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Hajun (With Tumor) vs Lambdadelta and Bernkastel

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>I think the 10 difference came from some statement about 1 difference being enough to stomp, but 10 difference being a bacteria compared to a universe or something.

There's actually no difference between a difference of one Taikyoku and a difference of 10 Taikyoku. Higher God still treats the lower one as nothing more than an irrelevant existence
 
DarkLK said:
Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot said:
Yeah, I still need to hop back on skype when I have the time so we can finish setting up the proper reasoning.
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This is certainly good, but it would be even better if people visited my blog and helped to draw a conclusion about how we should evaluate the hierarchy of concepts and the peak of all things. This is quite relevant because of the recent reform of the types of conceptual manipulation.
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Well, speaking about that, i reached a conclusion of the Hierarchical Ladder of Concepts and Peak of all Things and the Cosmology of the verse.

Wanna know my conclusion/opinion? Maybe it could be of help. Though, honestly, When They Cry's Cosmology is mainly a subjective topic considering the amount of ways paragraphs and statements/feats could be analyzed.
 
ArceusBowser44 said:
Wanna know my conclusion/opinion?
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I wish that there was some kind of "accepted" point, so I will not be bothered with questions.
 
This is a weird fight, at least for me. I didn't read KKK, but from what I've heard Hajun is above the Voyagers and more closer to Auau in power, but from what I've seen here the Voyagers are apparently stronger than him. So, which is more correct?

Also, isn't 'When they cry' going into a revision right now?
 
ArceusBowser44 said:
Though, honestly, When They Cry's Cosmology is mainly a subjective topic considering the amount of ways paragraphs and statements/feats could be analyzed.
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I do not know what the problem is. If you have information then everything is pretty simple. The Human Domain Includes those things that "humans" (ones tossed about by fate) are able to conceptualize (not necessarily for them to understand these things). Their dreams and fictions becomes worlds of the lower layers, which do not differ from the original world in terms of internal complexity, but they are below it relative to the hierarchy of such layers. The higher Domain consists of things that "humans" simply can not describe, no matter how they choose the wording. The hierarchy or recursion of the layers of the Human Domain not mean anything for the higher Domain beings, all the lower Domain worlds seem equally insignificant to them.
 
Ovy7 said:
This is a weird fight, at least for me. I didn't read KKK, but from what I've heard Hajun is above the Voyagers and more closer to Auau in power, but from what I've seen here the Voyagers are apparently stronger than him. So, which is more correct?
Also, isn't 'When they cry' going into a revision right now?
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To answer this question you need a specialist who knows both verses quite well.
 
DarkLK said:
ArceusBowser44 said:
Though, honestly, When They Cry's Cosmology is mainly a subjective topic considering the amount of ways paragraphs and statements/feats could be analyzed.
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I do not know what the problem is. If you have information then everything is pretty simple. The Human Domain Includes those things that "humans" (ones tossed about by fate) are able to conceptualize (not necessarily for them to understand these things). Their dreams and fictions becomes worlds of the lower layers, which do not differ from the original world in terms of internal complexity, but they are below it relative to the hierarchy of such layers. The higher Domain consists of things that "humans" simply can not describe, no matter how they choose the wording. The hierarchy or recursion of the layers of the Human Domain not mean anything for the higher Domain beings, all the lower Domain worlds seem equally insignificant to them.
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I mean, those are pretty much the basic things. I know that, that is also what i wrote in my blog (in Character Stats and Profile Wikia).

However, people have their own way of interpreting other things. For example, i saw someone saying that the Golden Land exists beyond the Cat Box, and then other people who said the contrary. There are people who think that the City of Books is a place very near to the Domain of the Creator and others who think that it is simply a layer of the Domain of Witches that exists beyond Beatrice's Territory.

That is what i meant by "When They Cry's Cosmology is subjective".
 
DarkLK said:
ArceusBowser44 said:
Wanna know my conclusion/opinion?
Click to expand...
I wish that there was some kind of "accepted" point, so I will not be bothered with questions.
Click to expand...
I mean, that is rude. When i asked you something about When They Cry is not because i wanted to bother you, you are the most knowledgeable and i just wanted you to clairify something for me, since i only know well Umineko.

And actually, i always thanked you for the information you gave me, and even apologyzed if i was being annoying to you, and i never disagreed with you anyway (i did disagree with the Domain of Human being infinetely layered, but then you showed me the information i needed and changed my opinion).

And the conclusion i reached isn't even based on what you told me. In fact, i already had a clear vision of the Cosmology, i just needed some clairifications, and because of those, i later put those information in my blog and changed my Cosmology a bit here and there.
 
I already said what a "catbox" is.

The manifestations of Bern and Lambda from this story clearly belong to the Witch Domain. So the City of Books from this story does not exceed this Domain. Because they can freely move there.

This is no more "subjective" than any other other large verse on this wiki. Everywhere there are some debates and differences of opinion.
 
I'm not trying to sound rude, but do you even read what i said?

I just said that people have different opinions on it. I know what a Cat Box is, and in my blog i even stated that the City of Books is part of the Domain of Witches.
 
ArceusBowser44 said:
I'm not trying to sound rude, but do you even read what i said?
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You said that it's subjective because some people look at these things differently. I say the same thing with any other large verse.
 
Nice. Though i never asked for the clarification about the Cat Box and the City of Books, since i didn't even ask about that, because i was simply clarifying that people might think it differently from you. I wasn't trying to debate you, let along asking for clarifications about something since i didn't ask anything.
 
And I explained how you can just give arguments against such subjective interpretations. This is literally the basis of this wiki.
 
I mean, if that is what you were trying to do then that's fine (even though i didn't ask for that, mainly because i already knew that the City of Books is part of the Domain of Witches, and i knew what a Cat Box is), though the way you said made it sound slightly, hm, cocky.
 
ArceusBowser44 said:
though the way you said made it sound slightly, hm, cocky.
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It seems that I am periodically accused of something like this. Maybe it's because of my problems with English. Although my words often contain some irony, my entire image is also based on some self-irony.
 
DarkLK said:
KingPin0422 said:
Bernkastel and Lambdadelta transcend two levels of infinite 1-A hierarchies (the Human Domain already contains an infinite 1-A hierarchy, the Witch Domain is conceptually above it, and Bern and Lambda exist in the God Domain which is conceptually above that)
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This is not really how it works... At least for now.
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Well, to be entirely honest, while i also don't get what King is saying, however, if he's saying that the Domain of Humans as a whole is 1-A, then that's right.

You see, the Domain of Humans, contains conceptual layers (like, for example, the conceptual layer of mind and emotions, the one where there is a unity of matter and soul and various others).

Each of those layers is beyond the second layer (the layer that i like to call "Quantum Layer", which exists beyond the Real World, aka the Human World, where there are basic cultural concepts). The Quantum layer contains the concept and idea of the "Wave Function", which forms Hilbert Space, and the latter is Infinite Dimensional.

All those layers existing beyond Wave Function are 1-A, since they are technically beyond the concept of Wave and Functions and Hilbert Space.

So, the Domain of Humans being 1-A does make sense.

Not to mention the Clud of Incomprehensible concepts, where concepts much more complicated and difficult than the one of Wave Functions are contained.

Then, the Peak of All Things, the transition stage that separates Humans from beings of the higher order. Though i'm not sure if the Peak of All Things count as a conceptual plane of the Domain of Humans: it sounds more like a conceptual plane between the Domain of Humans and the one of Witches.
 
Honestly, I'm not sure that we should evaluate every mention of the wave function as an infinite-dimensionality.

And these things are not what are called "layers" (specific in-universe term). Layers are basically the degree of stories. But this scheme reveals the inner complexity of the world of a single story.
 
I see. I don't have a problem with the Domain of Humans being 1-A, though other guy's opinions would be nice.

And yeah, i'm used to call those "layers" because..well, i generally call everything that is like, "part of a staircase" a layer or a step. But like you said, in-universe, "layer" is the wrong word here.
 
Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot said:
DarkLK said:
Honestly, I'm not sure that we should evaluate every mention of the wave function as an infinite-dimensionality.
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^
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Can i ask why though?

When we speak of Wave Functions, there is literally one thing we are talking about. And that is the Wave Function page i linked above.

Wave Function is one concept, it's not like String Theory which has different "roots" (one that grants 11-dimensionality, another that grants 26-dimensionality and etc).

Not to mention how Spiritual Beings (in Umineko) communicate with Humans (inhabitants of the Real World of the Domain of Humans) trough Wave Lenghts, which are fundamental for the Wave Functions (Wave Functions are the relation between photon's momentum and wavelength)


And Supernatural beings/Spirits reside in the Supernatural World, which exist in the same plane of the Wave Functions, and after watching Umineko, i reached the conclusion that Spirits can also manipulate the concepts that exist beyond the Wave Functions (it is a long explanation that you can find in CSaP).
 
ArceusBowser44 said:
Wave Function is one concept, it's not like String Theory which has different "roots" (one that grants 11-dimensionality, another that grants 26-dimensionality and etc).
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Because "wave functions" themselves are not inherently High 1-B. They are functions, not some kind of physical reality.
 
Azathoth the Abyssal Idiot said:
ArceusBowser44 said:
Wave Function is one concept, it's not like String Theory which has different "roots" (one that grants 11-dimensionality, another that grants 26-dimensionality and etc).
Click to expand...
Because "wave functions" themselves are not inherently High 1-B. They are functions, not some kind of physical reality.
Click to expand...
True, but they form Hilber Space, so Hilbert Space exists in the same plane of the Wave Functions, i think.
 
Eganergo said:
I was really hoping hajun is on the same lv as featherine though.
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If not for the Tumor weakness (which it isnt really a big deal), he might be nigh omni
 
Yeah,either Yato stomp Bern or Bern stomp Yato,and due of how immeasurable Hajun with tumor is,he roftlstomp both Bern and Lambda.
 
"Immeasurable"

^ This depending on the context can mean either "over 2 degrees of infinity" or "an unquantifiably big amount of taikyokus".
 
DMB 1 said:
"Immeasurable"

^ This depending on the context can mean either "over 2 degrees of infinity" or "an unquantifiably big amount of taikyokus".
Click to expand...
We've already established the difference of just one taikyoku if you read above
 
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