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Honkai: Star Rail Discussion Thread

Solacis said:
Afaik we haven't fully decided on how Imaginary Energy should be categorized, since the details on it are still quite vague.
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I mean, even if it is the case it is still the same type of imaginary energy that the Aeons domains use, I think it could be classified as a possible or that's what I think.
Btw, shouldn't it have resistance to Reality Warping? Because of the Fragmentums
 
sparkle-drip-marketing-v0-oe4b0z18p66c1.jpg

Why couldn't they have gone with Hanabi smh? Now we just need a character named Twilight which is honestly quite possible.
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
What does Class Z link to? I'll do some formatting corrections
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IIRC any sustained attack of a certain potency scales to lifting strength of the same potency. That's how Persona 5 got their Immeasurable LS way back when. Tho admittedly I'm unsure if the standards have changed on that.
 
Gonzalo said:
I mean, even if it is the case it is still the same type of imaginary energy that the Aeons domains use, I think it could be classified as a possible or that's what I think.
Btw, shouldn't it have resistance to Reality Warping? Because of the Fragmentums
Click to expand...
Minor resistance to RW should be fine, based on that description.

The connection between the concepts a Path stems from and the energies of the Path itself haven't been explicitly explained yet, so I'm unsure if simply using Path energy would equate to manipulating the Path's concept. At best it'd make attacks be conceptual in nature, but that kind of thing is very hard to prove without explicit statements, and there are no feats so far to support it.
 
Solacis said:
IIRC any sustained attack of a certain potency scales to lifting strength of the same potency. That's how Persona 5 got their Immeasurable LS way back when. Tho admittedly I'm unsure if the standards have changed on that.
Click to expand...
The only important CRT about LS that changed the standards of the site that I remember we had in this year only removed Immeasurable LS for a few characters
 
Solacis said:
IIRC any sustained attack of a certain potency scales to lifting strength of the same potency. That's how Persona 5 got their Immeasurable LS way back when. Tho admittedly I'm unsure if the standards have changed on that.
Click to expand...
The current standards have changed. You kinda have to wrestle or grapple with another opponent in order to scale in LS. And holding back an energy beam isn't really LS.

I was more asking why does the doomsday beast have Class Z.
 
Emirp sumitpo said:
The current standards have changed. You kinda have to wrestle or grapple with another opponent in order to scale in LS. And holding back an energy beam isn't really LS.

I was more asking why does the doomsday beast have Class Z.
Click to expand...
The Lifting Strength page hasn't changed from what I can see. I remember the rationale was that if a character can output an energy blast strong enough to destroy a planet, and the blast can be sustained for an extended period without noticeably weakening, then it would be reasonable to assume that it carries the same planet-destroying force over longer periods - which is the only difference between lifting and striking strength.

It stands to reason then, that holding back that sustained force would similarly translate to sustained activation of muscles against a resisting force via Newton's Third Law. After all, Lifting Strength is just a measure of the amount of force a character can produce to either exert on a stationary object or to resist an opposing force.

In the context of VS battles, we already use Kinetic Energy in AP and Striking Strength. Work (the unit) is just a measure of change in Kinetic Energy, and is also measured in joules, so the below formula would apply, making it theoretically translatable to Force.

Work (joules) = Force (Newtons) / distance (metres)

Combined with the above rationale, there shouldn't be an issue giving Class Z LS.
 
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Solacis said:
The Lifting Strength page hasn't changed from what I can see. I remember the rationale was that if a character can output an energy blast strong enough to destroy a planet, and the blast can be sustained for an extended period without noticeably weakening, then it would be reasonable to assume that it carries the same planet-destroying force over longer periods - which is the only difference between lifting and striking strength.

It stands to reason then, that holding back that sustained force would similarly translate to sustained activation of muscles against a resisting force via Newton's Third Law. After all, Lifting Strength is just a measure of the amount of force a character can produce to either exert on a stationary object or to resist an opposing force.

In the context of VS battles, we already use Kinetic Energy in AP and Striking Strength. Work (the unit) is just a measure of change in Kinetic Energy, and is also measured in joules, so the below formula would apply, making it theoretically translatable to Force.

Work (joules) = Force (Newtons) / distance (metres)

Combined with the above rationale, there shouldn't be an issue giving Class Z LS.
Click to expand...
It shouldn't be Stellar LS then? Since the Doomsday Beast's Kinetic Energy in AP and Striking Strength is 4-C via it being able to fight, harm and took attacks from four members of the main cast, whose a single member is capable of one-shotting a baseline 4-C monster
 
Solacis said:
Minor resistance to RW should be fine, based on that description.

The connection between the concepts a Path stems from and the energies of the Path itself haven't been explicitly explained yet, so I'm unsure if simply using Path energy would equate to manipulating the Path's concept. At best it'd make attacks be conceptual in nature, but that kind of thing is very hard to prove without explicit statements, and there are no feats so far to support it.
Click to expand...
So it still seems to me that it could be listed as a possible because even if we say that they have attacks of a conceptual nature, they would still have the essence to manipulate the concepts or so I think.
 
I was saving for Ratio since 1.4 and now yall telling me he's free????

At least i can get his zesty-ass lightcone now
 
So when the HSR profiles ready to be published?

And for the game:
Giannysmag said:
I was saving for Ratio since 1.4 and now yall telling me he's free????

At least i can get his zesty-ass lightcone now
Click to expand...
Same, i managed my saving jades for 1.6 to get Ruan Mei/Ratio alongside Xueyi and some of Kafka copies but the 2.0/2.1 make me anxious
Bless MHY for making Ratio free, at least i can grab some copies for him and much more ready for 2.0 and 2.1
 
Enryu_The_Red_Tower said:
It shouldn't be Stellar LS then? Since the Doomsday Beast's Kinetic Energy in AP and Striking Strength is 4-C via it being able to fight, harm and took attacks from four members of the main cast, whose a single member is capable of one-shotting a baseline 4-C monster
Click to expand...
It would, yeah. I forgot to update the LS from when we still thought Trailblazer was Planet level.
 
I actually did a calc that could raise Lord Ravagers to the upper end of 4-B

And that's from the Lord Ravager, Zephyro, being at the Tia'nua galaxy and destroying it.
"The Tia'nua is a galaxy that had been completely destroyed by Lord Ravager, Zephyro between 2157 and 2158 AE."

But how long is an "AE"? That depends, but it ranges from 76 to 240 Trailblaze Years (With the Trailblaze Calendar being a close analogue to the Gregorian calendar)

But it could have been done much quicker than this, as the game starts in 2157 AE, and after the events on Jarilo-VI, it becomes 2158 AE according to an IPC Broadcast.
So it would have taken no longer than 240 years to completely destroy the Tia'nua galaxy, though it is likely MUCH quicker than this absolute baseline for the reason above.

Baseline Galaxy level = 1.053e+66 joules
76 years = 2.397e+9 seconds
240 years = 7.569e+9 seconds

1.053e+66 / 2.397e+9 = ~4.393e+56 joules, or 4.393 TeraFoe (4-B)
1.053e+66 / 7.569e+9 = ~1.391e+56 joules, or 1.391 TeraFoe (4-B)

This is also pretty consistent to Welt Yang saying that overlords of the Antimatter Legion could "incinerate entire galaxies", to which Lord Ravagers are leaders in.
 
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Phantylia should have Incorporeality, as she is a Heliobus; beings made of pure energy that can possess physical bodies to use as vessels, which is exactly what you fight: a vessel that Phantylia possessed.
 
Furudo_Erika said:
I actually did a calc that could raise Lord Ravagers to the upper end of 4-B
Click to expand...
One immediate flaw:

"Between 2157 AE and 2158 AE" is not a timeframe of the destruction process. It's an estimate of when the exact destruction took place, because no one was there to witness it except Zephyro.

The actual report was that Zephyro had been spotted by the IPC going to the Tia'nua star system (another flaw: it's not a galaxy since that's a mistranslation), and when they next checked in, the star system was destroyed.

We know what HSR constitutes as "a destroyed star system" based on the Xianzhou's records of Zephyro. It means the destruction of civilization within said star system, not the physical annihilation of everything in it.

Zephyro, according to the Xianzhou, prefers raw destruction: such as blowing up the civilization's home star, or causing a natural disaster that ravages the planet's surface. Nothing close to 4-B.

The best Lord Ravager feat currently known is that of an unknown one being credited with the chain destruction of several stars in a short timeframe. But we don't yet know who that was.

Should probably check terminology before making calcs next time, though I greatly appreciate the effort.
 
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Solacis said:
The actual report was that Zephyro had been spotted by the IPC going to the Tia'nua star system (another flaw: it's not a galaxy since that's a mistranslation), and when they next checked in, the star system was destroyed.
Click to expand...
Here's the thing about that, I actually looked at the raws, and the word they use (星系) refers to actual galaxies.

I even looked up images and the Chinese Wikipedia page, and it only refers to galaxies, not star systems.

Raw IPC Broadcast

Notice how it uses "星系" at the bottom, which refers to actual galaxies.

Like, there is not a SINGLE image that refers 星系 to star systems, only galaxies.
 
Hell, the official Chinese Wikipedia pages even puts the English word for "星系" explicitly as "Galaxy".

Sure, if you look up 星系 on an USA address, it may show a star system...but on a Chinese site, it only references galaxies.
 
Actually, forget the 4-B calc thing.

Wouldn't Welt be at least 65% of Sirin in HSR?

As it is stated in Alien Space that Welt has recovered 65% of his power since the Second Eruption (and this was still years before HSR), and Alien Space takes place directly before HSR. Plus it is made pretty clear the Welt from Star Rail is the same Welt from HI3; specifically the Welt from APHO/Alien Space.

Also, his Lv. 60 character details say
"These days, Welt rarely fights, and it remains unknown whether or not he retains the strength from his heyday. Gravity manipulation has remained his usual combat means, ever since his cane was transformed from the Star of Eden."

So with that, Welt should be something like:
"At least 4-A (Recovered 65% of his power since the Second Eruption years before the events of HSR and likely recovered even more as time went on), possibly higher (His character details states that it is unknown if he retains the strength from his heyday)"
 
I did see a thread about making Sirin Low 2-C via creating the Infinity Corridor though.

If that does somehow gets accepted, then Welt may scale from that due to the 65% thing, and basically make all of HSR Low 2-C via scaling off of Welt.

Though considering what Sirin's powers are about, and the infinity corridor being likened to a "Complex Riemannian Manifold", it could reach up to Low 1-C by virtue of complex numbers, which would make the corridor a 3+1+1 dimensional structure; 3 spatial dimension, 1 temporal dimension, and 1 imaginary dimension.


Which the set of complex numbers (C) being equal to R^R, as the set of complex numbers embeds both the set of real numbers and the set of imaginary numbers inside of it.
 
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