Kamen Rider Kuuga vs. Batman (Arkham)

[ZeedKZ]

SBA
Speed equalized.
Both at their 9-A versions.

Kamen Rider Kuuga scales to 0.1262 Tons of TNT.
Batman scales to 0.0451 Tons of TNT.

Kamen Rider Kuuga: 0
Batman: 0
Inconclusive: 0

 

[Shadowslash125]

At a glance, Kuuga has superior AP, Terrifyingly Superior LS Gap and higher intelligence. How does Sheepherder usually fight? (I haven't played ME yet so hehe).

 

[Stillwinston]

What class is Shepard here? I'm assuming soldier but wanna check

 

[ZeedKZ]

Soldier, forgot to include.

 

[Stillwinston]

Gotcha cheers

At a glance, Kuuga has superior AP, Terrifyingly Superior LS Gap and higher intelligence. How does Sheepherder usually fight? (I haven't played ME yet so hehe).

Can I ask how Kuuga usually fights?

Shepard in this class generally keeps their distance as far as possible and uses guns with various ammo flavours, while using Adrenaline Rush (Thought based perception amp that slows everything down around him) and Concussive Shot (A stunning, slightly homing blast that floors targets)

For intelligence I'll pull up a skill feat list for Shepard, he does have some pretty cracked feats and is superior to those in ME who also have cracked feats iirc

 

[ZeedKZ]

Most of the time in Mighty Form, Kuuga relies on hand-to-hand combat, his finisher is a dropkick that uses Sealing Energy to make the opponent explode, this is enough for him to handle two Gurongi at the same time, who can rival him in martial. He will use acrobatics to manipulate his own mobility in mid-air (like the time he avoided falling on Xu-Zain-Da's horn by altering his own fall) and will evade enemy attacks as much as possible. There are occasions when he stays in a longer fight, but that also makes his adaptation come into play. He almost always uses the TryChaser / BeatChaser 2000 and Gouram to assist in combat, the latter also being used to fly around the battlefield to view opponents or evacuate when necessary.

The Dragon Form is based on kenpo and kung fu style combat with the Dragon Rod, which is a pole that has the same explosive properties as the Mighty Kick, it is also based on short-range combat. Pegasus Form is entirely long-range due to his enhanced senses and the use of the Pegasus Bowgun. Titan Form is similar to Dragon Form in combat, but slower and uses kendo.

 

[Stillwinston]

Okay so he seems to mainly favour close range but can range attack too?

On the topic of AP Shepard does actually vastly upscale from that calc, he can harm the shadow broker who can one shot krogan who can do the feat casually and can amp further with adrenaline rush.

For skill feats here's my complied list from the entire trilogy, I will leave a tldr at the bottom.

Spoiler: Pre ME1

Assuming default Shepard backgrounds he is Sole Survivor, this background has Shepard surviving the Akuze incident, whereupon him and 50 other marines were attacked throughout the night by Thresher Maws. With an untold number of these beasts slaughtered the rest of them with Shepard being skilled enough to be able to save themselves out of that predicament in time against a then at the time unknown foe as humanity was still in the process of claiming planets. These creatures can devour and one shot people like Shepard yet in ME2 he goes onto defeat one on foot as I will show later.

Shepard also graduates from the N7 Program before the series starts, which takes the best of the best from the Alliance military to even be considered for it. With objectives that are on par with irl US Army rangers training at the very least.

Spoiler: Mass Effect 1

Shepard thanks to one of those three backgrounds gets considered and later picked as the first ever human Spectre. The top agents of the Citadel Council. Its stated by Anderson (Shepard's mentor and the prior spectre potential) that "Spectres aren't made. They're born." Spectres draw their numbers from the Turians and Asari. The former are essentially the roman empire in space with their military doctrine and boot camp starting at age 15.

The Asari are a race of aliens that live for a thousand years, with Asari Huntresses/Commandos spending at least 20 to 30 years early in life training in the art to start with and considered the best in a 1v1 or small scale battles against other races. One Turian general (Who'd have decades of combat experience and who's entire race is stupidly militarised to the point where they do government services) even said "The Asari are among the finest warriors in the galaxy, fortunately there are not many of them." Yet Shepard and his party can beat groups of these even as far back as the first game as shown with the Benezia bossfight.

Also in the Spectres are the Salarians. A race who helped create the very idea of Spectres with their entire military doctrine basically about being Agent 47 in space and ending battles before they even begin. There are also the Krogan , while they are not a council race they are basically Spartans in space with Urdnot Wrex who can be killed by Shepard having been stated to actually have killed a Thresher Maw in a 1v1 as part of his proving trails for his clan.

To add to the feats with Urdnot Wrex he's implied to have lived close to 1000 years and is credited as one of the last few Battlemasters who are stated to be more than a match for 10 soldiers of any other race. Plus he was skilled enough to escape an ambush and killed his father who performed in it the same night. The only time Wrex seemed to have come close to defeat was a battle with an Asari Commando and even that ended in a stalemate along with a looot of collateral damage.

Spoiler: Mass Effect 2

Shepard is far superior in skill to Turian squadmate Garrus Vakarian. Who in addition to undergoing the military training customary to his race (iirc he was from the Turian main homeworld) was a skilled marksman who can casually bust out several headshots in quick succession. Garrus was at one point also considered as a spectre candidate but was forbidden by his father from joining but depending on player choice can either go back to C-Sec or apply to be a spectre.

When 2 rolled around following Shepard's death Garrus travelled to Omega. A place that is basically ran only by crime where he proceeded to become the vigilante known as Archangel who proceeded to take the fight to several mercenary bands. Garrus was betrayed by one of his team and was bogged down by three of the groups. Yet Garrus still performed feats such as shooting a gunship and dismantling it with the merc basically stating Garrus stomped them via sheer skill.

Garrus was camped there for hours upon end mowing down and funnelling the mercs while they returned fire at him. With him doing this for over a day with little to no pauses. While it was ultimately required for Shepard to save him Garrus still has the wherewithal to recognise them in the heat of battle after all that and still take part in several pitched firefights before being injured.

Shepard is acknowledged as the leader and superior of Grunt. Said being is a Krogan that was genetically engineered from birth to be the ultimate Krogan by a mad scientist named Dr Okeer, Grunt was implanted with the history of various Krogan warlords with their battle experience and later in his loyalty mission can defeat a Thresher Maw alongside Shepard and another squadmate which results in Grunt becoming the leader of an elite unit of Krogan later in 3. Keep in mind that the Krogan operate in an entirely Spartan like society with Grunt earning this through proving himself.

2's endgame also has Shepard finally raiding the base of the Collectors, a mission that is referred to many times as a suicide mission that can result in the permadeath of Shepard and the rest of his crew. Yet Shepard can pull the mission off with no squad deaths at all. One squad member can be counted on to bring back the entire crew of the Normandy who are non-combatants back to the forcibly grounded ship deep in enemy territory during the mission and can survive if loyal i.e entirely focused on the mission. This includes even the weakest like Mordin who was a Salarian doctor and ex STG agent that was in the twilight years of his life and even admitted the front line wasn't his direct speciality but can still kill a Krogan with a well placed pitchfork despite the height and build difference.

Spoiler: Mass Effect 3

By this point in time the Reaper War begins, with the Reapers being a race of gigantic mecha ctihulus that purge the galaxy of almost all organic life every 50'000 years citing Shepard as the one true threat to their task having killed one of them in ME1 after damaging them through killing their Saren Husk. With all the races in the galaxy looking to Shepard to lead them in the struggle against them.

Shepard is able to defeat and kill Kai Leng. As much of a cringey Raiden/Nightwing knockoff that he is Kai is able to kill a Krogan with just a normal army knife (For reference Krogan possess secondary vital organs among other physical benefits that make fighting them in melee a hard sell.) Kai was also able to defeat a weakened Thane Krios, a squadmate in 2 who is credited as among the greatest assassins in the galaxy. Thane started his training at the age of 6 and killed at 12 years old and has plied this trade ever since. Thane developed a list of techniques tailor made to take out each race should they be his target. He was capable of performing a clean headshot on a merc around civilians with Garrus even commenting on it being impressive. He did all of Mass Effect 2 while terminally ill from Kepral's Syndrome. And with less than 50 percent lung capacity. In 3 he still gives Kai Leng one heck of a fight despite needing constant medical aid and was well past his life expectancy by that time.

The other major skill feats for 3 that I can think of is in the Citadel DLC, whereupon Shepard fights a clone of themselves. Said clone uses the exact same major power as them and is skilled enough to actually blast the gun out of the hands of the real deal yet still ultimately loses the fight. There is also the Armax Arena challenges which can have Shepard be proven as the number 1 fighter in the galaxy, said rankings include Aria who was the main leader of Omega and James Vega who also goes through the N7 program and fights alongside Shepard in 3.

Spoiler: TLDR

• Shepard has at least a decade of military experience and has done training comparable to US army rangers
• Shepard was considered the best of his species by essentially the united nations of the galaxy for their elite top agents. Which include races like Asari that can live for 1000 years who's commandos are considered the best in a 1v1 against other races and can have decades to centuries of combat experience. Yet Shepard and his squad can fodderise these soldiers even in the first game. Asari commandos such as Serrice Guard can do feats like this
• Shepard is superior to the likes of Turians. Who's race is stupidly militarized to the point where their military is also the police and the fire department etc and their training begins at the age of 15 and are basically Ancient Rome in space.
• Garrus, a Turian squadmate of Shepard was considered as a spectre also and spent over 24 hours waging a siege against three entire merc bands and held against them and a gunship which eventually two shotted him.
• Is able to outskill melee fighters like Kai Leng who can defeat Thane who's cqc skills can fodderise groups of highly trained soldiers in a room within seconds.
• On the topic of flight and acrobatics Shepard has fought similar foes like the Cerberus Phantoms
• Shepard can fodderise Krogans, who's entire race are essentially Spartan Hoplites in space that can live up to 1000 years with their most elite battlemasters being stated to solo ten soldiers of any other race.

 

[ZeedKZ]

He can, Pegasus Form is mostly long-ranged, he striked Me-Vagis-Ba with his Pegasus Bowgun from a distance of 2 km. Plus he can compensate his melee range with sheer jump power, Mighty can jump 15 meters and Dragon can jump 30 meters. The Dragon Rod is also 2 meters in length which can help when his foe tries to evade the attack at close range.

I assume that scaling chain serves for Shepard's physicals no? Because yeah, Gouram did that feat by just absorbing the matter around him, plus Kuuga got decently stronger due to his AD/RE being in action almost passively, as he want from being ******* by Gurongi like Xu-Vanduu-Ba or Me-Vagis-Ba and turned the table by unlocking new abilities at mid-fight, and he never receives the full energy of a strike as his armor and reduce and absorbs damage caused to him.

Shepard's experience seems good, but has he shown anything enough to deal with someone with nigh-passive adaptation/AD/RE, instinctive action and supernatural willpower? Because even if Shepard somehow starts having a edge, Kuuga would evade the attacks he can or straight up engage a combat regardless so he can adapt enough to overcome that edge. Plus judging by their profiles, Kuuga holds a range advantage (2 km vs hundreds of meters).

 

[ZeedKZ]

Giving more context for Kuuga's experience (which all that comes from his profile basically but just to summarize), he had mastered 2000 techniques during his world-travelling and he perfectly remembers not only all of these, but to which people he shared them in specific. He could unlock the Titan Form by just training kendo with Ichijo and could ride the Trychaser 2000, which is a police-purpose super bike that nobody had tested before, and he could engage it to fight a Gurongi with no issue. He could already transform into Kuuga one day after he absorbed the Amadam through sheer will and keep his own against Gurongi who have likely thousands of years of experience (given how Riku was already mummified and found within ancient excavations when they found him). He could quickly solve Go-Zazalu-Ba's attack pattern, something that officers and detectives couldn't.

 

[BERRIES555]

Looking at it as someone who knows very little of either series, I feel like Shepard is far more skilled and experienced. But could Shepard overcome the AP gap? That’s kinda a big deal in this match

 

[Shadowslash125]

Skillwise, Shepard takes this very well. While Kuuga's skill feats are good and all, it's literally a guy fighting a soldier at this point.
Doesn't mean Kuuga's skill level should be underestimated though. AP Gap and High Ass LS Gap is concerning.

 

[Nicetoderp]

I definitely agree that Shepdard should take the skill categories, no doubt. They has far more experience and dealing with just as exotic threats as Yusuke has.

The main problem is the AP gap and Pegasus' from Gouram. That thing is a nasty combo. Allowing Kuuga to snipe his enemies from a much further range with impunity. Of course, there's several downside and way for Shepard to work around but Yusuke can definitely play the keepaway game here, especially with Gouram's assistance.

 

[Stillwinston]

Giving more context for Kuuga's experience (which all that comes from his profile basically but just to summarize), he had mastered 2000 techniques during his world-travelling and he perfectly remembers not only all of these, but to which people he shared them in specific. He could unlock the Titan Form by just training kendo with Ichijo and could ride the Trychaser 2000, which is a police-purpose super bike that nobody had tested before, and he could engage it to fight a Gurongi with no issue. He could already transform into Kuuga one day after he absorbed the Amadam through sheer will and keep his own against Gurongi who have likely thousands of years of experience (given how Riku was already mummified and found within ancient excavations when they found him). He could quickly solve Go-Zazalu-Ba's attack pattern, something that officers and detectives couldn't.

Shepard is far superior to the likes of Asari Commandos who's race can live for 1000 years, these fighters can 1v1 any member of a species in mass effect like Turians who are so hyper militarised their army is also most goverment services and when the reaper invasion hit they held out the longest as every city on their homeworld was a goddamn fortress. There is also Garrus's feat as well in ME2

The Serrice Guard band of Asari did a feat like this and Shepard would be far superior to these commandos given how he can fodderise AC's even in the first game. Shepard can also fodderise Krogans on the regular, who can also live past 1000 years as shown with Okeer and Drack with Wrex (Who as a Krogan Battlemaster is stated to be able to solo ten soldiers of any race including the Asari) being close to that age. The Krogan homeworld is so hilariously lethal its described like this.

And to enter a clan a Krogan must undergo a rite of passage, fighting waves of the predators of their homeworld which included Thresher Maws which can devour and oneshot them. Krogans are so entirely focused on warfare to the point where they so good at it that they were required to kill the Rachni when no one else could. Then afterwards the Krogans turned on the citadel council and were such a pain that the Turians and Salarians had to unleash a species wide neuter bomb to them to cull their numbers. And Shepard fodders any Krogan he goes up against.

I definitely agree that Shepdard should take the skill categories, no doubt. They has far more experience and dealing with just as exotic threats as Yusuke has.

The main problem is the AP gap and Pegasus' from Gouram. That thing is a nasty combo. Allowing Kuuga to snipe his enemies from a much further range with impunity. Of course, there's several downside and way for Shepard to work around but Yusuke can definitely play the keepaway game here, especially with Gouram's assistance.

Shepard already casually upscales from his calcs to begin with and can amp himself further with Adrenaline Rush and Immunity for his AP and Dura. He also has medigel for healing which can be done with just the press of a button, Shepard can also perception manip to see targets in slow motion during AR. For LS Shepard could shank Kuuga with an omni tool blade if grappled to force a release I guess. Concussive Shot can stun targets too if not outright floor them too, granted that's likely due to LS bowling them over but even larger targets than Shepard can be staggered by it iirc.

I'm gonna ask on the topic of ice and heat manip, I think I saw Kuuga resists but I think its worth mentioning that Shepard's incendiary ammo and cyro ammo can reduce targets to ashes in seconds and also flash freeze and shatter targets to pieces respectively, which works even on geth which are purely inorganic. Shepard's other ammo types can be changed into with just a button press, Shredder, Armour Piercing and Disruptor Ammo will all serve useful here in tacking on damage.

Stamina both are comparable, I'd argue Shepard edges out due to being superior to the likes of Garrus, who spent over 24 hours in constant combat in a one man siege where he fought dozens of mercs from three whole groups, as well as dozens of freelancers and a freaking gunship all with little to no pausing. Shepard also gets lazer'd in the last mission of ME3 yet still survives and carries on even with his armour melted and thensome. For range that might be an issue but Shepard would just pursue and stay in cover, did it one time while avoiding reaper lasers

Thinking it all over I'm gonna vote Incon here. Kuuga has a sizeable AP edge still and has better range and his acrobatics should help in travelling the battlefield better and playing away if he needs to or close the gap. His LS is also an issue if he decides to just break Shepard's neck or smth.

Shepard meanwhile has the much greater skill edge, can amp himself to help cover the gap, has healing to keep going and he can perceive Kuuga in slow motion and light him up with bullets even if his ice and heat ammo can't do it he still has other types that deal more damage. Both can seemingly fight to the tenth round too so that's a toss up, so I'll vote Incon here.

 

[ZeedKZ]

Skill skill skill

I got it pal, I just wrote that for reference, never said those feats are better than Shepard's.

Shepard already casually upscales from his calcs to begin with and can amp himself further with Adrenaline Rush and Immunity for his AP and Dura. He also has medigel for healing which can be done with just the press of a button, Shepard can also perception manip to see targets in slow motion during AR. For LS Shepard could shank Kuuga with an omni tool blade if grappled to force a release I guess. Concussive Shot can stun targets too if not outright floor them too, granted that's likely due to LS bowling them over but even larger targets than Shepard can be staggered by it iirc.

Kuuga also massively upscales his own calc as Gouram (who's Kuuga is treated as way above) did that by just absorbing the matter around him, plus his RE / AD is constantly in action throughout the 50 episodes of the series. Plus Kuuga has passive damage reduction, he will never take the full output of Shepard's attacks unless he has damage boost to compensate with. Shepard restraining Kuuga is impossible due to the massive LS advantage (1040.06321101 tons vs. 7.67096409 tons, a difference of 135.584419221 times). For perception manipulation and stunning, I'd rather see how it works, because if it resorts to something that needs action then it would be unlikely considering Kuuga's superior acrobatics, instinctive action and Pegasus Form's ESP. How his healing work by the way? Does it act as a form of regeneration? Because once he gets in contact with the sealing energy, it is pretty much joever for him.

I'm gonna ask on the topic of ice and heat manip, I think I saw Kuuga resists but I think its worth mentioning that Shepard's incendiary ammo and cyro ammo can reduce targets to ashes in seconds and also flash freeze and shatter targets to pieces respectively, which works even on geth which are purely inorganic. Shepard's other ammo types can be changed into with just a button press, Shredder, Armour Piercing and Disruptor Ammo will all serve useful here in tacking on damage.

Only Titan Form has a proper resistance to heat/fire attacks (280°C), Mighty Form can take them, but not without damaging his armor. Do you have any number of the temperature of those weapons? Kuuga can withstand -150°C temperatures which is way less than frostbite temperature. An video example would be also welcomed.

For the stamina, I'd genuinely wish such information was in the profiles, it kinda sucks when it only gives a simple explanation that is nowhere as impressive of what you stated. Plus I don't think staying in corners would help when Gouram transports Kuuga to a reach far beyond Shepard's weapons can cover, unless Shepard is used to deal with foes with a comparable range. Again, more precise numbers would help. Because 2 km compared to hundreds of meters (as I assume the mass accelerator weaponry is in play here) is a pretty big gap.

I've counted your vote however.

 

[Stillwinston]

Well for stamina I've already provided examples of superhuman levels, in the skill feat list for ME2 Garrus was stated to be fighting for 24hrs straight more or less and Shep would upscale. I suck at CRT stuff but I'll try and edit the profiles down the line, will try and find references for the ammo types. There's still Shep's Adrenaline Rush too

 

[IxaSaga2]

Incon fra

 

[ZeedKZ]

I just saw a few video examples. I don't think Adrenaline Rush can cover the AP gap, not only by how Kuuga already upscales the Gouram feat, but also judging by how cracked Kuuga's RE / AD is, nor how the Titan Form works (and how Kuuga can instinctively change between forms by just sensing any approaching attacks). For the healing, it can be useful to heal from minor damage, although it is unlikely that any damage that Kuuga will put on him will be minor, not only it will not counter the Sealing Energy but Kuuga's better regen pretty much covers such change. Dragon Form and Pegasus Form's reactions are enough to cover Shepard's self-perception manipulation by the first being a 2.6x amp and the latter by being able to intercept projectiles way faster than his own movement speed and from a farther range as well, plus it won't help that Pegasus Form has vision and hearing thousands of times more advanced that human's, I can't see Kuuga being hit in that form even if Shepard resorts to hide n' attack method.

 

[Shadowslash125]

BTW, should Shepard damage Kuuga enough, he will revert to his weakest form called the growing form, where it's game over for him and a step away from a decisive win for Shepard (unless matches like these don't account for it).

 

[ZeedKZ]

Not really, unless you are a High Rank Gurongi. Kuuga has been trashed several times by beings equal or above him and yet he never reverted back to Growing Form, he fought against Me-Gadra-Da who had a notable superiority in strength for over two hours, and Xu-Zain-Da trashed him in their first round, being only defeated after he adapted himself through training.

 

[Shadowslash125]

After thoroughly reading both sides of the debate, I'm leaning towards Kuuga for this match, although a few good points may sway me to the incon train or maybe even to voting Sheepman.
Not voting yet, still waiting out.

 

[Shadowslash125]

Wait a minute, can Kuuga convert any of Shephard's weapons into his own? With an overwhelming LS Gap, he should be able to disarm the latter and transform his weapons into the corresponding form's weapons.
I haven't watched Kuuga in years, sorry I can't bring much to the table compared to other debates.

 

[ZeedKZ]

Either Gouram absorbs anything made of metal that Shepard has, or Kuuga may convert it to weapons of his own depending on the shape and form he is using, he'd have to disarm Shepard to do so, which is possible.

 

[Shadyboi0]

Leaning towards Kuuga(Riderman victim)

 

[Stillwinston]

Just to say I may need to pause on Shep's end there, the gun calc is likely bunk and a crt is looking to be discussed there for what I can answer Shep has multiple guns there and even if kuuga has passive damage reduction Shep could still amp with ammo types off the bat and also has gun amps like Adrenaline Rush, Assassination, Overkill etc