Jotaro vs Kenshiro REMATCH

[Chariot190]

Part 6 been like, but I honestly chalk it up as something not even exclusive to Jotaro as I am pretty sure there are fates of deaths or some other things. Don’t remember too much of Part 3 although I do remember that part with that stand user with a book trying to do predictions into the future only to fail lol.

I said youth for good reason. By the time part 6 rolled around his role ended.

but I honestly chalk it up as something not even exclusive to Jotaro as I am pretty sure there are fates of deaths or some other things.

It isn't exclusive to him, Joseph has it too, and some dudes have it but not good. He's just protected by fate up to a point because he's a special boy.

Don’t remember too much of Part 3 although I do remember that part with that stand user with a book trying to do predictions into the future only to fail lol.

Ironically like one of the few times it's mentioned in manga ignore the typo

 

[HammerStrikes219]

Snip

Yep, that is the scene alright.

Also I kinda figure, but you gonna have to admit Jotaro has his friends dying around him is some crappy luck. Also Pol possesses a Turtle in part 5 after getting the Donut by Diavolo.

Anyway, enough derailing. I inform a admin for closure of this mismatch.

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Yep, that is the scene alright.

Also I kinda figure, but you gonna have to admit Jotaro has his friends dying around him is some crappy luck. Also Pol possesses a Turtle in part 5 after getting the Donut by Diavolo.

Anyway, enough derailing. I inform a admin for closure of this mismatch.

You mean stomp? Jotaro has no wincons

 

[Baken384]

You mean stomp? Jotaro has no wincons

If he had the class g forces, he'd choke Kenshiro to death or Tear him apart

 

[HammerStrikes219]

You mean stomp? Jotaro has no wincons

Mismatch is a stomp in this case anyway

 

[Robo432343]

wait guys what if i change this match to alucard vs dio speed not equal

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Dude, make a new thread. And next time, read the profiles carefully

 

[Chariot190]

wait guys what if i change this match to alucard vs dio speed not equal

That's literally another mismatch. Dio stomps the shit out of him unless it's Schrodinger, in which case Alucard literally can't die so he just wins.

Dude, before making a match, ask yourself, do both dudes have viable methods to win? If both have a chance to win, go ahead. If one dude negs the ******* other dude, don't make it, that's called a stomp dog. And if it's a case where one dude stomps, bu if ya tweak it sightly, like say speed unequal, the other stomps, but there's no in-between, where they can actually fight fairly, that's a mismatch.

 

[Lynieryz]

Swap Jotaro for Giorno

 

[Unknownnah]

wait guys what if i change this match to alucard vs dio speed not equal

No

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Swap Jotaro for Giorno

RTZ ggs

 

[Lynieryz]

RTZ ggs

Musō Tensei negs.

- Dimensional Travel, Instinctive Action, Duplication, Immortality (Type 5) and Nonexistent Physiology (Nature Type 1, Aspect Type 1, 3 and 5) and Resistance to Extrasensory Perception, Precognition and Existence Erasure (Musō Tensei is made of the nothingness which predates life, and allows the user to achieve a state of said nothingness. It’s also stated to be able to erase the user’s body from existence. MT activates automatically to protect the user from danger, even when the user is completely unconscious and also creates clones for further distractions. Raoh states that it renders every hokuto Shinken ability completely useless, to the point where him and Ken are forced to just have a slugfest with 0 techniques, this could include techniques that can BFRs the opponent's soul. It makes the user "impossible to locate", even average characters in terms of skill can locate the opponent via sensing his murderous intent, his bloodlust and fear. Furthermore, an attack thrown while in MT is considered to be "impossible to predict" since it comes from a "blank mind" despite the fact that things like subconscious reflex is considered to be a fodder technique that's easily predicted and that the very person who considers MT to be impossible to see coming is stated to possess an "unconscious fist". One of the guidebook describes MT as "The realm of no-mind, which can only be attained by those who have known love and sorrow", as well its stated in Legends Revive that the MT allowing the user to "enter the void between life and death")

Martial Arts (Fist of the North Star)

Fist of the North Star is a setting famous for its many fantastical martial arts, whose number and power far supersedes that of any real world martial arts due to the lack of conventional weaponry, which forced people to turn martial arts into their most powerful weapons (source). The number of...

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Musō Tensei negs.

Martial Arts (Fist of the North Star)

Fist of the North Star is a setting famous for its many fantastical martial arts, whose number and power far supersedes that of any real world martial arts due to the lack of conventional weaponry, which forced people to turn martial arts into their most powerful weapons (source). The number of...

vsbattles.fandom.com

Giorno: So anyways, infinite speed.

 

[Lynieryz]

Giorno: So anyways, infinite speed.

"Musō Tensei: So anyways, infinite speed."

Both are passive

 

[Chariot190]

RTZ has powernull, can effect non-existent things i mean this should be fairly obvious given his like 1 feat is effecting time skip, and is 4D
idk why powernull still ain't listed, it's been accepted in a CRT eons ago

GER just does the usual GER thing and stonewalls because he negs you but can't follow up because his ass has like no duraneg hax.

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

RTZ has powernull, can effect non-existent things i mean this should be fairly obvious given his like 1 feat is effecting time skip, and is 4D
idk why powernull still ain't listed, it's been accepted in a CRT eons ago

GER just does the usual GER thing and stonewalls because he negs you but can't follow up because his ass has like no duraneg hax.

He does have life manip hax and age progression, so he has ways to hurt him. I also heard he might be getting a High 3-A upgrade due to scaling above Tusk Act 4 as he is the strongest canon stand.

 

[Chariot190]

He does have life manip hax and age progression, so he has ways to hurt him.

Life Manip hax ain't offensive, age manip, I guess? But at that point, it'd be just a complete stomp and thus, can't make said match.

I also heard he might be getting a High 3-A upgrade due to scaling above Tusk Act 4 as he is the strongest canon stand.

Whoever told ya that was yapping.
RTZ is the strongest canon ability, but it ain't offensive, it basically just negs everything else and upscales in potency.
GER itself is the strongest Stand still physically, but that just makes it like High 8-C+ to 8-B, given that just means it upscales off Plat, who is the strongest Stand (physically), pre-GER (this enables GER to upscale off Part 6 and such in AP, as Plat was still the top dog in said parts). Tusk Act 4, physically, isn't High 3-A, that's the Infinite Rotation, which isn't the same as what Tusk Act 4 itself can punch out.
Additionally, the statement precedes Part 7 anyway so we couldn't even if IR did count, Part 6 gets tossed in because Plat > Part 6, and GER > Plat.

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Life Manip hax ain't offensive, age manip, I guess? But at that point, it'd be just a complete stomp and thus, can't make said match.

Tbh, I think he'd just make a ton of snakes after burying some pipes in him or smth.

Whoever told ya that was yapping.
RTZ is the strongest canon ability, but it ain't offensive, it basically just negs everything else and upscales in potency.
GER itself is the strongest Stand still physically, but that just makes it like High 8-C+ to 8-B, given that just means it upscales off Plat, who is the strongest Stand (physically), pre-GER (this enables GER to upscale off Part 6 and such in AP, as Plat was still the top dog in said parts). Tusk Act 4, physically, isn't High 3-A, that's the Infinite Rotation, which isn't the same as what Tusk Act 4 itself can punch out.
Additionally, the statement precedes Part 7 anyway so we couldn't even if IR did count, Part 6 gets tossed in because Plat > Part 6, and GER > Plat.

I guess so.

Anyways, somebody call a mod and close this shit.

 

[HammerStrikes219]

age manip, I guess

Thing is I don’t recall GER/Giorno having age manipulation. I got reminded of the Duo which one of them has the age manipulation stand on the train scene.


Hell, Giorno was the one who was getting affected by the said enemy stand so not sure how he has that.

Edit: Never mind, I forget about that scene for Part 5.

 

[Nierre]

one of his main schticks lol

 

[DRW001]

Thing us I don’t recall GER/Giorno having age manipulation. I got reminded of the Duo which one of them has the age manipulation stand on the train scene.


Hell, Giorno was the one who was getting affected by the said enemy stand so not sure how he has that.

Gold Experience aged an tree through its entire lifespan until it literally turned to dust in the fight against black sabbath. Iirc he also exhausted a stag beetle of its lifespan too (I think in the fight against green day).

Jojoagogo also says he can age living beings until they die iirc so giorno having age manip is backed up in the guidebooks as well

 

[HammerStrikes219]

Gold Experience aged an tree through its entire lifespan until it literally turned to dust in the fight against black sabbath. Iirc he also exhausted a stag beetle of its lifespan too (I think in the fight against green day).

Jojoagogo also says he can age living beings until they die iirc so giorno having age manip is backed up in the guidebooks as well

I already add in the edit on about forgetting that scene in Part 5 so yeah, it was a “I forgot” moment

 

[DRW001]

I already add in the edit on about forgetting that scene in Part 5 so yeah, it was a “I forget” moment

Oh I didn't see the edit lol

 

[Chariot190]

one of his main schticks lol

i wouldnt call twice a main schtick but yeah

 

[HammerStrikes219]

i wouldnt call twice a main schtick but yeah

Yeah, he did perception manipulation on Bruno early in the story and still does the punching barrage quite a decent amount of times IIRC.

Hell, he does the life manipulation to a T in the fights he was in.

 

[Lynieryz]

RTZ has powernull, can effect non-existent things i mean this should be fairly obvious given his like 1 feat is effecting time skip, and is 4D
idk why powernull still ain't listed, it's been accepted in a CRT eons ago

What are the natures and aspects? The interaction will not occur if it is not the correct types.

 

[Chariot190]

What are the natures and aspects? The interaction will not occur if it is not the correct types.

Coincidentally the same ones, and like one or two extra.

 

[Lynieryz]

Coincidentally the same ones, and like one or two extra.

Cool, what is the aspect type 5 that GER interacted with? Musō Tensei's is life force and you still have to consider the type 5 immortality.

 

[Chariot190]

King Crimson literally obliterates and erases the entire world (he says this himself even in the manga, twice, that everything and the whole world ceases to exist temporarily, and then doubled down in every guide).

I dont think i can even begin listing off every fucky that entails in regards to jojo's setting and cosmology, that GER turned around and went "lmao watch this dog" life force is obviously an established thing in jojo, which aint exempt from time skip. Both Hamon, a Vampire's blood sucking amp (they absorb life force and life energy through blood), and a few facets of GE's ability all come from it.

Hell, it might even include fate given King Crimson's main purpose, is avoiding Diavolo's fate, via deleting time.

Funnily enough, deleted time falls under other, given well, they dont have time, it's gone, despite that being the case, RTZ could affect it, restore it, and null it afterward, despite the fact it did all this while time was deleted still.

Tbh Ger might not have many feats, but the 3 feats he does have, are pretty damn good.

 

[Lynieryz]

King Crimson literally obliterates and erases the entire world (he says this himself even in the manga, twice, that everything and the whole world ceases to exist temporarily, and then doubled down in every guide).

I dont think i can even begin listing off every fucky that entails in regards to jojo's setting and cosmology, that GER turned around and went "lmao watch this dog" life force is obviously an established thing in jojo, which aint exempt from time skip. Both Hamon, a Vampire's blood sucking amp (they absorb life force and life energy through blood), and a few facets of GE's ability all come from it.

Hell, it might even include fate given King Crimson's main purpose, is avoiding Diavolo's fate, via deleting time.

Funnily enough, deleted time falls under other, given well, they dont have time, it's gone, despite that being the case, RTZ could affect it, restore it, and null it afterward, despite the fact it did all this while time was deleted still.

Tbh Ger might not have many feats, but the 3 feats he does have, are pretty damn good.

Interesting, I didn't think about it that way, if this logic is valid Musō Tensei would qualify for an upgrade, gaining any aspect and nature that correlates with all the abilities that are here:

Martial Arts (Fist of the North Star)

Fist of the North Star is a setting famous for its many fantastical martial arts, whose number and power far supersedes that of any real world martial arts due to the lack of conventional weaponry, which forced people to turn martial arts into their most powerful weapons (source). The number of...

vsbattles.fandom.com

 

[Livinmeme]

Also. Jotaro pseudo fate manip doesn't work, as Ken has his own fate manip

 

[Chariot190]

Also. Jotaro pseudo fate manip doesn't work, as Ken has his own fate manip

Jojo fate 100% outscales FotnS fate. Shit is the highest thing in the whole setting bar a mostly featless God, various 4D things confirmed aspects of fate too, like "flow" and "gravity". Not that'd matter tho, it only prevents death, not losing or making him win. Bro can still get his ass beat, he cant just be killed, and only in part 3.

 

[Lynieryz]

Not that'd matter tho, it only prevents death, not losing or making him win. Bro can still get his ass beat, he cant just be killed, and only in part 3.

Quite ironically, Hokuto no Ken's fate manipulation has other applications, but the main one is to ensure that your opponent will die.

 

[Chariot190]

Quite ironic, Hokuto No Ken's fate manipulation has other applications but the main one is to ensure that your opponent will die.

Yeah that like, wouldnt work.
Jojo fate is >>> 4D stuff.
Whole verse works off it, and confirmed 4D shit, is just aspects of fate. Jojo fate is a 2-A thing, it's the highest force in the setting.
Unless Fotns fate is also upscaling off 4D shit on that scale, it aint superceding Jotaro's or mista's.

Jotaro cant die, but he can get his ass kicked. It's like that old mario fate hax bullshit. So like, it aint actually that useful, to see what I mean, just look at Mista who got his ass beat so many times it aint even funny, like yeah his might not be as good as Jotaro's where fate kinda treats him as special, but it's the same in function, Mista was just fated not to die, so he didnt die throughout the part even when he shouldve, doesnt mean he cant get memed on, brutalized, or anything inbetween.
Is this just a yapping thread till it gets closed or something?

 

[HammerStrikes219]

As far as I recall, the 2A thing for Jojo was in Part 7 with Funny Valentine scene wasn’t it? I not sure if the previous six parts prior to the reboot in Part 7 and onwards has the same cosmology if memories serve right

 

[Lynieryz]

Yeah that like, wouldnt work.
Jojo fate is >>> 4D stuff.
Whole verse works off it, and confirmed 4D shit, is just aspects of fate. Jojo fate is a 2-A thing, it's the highest force in the setting.
Unless Fotns fate is also upscaling off 4D shit on that scale, it aint superceding Jotaro's or mista's.

Jotaro cant die, but he can get his ass kicked. It's like that old mario fate hax bullshit. So like, it aint actually that useful, to see what I mean, just look at Mista who got his ass beat so many times it aint even funny, like yeah his might not be as good as Jotaro's where fate kinda treats him as special, but it's the same in function, Mista was just fated not to die, so he didnt die throughout the part even when he shouldve, doesnt mean he cant get memed on, brutalized, or anything inbetween.
Is this just a yapping thread till it gets closed or something?

I was just pointing out the irony of the applications being opposite and when it is said that Jotaro is not destined to die? I legitimately don't remember.

Yes, it's just conversation being thrown away, that's why I started the conversation about Giorno, it was a bait to generate a discussion that I found interesting.

 

[Chariot190]

As far as I recall, the 2A thing for Jojo was in Part 7 with Funny Valentine scene wasn’t it? I not sure if the previous six parts prior to the reboot in Part 7 and onwards has the same cosmology if memories serve right

They do, explicitly. Even have a statement saying Part 4 and part 8 simply different dimensions at the opposite ends of space and time.

Part 7 isnt even a reboot, it's just a alternate universe, they share the same multiverse, concepts, and rules.

Like hell if Funny wanted, he could probably find the og uni if he looked hard enough probably why every noncanon spinoff uses that very fact as a basis to get the old and new uni together.

 

[HammerStrikes219]

snip

Hmmm, alright then although I am admittedly skeptical about that tbh

 

[HammerStrikes219]

Actually technically speaking, a reboot will technically count as a alternative timeline/universe anyway

 

[Baken384]

Star Platinum rips apart kenshitro post class g