Hero (Smash Bros.) VS Sans

[The_Wright_Way]

They're commonly displayed as that.... outside of Smash Bros. Unless the ghosts in Smash Bros have feats of actually going through things, then it requires less assumptions to presume they can't, as everyone in the setting can interact with them.

Feats from their home series don't count. Shulk is Low 2-C in his franchise, doesn't mean his Smash equivalent is.

 

[DatOneWeeb]

You have yet to prove the ghost aren't intangible. I honestly don't even know why they wouldn't have NPI since they've been able to consistently harm ghost throughout the series. I've literally given 5 examples of them attacking ghosts.

You didn't understand my point. The ghosts from EarthBound don't have feats of being "intangible". Yet we allow it as NPI and see no problem with it. Why is this any different?

 

[The_Wright_Way]

If that's the case, then Earthbound shouldn't have NPI. But that's a CRT for another day.

The ghosts aren't intangible because they've never shown having the power and we've actually seen people touch them. How are we supposed to prove someone doesn't have an ability? By that logic, vampires can smell the blood in people's veins without proof of having done so as that's something vampires are commonly depicted as doing.

 

[Jinsye]

Gastly itself is actually intangible. It passes through every attack that ain't a projectile.

Projectiles however can hurt it, and Hero has alot of those.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Can he be deflected by a shield? Because that's kinda the crux if Sans argument is his attacks not getting deflected.

 

[DatOneWeeb]

It's not just EarthBound, it's other series as well. However this shouldn't mean they can't have it. Because harming ghosts is allowed to be NIS unless there are contradictions.

"we've seen people touch them" is NOT A valid point as to why a ghost isn't intangible. Otherwise the entire ability of NPI should just be removed. NPI is just an ability all fighters have.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

It is a point against them if they've never walked through any walls or gone through solid objects.

 

[DatOneWeeb]

It is a point against them if they've never walked through any walls or gone through solid objects.

We have seen the Floow being able to fly in between the moving platforms. Edward also made a good point, physical attacks can't harm ghastly yet projectiles can. What does Hero's bounce reflect? Projectiles.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

There we go. That's the kind of proof I was waiting for.

Wait, so reflecting attacks that can hurt intangibles means it can reflect intangibles? What?

Anyways, Hero FRA. NPI means Sans likely can't hit first.

 

[DatOneWeeb]

5 for Hero.

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Even if Hero didn't have NPI, Sans' bones' intangibility is so selective that it doesn't change anything and wouldn't get past Bounce. Bones going through Frisk when they hurt him is like, the most paltry intangibility on the site.

 

[DatOneWeeb]

Is that a vote for Hero?

 

[Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera]

Something that'll also massively negatively affect Hero is that he has no idea what Blue Attacks are, and since standing still is practically the last thing he'll do, Hero likely won't figure it out in time.

As Sans has shown with Frisk's INV (Post-Hit Invulnerability), he can damage opponents even while they should be in an invulnerable state, meaning Bounce is really Hero's only option to counter Sans. Only Hero doesn't know that, and it would be much harder for him to figure that out than Frisk did against Sans, and unlike Frisk, Hero only has one shot.

Speaking of which, Hero does not have SAVE and LOAD, and he doesn't even have much skills in dodging danmaku like Frisk had even far before they fought Sans.

Furthermore, as Abra has shown in Ultimate, Smash characters being teleported puts them at a massive disadvantage, even when they know it's coming.


Yeah, no intel is kind of broken when Sans is involved.

 

[Buttersamuri]

Hero FRA honestly

 

[DatOneWeeb]

6 for Hero, possibly 7 if we count Cal which would start grace. Anyways.

@Sean

His blue attacks will be useless if Hero uses bounce since they will simply be reflected. If anything, this will be bad for Sans because he needs to stand still once they get reflected but at the same time, he can't with Hero trying to attack him.

Yes, Hero needs bounce. Which is why it was my argument. It doesn't matter if Hero knows Sans uses a ton of projectiles, he will use Bounce even against characters will low amounts of them. This might be considered headcanon so don't take this 100% seriously. If a Sans costume was in Smash Ultimate for gunner, someone who mainly uses projectiles, this will likely give Hero the mindset to use bounce even more.

It's only trouble when they get teleported because of the blast-zone underneath which won't be included here. Not to mention Sans will only start using it during the second half of the battle, and I doubt he will be able to survive that long.

 

[Super_Ascended_Sean_Pazdera]

It is not remotely within Hero's character to spam Bounce, nor can he since it's RNG to even find it in his menu and Hero may run out of MP. And Sans will be able to tell that Bounce can counter his attacks faster than Hero will be able to figure out Blue Attacks, all Sans has to worry about is timing his attacks until Hero runs out of MP, after which Hero will not live to cast another Bounce. And all of this is assuming Hero can even ACT on Sans's turn.

I highly doubt any Mii Fighter costume is canon.

That's not what I meant. It's also dangerous because they have no idea where they're going thus surprising them and leaving them open to attack, which is much more of a threat with Sans than with Abra. Also Sans against Frisk =/= SBA.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

....Does Smash Bros even have canon? I don't think you can make tgat argument for game that's literally "Video Game characters beat the shit out of each other: The Game".

"Sans against Frisk =/= SBA" What else are we supposed to use? It's literally the only fight we see of him on screen.

 

[DatOneWeeb]

You do realize you cannot choose what Hero will do, correct? His menu rng is literally just game mechanics to prevent him to be op in game. Hero's MP can replenish over time, and Bounce only uses 14 MP, so I doubt it will be much of an issue. How is Sans going to realize bounce will reflect before Hero even uses it? Bounce is gonna reflect literally anything he throws. He cannot do anything but dodge until Hero's bounce runs out, which will be hard because he can just use it again and increase his speed, along with shooting a projectile that will pull Sans towards it. If you're going to use his game mechanic as an argument, Sans will only do that "special attack" as a last resort. I highly doubt Hero won't be able to hit him once.

Any evidence for this?

Sans will only start teleporting them during the second half, in which he still cannot harm Hero. Frisk is the only time we see him fight, that's all we have seen him do as stated by Wright.

 

[Jinsye]

....Does Smash Bros even have canon? I don't think you can make tgat argument for game that's literally "Video Game characters beat the shit out of each other: The Game".

Subspace tho

 

[DatOneWeeb]

In which Plautena stated that those events did actually happen, as well as spirits from the mode appearing.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Subspace tho

Oh, wow, I genuinely forgot. Thanks.

 

[DatOneWeeb]

Bump

 

[DatOneWeeb]

Did a recount, Hero had 7 votes, not 6. Meaning grace started and was over 2 days ago. I'll go ahead and add this.