with what I am saying. Otherwise characters the size of average humans like Goku shouldn't be able to bust planets. I am going to ask you refrain from mocking me if all you are going to do is making invalid comparisons that are in attempt to demean my point.Js250476 said:
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I never said the feat itself was incorrect. Given the timeframe, it is indeed MFTL+ as a feat. I'm not debating that. I said we should treat it as an outlier as I even posted a video above on how it literally shows that gems can't perceive or accelerate at lightspeed as they weren't even assuming their forms as they were just the gems at that point. You literally haven't explained around this. It's not even just a statement at that point. If we are definitively shown they can't do it, they literally can't. You're right for the fact the writers don't do the math which is why it should be disregarded.WeeklyBattles said:
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Except Kirby was never stated to have that as his limit, referenced several times, and consistently implemented throughout the entire series to the point we see actual displays of what happens when you attempt to test it out?The real cal howard said:
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stop spamming. Make one post with all of your thoughts. The way you're doing it is annoying and clogs the thread. There is one instance of gems not being able to go lightsepeed. There are 2 feats of Lapis going MFTL. I'm not sure if you're aware, but 2>1
If you have someithing to add, edit your comment.
If you have someithing to add, edit your comment.
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It's not just "one instance". It's a recurring thing brought up throughout the show. We only need that one confirmation scene to literally back up all of the statements. It's not 2 > 1 either. That's horrible logic. You are legitimately disregarding anything else that isn't that one scene. If anything, I think you mean it's literally just Lapis' two feats that are essentially just doing the same thing of the travel rather than other varying scenarios to prove the affirmative. I get feats take priority, but the feats with several backup statements legitimately should take priority over Lapis' feats because it's incredibly bolstered at that point.
I was also giving individual people responses but whatever.
I was also giving individual people responses but whatever.
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the only time it's been brought up that they can't go FTL is in "Adventures in Light DIstortion".
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Incorrect. It's literally been stated in a minisode (mini episode) that gems are the physical manifestation of their gems. As they are legitimate light composed beings, it is outright implied they can't accelerate faster than what they are made out of (obviously being light). Again, it is something that hasn't been retconned either. The Lapis upgrade has even more reasoning after this when the actual characters themselves state they can't accelerate at the speed along with the statements and the display of it. Your entire comment is just an argument from ignorance clearly.Chartate101 said:
The Minisode - https://youtu.be/fOEScwq3slY
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Once again, all that is is an instance of writers not being able to do math. Its no different from Superman himself saying he cant go FTL but then having MFTL+ feats.
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ok. If it's been stated in the minisode and shown in Adventures in Light Distortion, and Lapis' MFTL speeds have been seen twice. So both have been seen the same number of times
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Just saying that the writers cannot do math over and over again isn't justification by itself. If the writers retcon Gems to allow them to travel faster than light on their own, then that requires proper verification; not just a couple statements from Lapis and Steven.
If the writers being incredibly inconsistent is a reason to permit this feat, then I don't see why we can't say "The writers are being so inconsistent that this feat doesn't make any sense and shouldn't be used."
If the writers being incredibly inconsistent is a reason to permit this feat, then I don't see why we can't say "The writers are being so inconsistent that this feat doesn't make any sense and shouldn't be used."
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So by that logic Superman really isn't faster than light bc he says he's not but he goes ftl, and it's just too confusing and shouldn't be used. Idk I don't buy that logic.
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No, that's not what I said. Superman might - for some reason - think he's slower than light but he has demonstrable FTL feats; and it's not inconsistent with the rest of DC for Superman to be FTL.Gojira1234 said:
Lapis has no on-screen feats. We only have a couple lines which are inconsistent with what we know about the rest of the show.
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I'm going to go with feats > statements here. As much as I'd love MFTL+ Lapis, she hasn't been shown to be able to do that. Inb4 you said she did it twice, she just said she did those things, we aren't actually shown that she did. For all we know, what Lapis could have interpreted as halfway across the galaxy could be much lower than the literal sense.
What we have been shown on the other hand, is that Gems literally cannot form when they move faster than light. Also, Lapis was matching the speed of a plane in regular flight. Finally, Jasper caught Lapis mid flight.
All the evidence points to lesser than MFTL+ Lapis. Sorry Weekly, but I have to say no to this.
What we have been shown on the other hand, is that Gems literally cannot form when they move faster than light. Also, Lapis was matching the speed of a plane in regular flight. Finally, Jasper caught Lapis mid flight.
All the evidence points to lesser than MFTL+ Lapis. Sorry Weekly, but I have to say no to this.
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Are you going to continue to make the same comparison? We've been over this. This is a simple instance of a writer forcing this maybe once but gets contradicted by MANY other feats. The case is very different from Lapis'.Gojira1234 said:
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Except Lapis only has two MFTL+ feats which is literally just performing the same thing. They are literally stating they can't accelerate faster than what they are made of as it would mess up their composition. You are regurgitating points that have little to no validity for this discussion.WeeklyBattles said:
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That legit means nothing if we see Lapis do it twice compared to going over gem composition, display of what happens, and statements throughout the episode. Lapis' feat is literally just going from one location to another then back. They are practically the same feat in itself. The upgrade also shouldn't clearly go through with so much evidence against an MFTL+ Lapis.Chartate101 said:
P.S. Sorry for multiple comments. On mobile, it doesn't allow me to quote more than once was my point.
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"Only" two MFTL+ feats. Lmao. Anyway you literally just proved our point with "instance of a writer forcing this maybe once but gets contradicted by MANY other feats". This is literally that. Despite the fact that the writer's say that Gem bodies can't manifest in FTL environments Lapis has shown twice that that isn't true. If it was just once then sure it's an outlier. But this is the second time now. It's clearly just a case of the writers not knowing how this stuff works, and she really is that fast.
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>"Only" two MFTL+ feats. Lmao.Gojira1234 said:
Again, you're displaying that you are being close-minded. I get you may not accept the view, but you mocking what I'm saying literally doesn't help you get your point across of MFTL+ Lapis. This is off topic, but you get the point you literally aren't making a point when you resort to demeaning the point by cherry picking.
No, I didn't prove your point. I proved that Gems have been stated to indeed are display and constantly stated not to be the case and outright displayed and covered deeply. You are cherry picking the context.
Again, this legitimately doesn't prove the point. I never denied your point on the writers doing math. You are misrepresenting what I've literally said in my comments as well regarding it. I said that statements, showings, and even the covering of how the mechanics and properties. Your earlier example hardly even related.
Two instances hardly justify it. Do you think we should upgrade Dragon Ball (Pre-Z) to Moon level just because Roshi destroyed the moon while Shenron recreated it with the fact Shenron's power is on par with that of Kami's? No. There are so many lower showings to contradict that with the same being true for Lapis' case. Legit, anyone by your logic with multiple PIS moments should be downgraded because it happened more than on once. Please look at the evidence I've actually posted above and how other showings even demonstrate Gems not being able to traverse past lightspeed.
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It's stated once. Not consistently. Lapis' MFTL+ feat (for the record, it's a feat rather than a statement despite being words) is done twice.
False equivalency. Moon level is an outlier because it's shown once and people who body Roshi have their strongest attacks cap out at city level, small country when you really get out of Roshi's league. Lapis's feat doesn't scale to anyone (an if it did, still would be a false equivalency comparing it to DB) and is done a handful of times.
False equivalency. Moon level is an outlier because it's shown once and people who body Roshi have their strongest attacks cap out at city level, small country when you really get out of Roshi's league. Lapis's feat doesn't scale to anyone (an if it did, still would be a false equivalency comparing it to DB) and is done a handful of times.
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I'm all for MFTL+ Lapis.
Feats>Statements
Lapis has two MFTL+ feats
Bing bada boom.
Feats>Statements
Lapis has two MFTL+ feats
Bing bada boom.
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It's stated several times beyond just the one episode. I've literally given another link above to prove this. You have made and argument from ignorance clearly. You also dodged my mention on how it has been literally displayed how it works. You are cherry picking like the last person.The real cal howard said:
Fallacy Fallacy on your behalf. It's not false equivalence when I'm comparing how the validity is here is similar to that of DB when lower showings and direct statements go against highballs. I am not arguing DB to be at Moon level even and you're using reasoning for which I literally said we don't consider DB even at the level despite it.
Lapis' feat has been done twice like the Moon level ones. This was a response to the guy who was saying doing it more than once equates to it not being the outlier in which you actually proved the point for me. Lapis' feat was done twice not a "handful of times". You are adding misleading description to make the point. We've already given an example of Jasper legitimately tagging Lapis mid-flight. It legitimately doesn't matter if it's just Lapis because the main point is that a Universal law the Gems legitimately can't do is accelerate past lightspeed.
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You must not be have read what is being discussed then because it's not that simpleHunterzillas said:
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It is that simple because that is how we evaluate feats on this wiki
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But of the two feats you're talking about, one is just a statement.Hunterzillas said:
We've seen in the show itself that Gems don't go above lightspeed on their own. Unless you're suggesting we just abandon canon altogether, I don't know what you're proposing.
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Neither are just statements though, they're actual feats she did
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What are the MFTL+ feats? And what is the next best thing?
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This reminds me of how Homestuck tries saying no character can go faster-than-light when feats repeatedly contradict it.
It's the same here.
It's the same here.
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Lapis flies to the gem homeworld and Lapis flies out of the Milky Way.
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Have either of these been calc'ed?
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Yes. The first one. By the OBD, I think.
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Just saying that "in a short time" can mean days to months without contradicting the statement. Take the time it took for mankind to evolve to what it is now, multiply it by 60 and you have the approximate amount of time needed to travel around the galaxy with our current tech.
Anyway, I want to take a look at the first feat's calc.
Anyway, I want to take a look at the first feat's calc.
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