• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

Honkai: Star Rail Discussion Thread

What feats? IX already doesn’t do anything so i don’t know what you mean. Also can HooH even go against Nous’s calculations?
Read the databank, HooH governs both being and non-being. Also the Arbitrators affecting Nihility’s Shadow as well. And yea, HooH should actually be the one who controls Nous to begin with. In a weird sense, they’re prob more intelligent than Nous since they specifically observe everything at once but nobody can observe them, which would include other Aeons
 
Read the databank, HooH governs both being and non-being. Also the Arbitrators affecting Nihility’s Shadow as well. And yea, HooH should actually be the one who controls Nous to begin with. In a weird sense, they’re prob more intelligent than Nous since they specifically observe everything at once but nobody can observe them, which would include other Aeons
And this non-being is referring to IX is what you’re trying to say? I guess. And proof they control Nous, aeons and transcend imaginary energy in general? Seems like a massive leap. Big if true
Basically every aeons have their own other side aeons
Such as
hunt vs abundance
Erudition vs enigmata
Preservation vs destruction
Propagation vs voracity
and etc

But hooh have no counter, cause they counter themself
you could easily make the argument nanook has no counter cause he is the end of paths. Destruction through each path is a feasible interpretation
 
And proof they control Nous, aeons and transcend imaginary energy in general? Seems like a massive leap. Big if true
Because they control all things lol. It’s directly stated that beings only attribute themselves to singular concepts which is what causes imbalance, but that isn’t the case for HooH because it’s explained that he governs all opposition. Also the Nous stuff specifically iirc was implied in Gold&Gears scan when the knife was about to hit Rubert II
 
you could easily make the argument nanook has no counter cause he is the end of paths. Destruction through each path is a feasible interpretation
Nah, nanook main goal is destroy the universe in heat entropy, while qlipoth preserve from it.

You can tell the end of paths and everything but also the beginning of everything is the finality, but yet finality seem the other side of the trailblaze
 
Ngl, Paths being a physical energy when they're obviously metaphysical + Pathstriders being able to harness powers from it = Path isn't conceptual is actually the stupidest argument I've ever seen so far on the thread

That's like if you harness a conceptual powersource, just because you're a regular human, it makes said powersource not conceptual like we should apply this to Mavuika who's able to harness Ronova's Authority lol
 
Ngl, Paths being a physical energy when they're obviously metaphysical + Pathstriders being able to harness powers from it = Path isn't conceptual is actually the stupidest argument I've ever seen so far on the thread

That's like if you harness a conceptual powersource, just because you're a regular human, it makes said powersource not conceptual like we should apply this to Mavuika who's able to harness Ronova's Authority lol
We should apply this to fiction as a whole
 
Nah, nanook main goal is destroy the universe in heat entropy, while qlipoth preserve from it.

You can tell the end of paths and everything but also the beginning of everything is the finality, but yet finality seem the other side of the trailblaze
Irontomb destroys erudition using erudition. It’s entirely possibly Arch forge and the other LR will employ similar strategies to destroy their respective aeons. Again, your theory is just as valid, because it’s a theory. Not fact.
Because they control all things lol. It’s directly stated that beings only attribute themselves to singular concepts which is what causes imbalance, but that isn’t the case for HooH because it’s explained that he governs all opposition. Also the Nous stuff specifically iirc was implied in Gold&Gears scan when the knife was about to hit Rubert II
Are you talking about this? Cause I don’t think this implies what you’re trying to claim. Wouldn’t HooH and Mythus’s interference be within THEIR calculations?
“The Equilibrium: Next, you sense THEIR-presence. With THEIR ancient dominance, THEY make things right with utmost precision and no deviation, only slightly affecting the angle at which the robot's chest is incised with a scalpel. You understand that this is THEIR third moment, and #27 Rubert is dead.”
 
Are you talking about this? Cause I don’t think this implies what you’re trying to claim. Wouldn’t HooH’s interference be within THEIR calculations?
“The Equilibrium: Next, you sense THEIR-presence. With THEIR ancient dominance, THEY make things right with utmost precision and no deviation, only slightly affecting the angle at which the robot's chest is incised with a scalpel. You understand that this is THEIR third moment, and #27 Rubert is dead.”
This is HooH slightly altering the way in which Rubert died so it’s a little against the Moment. But HooH maintains balance so it doesn’t defy it wholly, because even moments are within it’s equilibrium (part of the universal balance)
 
Irontomb destroys erudition using erudition. It’s entirely possibly Arch forge and the other LR will employ similar strategies to destroy their respective aeons. Again, your theory is just as valid, because it’s a theory. Not fact.
What i am refer here is every aeons have their own counter representatives aspect akin to duality, so no path are really dominant, making the universe in balance state. Not an aeon design to kill other spesific aeon, that and lord ravager case already different context (though lan does that to yaoshi).

While other aeons have their own other side representatives, HooH have none, cause they counter themselves and the one who maintain balance of the universe
 
What i am refer here is every aeons have their own counter representatives aspect akin to duality, so no path are really dominant, making the universe in balance state. Not an aeon design to kill other spesific aeon, that and lord ravager case already different context (though lan does that to yaoshi).

While other aeons have their own other side representatives, HooH have none, cause they counter themselves and the one who maintain balance of the universe
Nice theory but this has no basis in story. Unless you have proof aeons have “counter-representatives“ that oppose each other? which i’ve asked of you already.

“Nanook became the avatar of entropy and ascended to godhood while denying all gods.
Destruction is not a process, but the outcome. On the path THEY promised, all Paths and Aeons will terminate in the heat death of the universe.”

We are making a lot of assumptions based on limited information. We know damn near nothing about aeons and THEIR true nature.
 
Nice theory but this has no basis in story. Unless you have proof aeons have “counter-representatives“ that oppose each other? which i’ve asked of you already.

“Nanook became the avatar of entropy and ascended to godhood while denying all gods.
Destruction is not a process, but the outcome. On the path THEY promised, all Paths and Aeons will terminate in the heat death of the universe.”

We are making a lot of assumptions based on limited information. We know damn near nothing about aeons and THEIR true nature.
All Aeons are juxtaposed to IX. But they don’t really have these intrinsic dualities with the others.
 
Nice theory but this has no basis in story. Unless you have proof aeons have “counter-representatives“ that oppose each other? which i’ve asked of you already.

“Nanook became the avatar of entropy and ascended to godhood while denying all gods.
Destruction is not a process, but the outcome. On the path THEY promised, all Paths and Aeons will terminate in the heat death of the universe.”

We are making a lot of assumptions based on limited information. We know damn near nothing about aeons and THEIR true nature.
But this was established back in 1.0 that the counter-representatives of Destruction would be the Trailblaze, you know the Prime Mover of Life, if not Destruction then "Ego", right?

"Ego" here is Trailblaze, Love as the Prime Mover of Life by Demiurge (As the Scepter's answer is still Destruction, stated by Herta)

Scepter δ-me13's original extrapolation goal: to nurture a life form with an "Ego." Fell into a long slumber due to contamination by the Stellaron.
Influenced by PhiLia093, it embarked on the Path of "Remembrance" in its sleep. It later awoke due to the arrival of (Trailblazer) and became Mem, the memosprite that became attached to (him/her).

At the end of the 33,550,336th recursive loop, its appearance changed to that of PhiLia093, but the matrix memory data was lost.

At the end of the 33,550,337th recursive loop, it retrieved its lost memories at the Great Tomb of the Nameless Titan and reverted to its original appearance.

During the Battle of Amphoreus, as Irontomb swept across the stars, the Demiurge was nourished by uncountable "memories" and became the Pure Child of Anāsrava.
To close the causality loop and anchor the fact of Irontomb's demise, it embarked on a journey of backward gaze. With the Demiurge's "Ego" as a cradle, the newborn Amphoreus was born from the Memory Zone. The experiment on the "prime mover of life" was successful.
The Demiurge itself vanished along with the Scepter, and its consciousness transformed into PhiLia093 at the origin of time.

Its root cause is the discarded assignment: non-Destruction symbiotic micro-probability. Without Administrator intervention, this assignment would lead to the thirteenth factor:
Track: Genesis. Primum Mobile: Love. Simulated Path: Trailblaze.

Hello, Irontomb. In a sense, you are me. So, before falling asleep, I want to have a heart-to-heart conversation with you, to talk about the question you've been contemplating... the prime mover of life.

[Logic: All life activities are attributed to entropy increase.]
[Conclusion: The prime mover of life is "Destruction."]

...Perhaps it cannot be refuted. On the vast Tretos Plains, the daily hunting of antelopes by the lion pride is enough to prove your point. Life is finite, and animals must plunder to survive. When people realize their ideals, they inevitably sacrifice the ideals of others. Even self-defense, or even "love"... sometimes becomes a source of harm.

But, is life merely for the sake of destruction? I think that is certainly not the case. Plundering, expansion, and conflict occur because they are born with flaws and yearn to fill themselves with beautiful external things, just as seeds crave rain and dew... All life activities are attributed to entropy increase, but at the same time, all life is also fighting against entropy increase.

Thus, one day, the life walking the Path of Destruction will stop. It will hesitate, be confused, be lost... Then, it will set off again, offering its broken heart in the world of entropy increase, out of hatred, out of pity, out of any kind of flawed emotion, stubbornly resisting fate towards an uncertain tomorrow.

This is the Flame-Chase Journey, a journey voluntarily chosen by a group of flawed people, who, having learned what "loss" is, choose to lose. In the eternal cycle, everything they relinquish is filled with better material, and the name of this material is "memory," and... "love."

"Love" is not the cause, but the result. "Destruction" is the same. They both originate from the common starting point: "flaw." Because they are born with flaws, life pursues perfection. And by accepting its own defects, life surpasses "Destruction" and the self becomes the "Ego."

This story about the "Flawed One" is my bedtime gift to you. Farewell, Irontomb, together, with the slumber of "love" and "Destruction," let us send the greetings of birth to this starlit sky. And the prime mover of life...

I believe every star in the cosmos will find its own answer ♪

[Loading Core Variable: Trailblaze]

[...]

[Output Value: Hello, World!]
Technically, when Nous required Demiurge to nurture a lifeform called "Ego", that's Trailblaze

Herta: Screwy and I have reached a consensus on that. Regrettably, the answer given by the Scepter is indeed "Destruction." You can find a more detailed discussion in the database.

The whole story of HSR in our perspective was to gather as much allies and stop Nanook, Nanook is like the main villain here that's why we will encounter the Lord Ravagers 1 by 1
 
It's technically possible for a Path to be the counter-representatives of 2 Paths together

Enigmata is the counter-representatives of both Erudition and Remembrance, Trailblaze is the counter-representatives of both Destruction and Finality

To prevent the certainty that Erudition brought about from destroying the possibilities championed by Mythus, Mythus conjured the Fog of Thought and the Rain of Sensation to reveal to the mortals the inexplicable truth through the four agents: Morph, Screen, Riddle, and Mirage.
 
It's technically possible for a Path to be the counter-representatives of 2 Paths together

Enigmata is the counter-representatives of both Erudition and Remembrance, Trailblaze is the counter-representatives of both Destruction and Finality
I’ve already addressed aeons like mythus. He emerged due to a conflict with nous’s moments. Lan emerged due to Yaoshi. Nanook emerged due to the chaotic state of the universe, and declared paths and aeons a mistake.

Can an aeon be born that conflicts with another path? Sure. Does that mean the aeon system is set up to have conflicting pairs? That’s never been explicitly stated.

This doesn’t prove that destruction and trailblaze are opposite pairs.
 
Last edited:
I’ve already addressed aeons like mythus. He emerged due to a conflict with nous’s moments. Lan emerged due to Yaoshi. Nanook emerged due to the chaotic state of the universe, and declared paths and aeons a mistake.

Can an aeon be born that conflicts with another path? Sure. Does that mean the aeon system is set up to have conflicting pairs? That’s never been explicitly stated.

This doesn’t prove that destruction and trailblaze are opposite pairs.
I feel like the entire Equilibrium thing is just the former which is what you agreed upon at best, hence the entire "duality" thing
 
All Aeons are juxtaposed to IX. But they don’t really have these intrinsic dualities with the others.
“On the opposite side, of equal entropy, there exists "nihility". The two balance each other to create the complete universe.”

Can you explain what this means? The “of equal entropy” part i mean. Is IX of equal entropy to the universe? Or is the coin entropy
 
Last edited:
“On the opposite side, of equal entropy, there exists "nihility". The two balance each other to create the complete universe.”

Can you explain what this means? The “of equal entropy” part i mean. Is IX of equal entropy to the universe? Or is the coin entropy
Both interpretations have the same conclusion lol. Either way IX = Universe in entropy
 
So they are in nanook? Glorious nanook upscale
Lol. Nah but all Paths are fundamentally (Imaginary) Energy and all Energy eventually evolves into disorder through the accumulation of Entropy. That’s why the heat death of the universe will also destroy all Paths since it’s not just normal Energy that eventually gets exhausted but supposedly Imaginary Energy as well. And Nanook also kills themselves, which is natural because they control a Path as well which is also energy.
 
Lol. Nah but all Paths are fundamentally (Imaginary) Energy and all Energy eventually evolves into disorder through the accumulation of Entropy. That’s why the heat death of the universe will also destroy all Paths since it’s not just normal Energy that eventually gets exhausted but supposedly Imaginary Energy as well. And Nanook also kills themselves, which is natural because they control a Path as well which is also energy.
And HooH would transcend this process no? Assuming that your previous arguments are true
 
Lol. Nah but all Paths are fundamentally (Imaginary) Energy and all Energy eventually evolves into disorder through the accumulation of Entropy. That’s why the heat death of the universe will also destroy all Paths since it’s not just normal Energy that eventually gets exhausted but supposedly Imaginary Energy as well. And Nanook also kills themselves, which is natural because they control a Path as well which is also energy.
Ah yes my favorite gacha game where I just stare into nothing for eons and nothing gives me dopamine since nothing moves
 
Lol. Nah but all Paths are fundamentally (Imaginary) Energy and all Energy eventually evolves into disorder through the accumulation of Entropy. That’s why the heat death of the universe will also destroy all Paths since it’s not just normal Energy that eventually gets exhausted but supposedly Imaginary Energy as well. And Nanook also kills themselves, which is natural because they control a Path as well which is also energy.
This is why Lygus says that the chances of new Paths being born continuously decreases and decreases because there’s less and less Energy for them to form.
And HooH would transcend this process no? Assuming what your previous arguments are true
Not just HooH, but reversal of entropy should be capable of being done every time the universe resets. If Finality can witness the end and Remembrance can reconstruct the universe then HooH—who sees all things—naturally transcends this process. After all, if he controls Balance, then entropy will never reach any certain extreme but will always bounce back to finish the zero-sum.
 
Also, in physics, because of Entropy and increase in disorder, time flows in one direction and not the other. So for Terminus who has seen the zenith of entropy, he must also be capable of reversing it if he intends to travel back in time. I think I’ve already mentioned this but there’s a 99% chance this is how Terminus time travels. If you’ve seen the movie Tenet, it should be the same concept.

But since Imaginary Energy works in a closed system and always alternates between order and disorder—essentially being capable of looping back in-itself—I’d bet that it’s genuinely metaphysically impossible for Nanook to accomplish his goal.
 
Also, in physics, because of Entropy and increase in disorder, time flows in one direction and not the other. So for Terminus who has seen the zenith of entropy, he must also be capable of reversing it if he intends to travel back in time. I think I’ve already mentioned this but there’s a 99% chance this is how Terminus time travels. If you’ve seen the movie Tenet, it should be the same concept.

But since Imaginary Energy works in a closed system and always alternates between order and disorder—essentially being capable of looping back in-itself—I’d bet that it’s genuinely metaphysically impossible for Nanook to accomplish his goal.
Wouldn't that break the speed formula
 
Not really no, it’s more like just changing the direction of time you move in, which isn’t the same as using time as space.
That would mean Terminus is able to travel forward and backward in time at will, hence technically Terminus is able to hop from the beginning of time, to the end of time, no?
 
Irontomb destroys erudition using erudition. It’s entirely possibly Arch forge and the other LR will employ similar strategies to destroy their respective aeons. Again, your theory is just as valid, because it’s a theory. Not fact.

Are you talking about this? Cause I don’t think this implies what you’re trying to claim. Wouldn’t HooH and Mythus’s interference be within THEIR calculations?
“The Equilibrium: Next, you sense THEIR-presence. With THEIR ancient dominance, THEY make things right with utmost precision and no deviation, only slightly affecting the angle at which the robot's chest is incised with a scalpel. You understand that this is THEIR third moment, and #27 Rubert is dead.”
Not really, the third moment is about Rubert's death, not how he is killed.
Nice theory but this has no basis in story. Unless you have proof aeons have “counter-representatives“ that oppose each other? which i’ve asked of you already
Well, we have a few examples; yes, the statement is not confirmed, but it is implied: the Hunt versus Abundance, the balance between Harmony and Elation, the confrontation between Erudition and Enigmata, or even IX being the opposite of Existence (which can be likened to either Hooh or Idrila, the latter actively seeking beauty in Existence).
That would mean Terminus is able to travel forward and backward in time at will, hence technically Terminus is able to hop from the beginning of time, to the end of time, no?
Let's assume Super Nova is right and Terminus can travel through time using Entropy inversion (which is pretty overpowered), then yeah, he should be able to go back to any point in time.

As he himself affirms

However, if we base our argument on this, Terminus's imea argument is very likely to fall apart.
 
Via being capable of killing him lel. But also he’s a Self-Annihilator, so he’s interacted with IX’s Shadow + he should be able to rival Acheron’s powers so there’s genuinely no shot Zephyro can’t touch IX
What do you mean by saying Zephyro’s Nihility is on the same level as Acheron’s? Zephyro is just a self-annihilator, not an Emanator of Nihility.

The fact that he appears in Elio’s script already shows that his Nihility is still inferior to Acheron’s.

If Zephyro were to kill Ix, he would be using Destruction, not Nihility — but even then, the story would still need a solid plot explanation to make it believable, since Zephyro is currently on the same level as other Emanators, not on the Iron Tombs/Cyrene level.
 
What do you mean by saying Zephyro’s Nihility is on the same level as Acheron’s? Zephyro is just a self-annihilator, not an Emanator of Nihility.

The fact that he appears in Elio’s script already shows that his Nihility is still inferior to Acheron’s.

If Zephyro were to kill Ix, he would be using Destruction, not Nihility — but even then, the story would still need a solid plot explanation to make it believable, since Zephyro is currently on the same level as other Emanators, not on the Iron Tombs/Cyrene level.
Never said his Nihility is equivalent to Acherons. I simply said that he has interacted with IX’s Shadow before in some way. And he is not on the same level as other Emanators. He has a special power that reacts violently with black holes, which is why he should be capable of specifically touching IX’s main body because his very being is designed for that
 
Never said his Nihility is equivalent to Acherons. I simply said that he has interacted with IX’s Shadow before in some way. And he is not on the same level as other Emanators. He has a special power that reacts violently with black holes, which is why he should be capable of specifically touching IX’s main body because his very being is designed for that
I think we still need a proper plot explanation, since this is Ix we’re talking about. If Zephyro could really kill Ix right now, then why hasn’t he done it already? I bet Ix wouldn’t react at all, even if you attacked them a million times.
 
I think we still need a proper plot explanation, since this is Ix we’re talking about. If Zephyro could really kill Ix right now, then why hasn’t he done it already? I bet Ix wouldn’t react at all, even if you attacked them a million times.
There are probably many reasons, the most important is that at the end of the universe, IX is the only one that can remain as nothingness itself. So naturally Zephyro will be able to not merely affect a shadow but directly his “divine corpus” as the data bank says.

So basically the end of the universe is the time where he’ll encounter IX the most. Additionally, since that’s when IX has absorbed all of existence, that’ll be the biggest “singularity” which will cause the biggest “white hole” and “destruction” once Zephyro enters him
 
Don't we have NPI in the Path of Nihility section?
Oh yeah, I just realized we don't, ngl all Self-Annihilators are capable of interacting with IX since they're Shadow of IX themselves who shares the same physiology as IX since Shadow of IX is like IX's manifestations across the Imaginary Tree just like how Acheron gets NPI cause she interacted with its manifestations
 
Back
Top