Has Sonic as a Continent Buster been accepted

[Davy0]

He had already DESTROYED his home dimension and was looking for the next dimension to destroy which was why they were gathering Chao.

Vague my ass. If it was anyone else in the more popular media, like say, Mario. You'd have placed him at Planet Level in a heartbeat without them having shown the abilities. But this isn't about Planet Level, this is about Continent Level. Sonic has beaten multiple foes far above his payload. Give him his stats, Uncle-san.

Why in the hell did you think I stated to give him Continent Level, because even if it was just life-wiping, it'd still be considered Continent Level. Just give him the stats so we can move on, brah. I'll get to the Planet Level bridge when I can.

 

[Pikachu942]

I agree with Davy, more than enough evidence to support Continent level Base Sonic. I've always thought he was continental before I came to the site, thought it was common knowledge tbh.

 

[Darkness552]

@Davy0

Uncle doesn't seem the type to just upgrade Mario in a heartbeat, actually he is probably the most cautious on the wiki

 

[Davy0]

BS. But sure, whatever. Just give him the upgrades, Lifewiping = Continent Level now, and guess who else gets the Upgrades. Most of the cast.

 

[Darkness552]

the lifewiping would also have to come with certain parameters like time frame, how was it done, and others

 

[Unclechairman]

"He had already DESTROYED his home dimension and was looking for the next dimension to destroy which was why they were gathering Chao."

Got a timeframe? If so, maybe we can make something out of it. If not, you're shit out of luck.

"Why in the hell did you think I stated to give him Continent Level, because even if it was just life-wiping, it'd still be considered Continent Level."

I already explained this in my previous reply. Lifewiping is 100% unquantifiable, which is why we discarded it as a rating/category in the first place. Just ask Antvasima or any of the admins which were around when I first came here (around late February), because it was dropped around that time if I remember.

 

[Davy0]

Thy didn't say over time. Don't we always assume, if there is no record, that the time frame is in an instant, there is no reason not to believe what Gerald Robotnik states either, as he has studied various creatures, and this was before he reached insanity, when he was still a very intelligent and highly praised scientist. Shall we go by the argument that it took a certain time frame for Freeza to blow up Namek, and had it not been for the fact that he'd whiffed on his attack that it would have been outright destroyed. Or various other accounts in series (that's just the most well known one, thank god for Kai being canon now or DB's scaling would still be in the crapper). Why would they be afraid of a character, that was less than a planet destroyer if they'd already defeated someone as powerful as Emerl, again?

 

[Davy0]

"He had already DESTROYED his home dimension and was looking for the next dimension to destroy which was why they were gathering Chao."
Got a timeframe? If so, maybe we can make something out of it. If not, you're shit out of luck.

"Why in the hell did you think I stated to give him Continent Level, because even if it was just life-wiping, it'd still be considered Continent Level."

I already explained this in my previous reply. Lifewiping is 100% unquantifiable, which is why we discarded it as a rating/category in the first place. Just ask Antvasima or any of the admins which were around when I first came here (around late February), because it was dropped around that time if I remember.

Cursing now. Isn't that horrible for an admin to do. Seems like the rustled jimmies are becoming more apparent.

Nah, it's not. Because at first they stated destroyed the planet. How about you go back and look at the stuff I so difficultly worked hard on before you run your mouth about it. Unless otherwise stated, we take the conditions of word-from-mouth. And there's no reason not to believe them.

 

[Unclechairman]

"Don't we always assume, if there is no record, that the time frame is in an instant"

Absolutely not. Why do you think I'm asking for a timeframe in the first place? If you want to bring Dragon Ball into this (don't worry, it always worms it's way into every discussion on this wiki), why do you think people were asking for a timeframe for Kid Buu's galactic rampage? Because if there had been none, the feat would have been unquantifiable. We would not simply assume he one-shotted it; that kind of logic is ridiculous on it's face. And Frieza's feat of destroying Namek is not accounted for because it was a chain reaction over a period of time.

"Why would they be afraid of a character, that was less than a planet destroyer if they'd already defeated someone as powerful as Emerl, again?"

I don't know. Ask SEGA/Sonic Team. They're the ones that write the plots for these games, and they're the ones who opt for plot convenience rather than establishing a clear scale of power. The Egg Wizard with the Power of the Stars was Universal at least, and Super Sonic and Burning Blaze beat it with seemingly little difficulty, yet Super Sonic had such a hard time against Dark Gaia that he passed out from exhaustion.

 

[Davy0]

We saw what happened with Buu though, it was done through chain reaction of destroying multiple solar systems, which is why he's Multi-Solar System Level now, hmhm....

Yeah. Ask Nintendo why Mario's games have no established timeframe too, or why Mario still needs to fight Base Bowser who should be far weaker than he is after gaining Galaxy Busting abilities. Eck, so many splinters...

 

[Unclechairman]

"Cursing now. Isn't that horrible for an admin to do. Seems like the rustled jimmies are becoming more apparent."

For one, it seems the restrictions on language were finally loosened up a bit. Secondly, your attempts to "call me out" on my behavior reveal more about you than they do me. An outside observer may simply note your apparent desperation, considering that you feel the need to fall back on this type of myopic statement.

"at first they stated destroyed the planet"

Still unacceptably vague. I've noted that pop culture villains are constantly hyped as being able to "destroy the world", but only a fraction of them are actual planet busters. "Destroy the world" could mean simply ravaging it's surface (lifewiping) or destroying the major civilizations on the planet (when it's them who are narrating the story). At any of these points, the world could plausibly be said to have been destroyed. If you're the sole survivor of the apocalypse, and all you see around you is death and destruction, what is the world to you? Many terms could be applied; ravaged, ended, and, yes, destroyed (in fact, destroyed is probably the more commonly used of these).

 

[Davy0]

"Cursing now. Isn't that horrible for an admin to do. Seems like the rustled jimmies are becoming more apparent."
For one, it seems the restrictions on language were finally loosened up a bit. Secondly, your attempts to "call me out" on my behavior reveal more about you than they do me. An outside observer may simply note your apparent desperation, considering that you feel the need to fall back on this type of myopic statement.

"at first they stated destroyed the planet"


Still unacceptably vague. I've noted that pop culture villains are constantly hyped as being able to "destroy the world", but only a fraction of them are actual planet busters. "Destroy the world" could mean simply ravaging it's surface (lifewiping) or destroying the major civilizations on the planet (when it's them who are narrating the story). At any of these points, the world could plausibly be said to have been destroyed. If you're the sole survivor of the apocalypse, and all you see around you is death and destruction, what is the world to you? Many terms could be applied; ravaged, ended, and, yes, destroyed (in fact, destroyed is probably the more commonly used of these).

Desperation? I did all the homework I needed. Sonic defeated and harmed enough planet level foes to have his abilities increase. He also beat a potentially planet level foe, that's all I need. You're the desperate one here. Shouldn't feel too bad though, when you got nothing to hang on to, of course you get desperate, so I feel for ya, Uncle-san.

 

[Unclechairman]

We saw what happened with Buu though, it was done through chain reaction of destroying multiple solar systems, which is why he's Multi-Solar System Level now, hmhm....
Yeah. Ask Nintendo why Mario's games have no established timeframe too, or why Mario still needs to fight Base Bowser who should be far weaker than he is after gaining Galaxy Busting abilities. Eck, so many splinters...

That's not a chain reaction. A chain reaction is when doing one thing causes a domino effect that causes other things. Frieza's destruction of Namek is a perfect example of a chain reaction; he only directly destroyed the core of the planet, but destroying the core led to a domino effect that indirectly caused the planet to explode. Buu's feat is not a chain reaction because everything he destroyed, he did so directly.

Again, plot convenience trumps clear scaling of power for most game developers, since they don't have our system of ranking characters in mind. Unlike Sonic, though, Mario has the courtesy to change up the plot devices used from time to time, preventing the scaling and ranking issues that we've run into with the Chaos Emeralds.

 

[Davy0]

We saw what happened with Buu though, it was done through chain reaction of destroying multiple solar systems, which is why he's Multi-Solar System Level now, hmhm....
Yeah. Ask Nintendo why Mario's games have no established timeframe too, or why Mario still needs to fight Base Bowser who should be far weaker than he is after gaining Galaxy Busting abilities. Eck, so many splinters...

That's not a chain reaction. A chain reaction is when doing one thing causes a domino effect that causes other things. Frieza's destruction of Namek is a perfect example of a chain reaction; he only directly destroyed the core of the planet, but destroying the core led to a domino effect that indirectly caused the planet to explode. Buu's feat is not a chain reaction because everything he destroyed, he did so directly.
Again, plot convenience trumps clear scaling of power for most game developers, since they don't have our system of ranking characters in mind. Unlike Sonic, though, Mario has the courtesy to change up the plot devices used from time to time, preventing the scaling and ranking issues that we've run into with the Chaos Emeralds.

Ahhh... so various weather phenomena, lava spewing out the planet and the sea turning into nothing more than lava because of the planet about to explode isn't a chain reaction now. Dually noted. Still took him a lot of time to destroy the universe. But whatever.

Actually they have. Grand Star for example, has MANY problems with it. We don't know how to rank the Power of Wishes still, etc, etc. But sure, keep going, sir.

 

[Unclechairman]

"Ahhh... so various weather phenomena, lava spewing out the planet and the sea turning into nothing more than lava because of the planet about to explode isn't a chain reaction now."

I just explained that Frieza's destruction of Namek was a chain reaction. Are you even listening?

 

[Davy0]

Nah, I stopped listening to you the moment you stated that the Ifrit wasn't even continent level even though Gerald Robotnik very clearly studied its habits and called it such. And Gerald Robotnik built a machine made for busting planets and "piercing stars". Yet he doesn't know what Planet Level Destruction is. It's too funny.

 

[Darkness552]

hmm somthing interesting i found in Davy's thread about the Ifrit

here

Shadow says something like

"Ifrit destroyed this planet already" of course this is lifewiping but seeing as how the damage looked similar to what Iblis did it can pass off as continent level because Shadow saying already seems to imply that Ifrit did it in a short amount of time

also the life wiping thing was getting changed to either unknown or continent level based on how the feat was done (just looked back at some old discussions)

 

[Davy0]

Is that so, Darkness... Hm... But wait, he's gonna come back. The rebuttals ALWAYS come. Come on, Uncle-san, you got this one!

 

[Darkness552]

Davy

tone down the hostility

 

[Unclechairman]

I'm afraid that unless a specific timeframe is given, there's not much you can make of it. "A short time" is still rather vague and could mean almost any time frame depending on what one views as "a short time".

Also, I didn't bring this up because I was busy addressing Davy's points, but boosting base Sonic to Continent level would be inconsistent with Excalibur Sonic's established level of power, as Dark Queen Merlina only demonstrated influence over a Country-sized area.

 

[Davy0]

Wait. You do realise I told him twice to go look at all the work I did, yet he never did. I wanted to be the cat that played with its food before taking the bite. Can't be mad at me for that. Guess he didn't think anything I posted up was worth watching. Thanks for spitting in my face Uncle-san, that was so mean...

 

[Davy0]

I'm afraid that unless a specific timeframe is given, there's not much you can make of it. "A short time" is still rather vague and could mean almost any time frame depending on what one views as "a short time".
Also, I didn't bring this up because I was busy addressing Davy's points, but boosting base Sonic to Continent level would be inconsistent with Excalibur Sonic's established level of power, as Dark Queen Merlina only demonstrated influence over a Country-sized area.

Country Level, Continent Level, Planet Level, when I give a crap I'll let ya know. Please give him his stats. (Holds his hands out with bright puppy dog eyes.)

 

[Darkness552]

i mean it also seems to me that Shadow was also implying that Ifrit has done it before to other worlds and for him to do that in what i think is a small period of time due to what happened in the game it would pass off as a feat done in a time logical enough to be continent level type of feat

but you do bring up a logical point about Excalibur and how the Dark Queen i think was able to beat Base Sonic so that is something in consideration

 

[Unclechairman]

Here you go.

 

[Davy0]

Nope, because we don't really know their power levels. she said that she wished for the Kingdom to never end, that could also mean that she was wishing for the world to stay the same. Thanks for trying Uncle-san, keep trying, I guess?


How about a little higher than that, say Continent Level.

 

[Unclechairman]

Kingdom =/= world or planet. Not even remotely. She never showed any concern for the world outside of Camelot.

 

[Pikachu942]

Actually, the refer to what she is altering as "world" multiple times in game.

For example: "What good is a world that goes on forever? That sounds pretty lame."-Sonic

 

[Unclechairman]

The World of Camelot, yes? It's basically a Country-sized area inside of a storybook, and I don't believe it to be any bigger considering what Camelot is based on in the legends (Great Britain, specifically England).

 

[Davy0]

Doesn't really matter. It doesn't have to show the world. The kingdom never changing yet the planet not changing, Sonic also states something interesting too.


WHAT GOOD IS A WORLD THAT GOES ON FOREVER? THAT SOUNDS PRETTY LAME.

 

[Davy0]

The World of Camelot, yes? It's basically a Country-sized area inside of a storybook, and I don't believe it to be any bigger considering what Camelot is based on in the legends (Great Britain, specifically England).

Hm... Why should we leave that this story-book is only Country-Sized when the whole of a certain other Storybook was also at least World Sized. Very strange... Very very strange, Uncle-san.

 

[Unclechairman]

You really think Sonic is referring to the size of the kingdom or even the kingdom itself? Sonic was speaking in general terms here; he was of the belief that any place or world that goes on forever would be stagnant and boring, and this was practically the moral of the story (or at least the ending).

 

[Davy0]

No. He stated world. Just because she stated she loved the Kingdom, doesn't mean her powers don't stretch farther than that. Looks like Sonic-san can attest to that. Uncle-san, giving up sounds the best possible answer to saving face. I'm about ready to take my bite...

 

[Pikachu942]

Another line, this one by Merlina.

"This story and the world it created will come to an end. Is that what you wish?"

 

[Darkness552]

it seems sonic's reference to "world" was used in more general terms here

anyway i have to go, you guys can continue and i will read over what was said and whatnot

 

[Unclechairman]

"Why should we leave that this story-book is only Country-Sized when the whole of a certain other Storybook was also at least World Sized."

Different storybook, different world. Better question, why would they be the same size when they are completely different settings? There's no basis to assume such a thing.

 

[Davy0]

Another line, this one by Merlina.
"This story and the world it created will come to an end. Is that what you wish?"

You are making things so much easier for these aching parts of mine, Pikachu, I worked hard for all this information, yet Uncle-san isn't getting it.

 

[Unclechairman]

I'll be dropping out for now as well. I think I'll pick back up on this tomorrow.

 

[Davy0]

You're not making yourself look any better if ya do, Uncle-san. But alright. Just come ready to lose, alright?

 

[Pikachu942]

No problem, Davy.

Also, I'd like to add Merlina gained all the power of the Underworld in order to reach the Dark Queen form.

Finally, I'd assume people would just accept Excalibur Sonic is basically Super Sonic in Knight Armor, and should be roughly equal to him. He doesn't even run on different mechanics and stuff like Darkspine (who is far superior to both), he functions just about exactly the same.

 

[Davy0]

The first thing you said is too variable about the Underworld, we don't know how vast said place is or its power source, thus we can't use it. But it was going to make the entire world "immortal". Because of course, the planet being destroyed basically screws up the whole "immortal planet" thing. But don't tell, Uncle-san that. (Whisper whisper)

The second thing. We don't know that for sure, that's a fallacy and Sonic is Large Planet Level while if it was true, Excalibur Sonic would only be Planet Level. But excellent enthusiasm though, love ya for it.