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For the first time ever on this wiki, I'm actually going to propose an upgrade to the Sonic cast rather than a downgrade. A lot of people didn't like my arguments on downgrading Sonic's speed in one of my CRTs so I thought of making one that acknowledges Infinite and how powerful he truly is.

The Strongest Enemy​

In Sega's promotional material for Sonic Forces, Infinite was stated to be "Sonic's most powerful enemy yet", period.
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His might is supported even in game, where Infinite effortlessly beats up Modern Sonic alongside his copies, the same Modern Sonic who beat up base Dark Gaia and Erazor Djinn.
Tails, a supergenius, even states that he's faster than Sonic and cannot even read his power with his technology (though the latter may be because of the Phantom Ruby's powers).
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Though Infinite later fights Silver and disposes of him fairly easily. He is then shown making a shockwave so powerful that it stops Modern Sonic in his tracks and causes him to be surprised.
Sonic then beats up Infinite, remarking on how he's grown more powerful since last time (with Sonic stating he may even grow stronger by the second).
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Infinite even remarks that he was strong, though later he does one shot Sonic, proving that he is not exactly at his level of power but getting closer.
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At the end of the game, Sonic is shown able to beat up an Infinite that's at full power. Later on, the Double Boost Sonic and Avatar completely cause Infinite to fade away.

What Does This Mean?​

Now hear me out. There's nothing contradicting the statement made at the beginning, and this would likely even include enemies like Solaris and the Time Eater as well as there's no mention anywhere of this not being applicable to Super Sonic level enemies.
There are statements on Modern Sonic's page from promotional material that were accepted such as the statement where Shadow and Sonic in SA2 "move faster than we've ever seen Sonic go before" and where Sonic has to "run faster than he ever had before" in Frontiers. Considering those are allowed on the wiki and are scaled above even the Spin Dash, Infinite should therefore be scaled above Sonic's previous enemies because Sega outright said he's the strongest enemy.

So yeah, Infinite would be "2-B, possibly 2-A" if promotional material is allowed to be used, with Post-Forces Modern Sonic, the Avatar and the Phantom Ruby being at that level as well.
Yup, Sonic scaling is officially broken since your OC is now one of the most powerful in the verse.
 
Jeez man, how many CRT's can you make in one sitting. This is getting excessive. We already had a CRT like this and it was rejected. Can you at least communicate with the Sonic fans before making CRT's left and right like this? It feels like this is being done because of some hate boner or out of spite.
Bronic actually pointed it out in the replies, so I wanted to make a CRT about it.
There was another one before though I don't know how well the evidence was pointed out.
 
Bronic actually pointed it out in the replies, so I wanted to make a CRT about it.
You could've waited or at least discussed with other people in the Sonic discussion thread before making the CRT. Especially when we had an identical CRT to this get rejected 😭.
 
Yes. Official statements later contradict Infinite being Super Form level. It's stated the bosses in Frontiers (bar The End) are on the level of previous Super Sonic level villains like Dark Gaia, etc. and that Sonic can't even scratch them without being in Super.

The best way you could interpret this statement is Infinite being > Base Sonic opponents.
 
Yes. Official statements later contradict Infinite being Super Form level. It's stated the bosses in Frontiers (bar The End) are on the level of previous Super Sonic level villains like Dark Gaia, etc. and that Sonic can't even scratch them without being in Super.

The best way you could interpret this statement is Infinite being > Base Sonic opponents.
Wouldn't that just mean they're just stronger than Infinite?
 
Wouldn't that just mean they're just stronger than Infinite?
No. Because Super Sonic never fought Infinite. It's explicitly stated they're equal to enemies Super Sonic has fought, and thus Base Sonic is completely unable to scratch them. If Base Sonic was > Super Sonic enemies from before he would've been able to easily defeat the Titans without Super.

I think the promotional material statement is taken to the extreme. If you take it to mean stronger than any enemy base Sonic has fought, it causes a lot less issues in-universe. And it still stays true to the statement.
 
No. Because Super Sonic never fought Infinite. It's explicitly stated they're equal to enemies Super Sonic has fought, and thus Base Sonic is completely unable to scratch them. If Base Sonic was > Super Sonic enemies from before he would've been able to easily defeat the Titans without Super.
The Titans all scale to 2-B though, so they're technically still in the same tier as someone like Solaris or the Time Eater.
 
I think the promotional material statement is taken to the extreme. If you take it to mean stronger than any enemy base Sonic has fought, it causes a lot less issues in-universe. And it still stays true to the statement.
That's the problem though, it blatantly says Infinite is Sonic's strongest enemy.
Base Sonic also never landed a hit on Infinite either yet he managed to grow stronger due to plot the fight.
 
The Titans all scale to 2-B though, so they're technically still in the same tier as someone like Solaris or the Time Eater.
The Titans are supposed to be =~ to characters like Solaris, Dark Gaia, and Time Eater as per official word AND the fact that Tails compared the power the Titans were facing to Dark Gaia. Yet Sonic can't scratch them.
That's the problem though, it blatantly says Infinite is Sonic's strongest enemy.
Base Sonic also never landed a hit on Infinite either yet he managed to grow stronger due to plot the fight.
That's not a problem though. The scans says Sonic's strongest enemy. Not Super Sonic's strongest enemy. If Infinite were really that strong, SEGA would explicitly mention Super Sonic due to them treating him as a god tier within the verse. It's pretty obvious imo.
 
Tbh, since it seemed like Tails was comparing Dark Gaia to TE's lasers, that seems like a possible upgrade for Dark Gaia so that they should scale to the 2-B/2-A Super Sonic
 
Yes. Official statements later contradict Infinite being Super Form level. It's stated the bosses in Frontiers (bar The End) are on the level of previous Super Sonic level villains like Dark Gaia, etc. and that Sonic can't even scratch them without being in Super.

The best way you could interpret this statement is Infinite being > Base Sonic opponents.
nah, it is shown that super sonic grows in power alongside base sonic in frontiers, but it is true that scaling infinite to such infinities without any feat close to it, and with it only having 1 statement that would scale him to 2-A, it really is not enough to make him that high
 
Tbh, since it seemed like Tails was comparing Dark Gaia to TE's lasers, that seems like a possible upgrade for Dark Gaia so that they should scale to the 2-B/2-A Super Sonic
Yeah, I'd agree to that
nah, it is shown that super sonic grows in power alongside base sonic in frontiers, but it is true that scaling infinite to such infinities without any feat close to it, and with it only having 1 statement that would scale him to 2-A, it really is not enough to make him that high
You could just argue Super Sonic > The Titans and it still works lol. I mean, he DOES beat them all after all. He simply had doubt he could, but it's clear he underestimated himself given he beat them all EVEN when he was slowly being weakened/nerfed by the digital virus he had.

The point is: Titans ~ Past Super Sonic enemies >>>>>>>> Base Sonic

Yes the CRT is suggesting Base Sonic >>>> Past Super Sonic enemies

If that were the case, Base Sonic would've been able to keep up and at LEAST scratch the Titans. But he can't.
 
You could just argue Super Sonic > The Titans and it still works lol. I mean, he DOES beat them all after all. He simply had doubt he could, but it's clear he underestimated himself given he beat them all EVEN when he was slowly being weakened/nerfed by the digital virus he had.
They also couldn't damage him, despite being powered by emerald energy.
 
You talking about the Titans? They knock Sonic out with a casual warning attack. Unless you're talking about the cannons not being able to kill The End.
Every time they hit Super Sonic, they knock him back. No rings fall out of him at all unlike when he fought Solaris or Perfect Dark Gaia.
 
Now I have no idea what you're talking about. You lost me. What does that have to do with my last comment.
I'm guessing the idea is that the Titans don't scale to Super Sonic because they don't damage him?

Even though they tank several hits from Super Sonic and this is more of a product of Super Sonic's Invulnerability rather than it being a knock against their 2-B/2-A rating
 
I'm guessing the idea is that the Titans don't scale to Super Sonic because they don't damage him?

Even though they tank several hits from Super Sonic and this is more of a product of Super Sonic's Invulnerability rather than it being a knock against their 2-B/2-A rating
FR. Not to mention that Supreme pushed a laser from TE back when Super Sonic was struggling to do so, and Tails was worried that Knight could beat Super Sonic. Heck, Knight's shield takes a beating from Super Sonic with zero damage.
 
I'm guessing the idea is that the Titans don't scale to Super Sonic because they don't damage him?

Even though they tank several hits from Super Sonic and this is more of a product of Super Sonic's Invulnerability rather than it being a knock against their 2-B/2-A rating
Exactly. Plus they can KILL Sonic if he fails a quick time event. Granted those aren't canon, it clears shows they're comparable even if inferior.
 
FR. Not to mention that Supreme pushed a laser from TE back when Super Sonic was struggling to do so, and Tails was worried that Knight could beat Super Sonic. Heck, Knight's shield takes a beating from Super Sonic with zero damage.
An amped Supreme tbf. Sage when piloting Supreme was stronger. And Tails worried about a weakened Super Sonic losing to Knight (But was wrong as Sonic proceeded to win). They're def comparable tho. That much is obvious.
 
The Titans are vastly superior to Base Sonic, to the point of one-shotting him the moment his Super form runs out. Base Sonic should not have scaling to them.

Though I will say, going by the statement Laser sent that suggests Titans > past Super Sonic enemies, I'm not sure if that statement even implies that. It more so just talks about how they're showing how strong the Titans are by making Super Sonic required for even the first boss when Super Sonic is usually only required for the final boss
 
An amped Supreme tbf. Sage when piloting Supreme was stronger.
How was it amped when she was piloting it?
And Tails worried about a weakened Super Sonic losing to Knight (But was wrong as Sonic proceeded to win).
How was Sonic weakened?
They're def comparable tho. That much is obvious.
Not to mention how much stronger Super Sonic was compared to pre-Frontiers games Super Sonic
 
The Titans are vastly superior to Base Sonic, to the point of one-shotting him the moment his Super form runs out. Base Sonic should not have scaling to them.

Though I will say, going by the statement Laser sent that suggests Titans > past Super Sonic enemies, I'm not sure if that statement even implies that. It more so just talks about how they're showing how strong the Titans are by making Super Sonic required for even the first boss when Super Sonic is usually required for the final boss
I was saying the statement implies they're relative. Here's the quote
"Up until now, in Sonic games, Super Sonic would only appear against the last boss. Imagine if the first boss in Sonic Frontiers is as strong as those bosses,"
First boss =~ to past Super Sonic foes. So Sonic being unable to scratch them is def indicative of him not scaling above said past enemies before Frontiers even begins.
 
How was it amped when she was piloting it?

How was Sonic weakened?

Not to mention how much stronger Super Sonic was compared to pre-Frontiers games Super Sonic
Because it could fight against someone Sonic theoretically couldn't beat by himself. When previously Super Sonic clapped Supreme by themselves so badly The End had to leave the body and take the form of an avatar.

The Cyberspace virus he was afflicted with. We see it slowly making him more tired and weak as the game progresses.

Exactly.
 
Regardless of Super Sonic scaling, the Titans are >= both Time Eater and Solaris, who both scale flat-out to the 2B/2A cosmology.
 
First boss =~ to past Super Sonic foes. So Sonic being unable to scratch them is def indicative of him not scaling above said past enemies before Frontiers even begins.
Damn, ended up misremembering the statement

So yeah, 2-B/2-A base forms is a clear no-go, which also means 2-B/2-A Infinite is a no-go. The best you could do is apply this to Infinite being the strongest opponent Base Sonic has faced, since Sonic never went Super or Hyper against Infinite, but that's a topic for another time
 
Damn, ended up misremembering the statement

So yeah, 2-B/2-A base forms is a clear no-go, which also means 2-B/2-A Infinite is a no-go. The best you could do is apply this to Infinite being the strongest opponent Base Sonic has faced, since Sonic never went Super or Hyper against Infinite, but that's a topic for another time

clover is waiting some other revisions to propose that in another crt
cough
 
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