Goku Mui Reactive Evolution Revision

[Chariot190]

So no proof then..

I brought it up bc you’re the one who brought up the shit with hit so I just went back and forth with the idea to refute you. Nobody is backpedaling.

You realize you brought up the ki argument before I even posted right?
Have you not been following your arguments here.
Anyway,

bro is still giving a ultimatum bc he can’t accept goku solos

That isn't an ultimatum? It's literally how the wiki works, you need to actually prove the shit for it to get added? We don't just accept "hmm well, it's never shown or stated, but I think it'd be cool if it worked like that".

So yes post proof, or it won't get accepted.
Further stonewalling and I'm contacting a mod to close this.

 

[Saintdhqhdy]

Literally not, it just means I ain't broke ass.


Situation in context being shit like getting ass kicked by a dude 50x his strength, not he could adapt to someone temporarily BFR'ing him or turning his abstract mind into a rat.

Hell, didn't MUI Goku literally get fooled by an illusion? Why didn't he adapt to that?

Or why didn't his body adapt to info analysis from Gran?
Etc.

The diamond warrior stuff was a joke… you really didn’t need to respond to that Calm down.

You’re saying just bc it was shown like that, that’s the only way it functions??

when did goku get folded by an illusion with fp mui

Blud said info analysis, not even a real hax ability, it’s just someone examining their opponent to find out stuff about them irl detectives have info analysis hax ig tho

 

[thetechmaster36]

Sad that when it comes to DB, the claim is often that a hax failing to work is a weakness of the hax, instead of advanced ki control providing resistance.

Well, this is more-or-less a byproduct of having your hax potency tied to an AP-oriented UES, and where showings of hax can be specifically negated by having a higher power level than the hax user. But that's neither here nor there.

 

[Saintdhqhdy]

So no proof then..

You realize you brought up the ki argument before I even posted right?
Have you not been following your arguments here.
Anyway,

That isn't an ultimatum? It's literally how the wiki works, you need to actually prove the shit for it to get added? We don't just accept "hmm well, it's never shown or stated, but I think it'd be cool if it worked like that".

So yes post proof, or it won't get accepted.
Further stonewalling and I'm contacting a mod to close this.

It was supporting evidence, not my actual argument. You do realize there was literally an entire sentence before I said that right?

it is a ultimatum, look at the definition lol.
Yea obviously, like I said before, you can prove things in different ways, not just the way you’re asking for. If I do tho pls show me where that’s stated anywhere on the wiki.

“it’s not a ultimatum”
gives another ultimatum

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

Sad that when it comes to DB, the claim is often that a hax failing to work is a weakness of the hax, instead of advanced ki control providing resistance.

Well we’re specifically talking about the manga continuity afaik, where it is indeed a weakness of Hit’s hax.

 

[Saintdhqhdy]

I don’t see where you are getting that from, your scans show ap/dura increases, and the wording used, “growing sturdier” and “surpassing limits” imply physical growth as well. He also gained the ability to manipulate his ki in a new way, but that’s not a different power, he’s just applying what he already has in a new way, same as using any other technique

“Surpassing limits” only imply physical growth how? That could literally refer to multiple things.
The energy projection thing was a troll argument, I just knew the guy I said it to couldn’t refute it so I just let it in.

 

[Chariot190]

You’re saying just bc it was shown like that, that’s the only way it functions??

Yes. Unless it's explicitly stated to do something (it hasn't been stated to) or shown (it hasn't been shown to), then yes, what we see is what it gets, nothing more, nothing less.

when did goku get folded by an illusion with fp mui

Against Moro. Hell, Moro even straight up says his magic gives him an edge against MUI Goku.

Blud said info analysis, not even a real hax ability,

In the case of Gran it may as well be bordering on hax. But that sounds like denial tbh.
Here's a better one, why can Ki attacks work against Goku? You'd think his body would evolve to be invulnerable to such an easy thing as energy beams?

“Surpassing limits” only imply physical growth how? That could literally refer to multiple things.

Because that's what it's shown to entail and the context in which it is said is referring directly to such cases? As such, that's what it gets. We're indexing DB, not your personal Headcanon lad.

 

[StekFence]

Surpassing limits by transforming implies physical, because it usually refers to the limits of your power. Especially because we are talking about dragon ball, where transforming is usually to increase your power

 

[Magicomethkuon]

Well we’re specifically talking about the manga continuity afaik, where it is indeed a weakness of Hit’s hax.

Don't get me wrong, I understand the scrutiny. Would go more in depth about my reasons but that would sidetrack the thread. My current to-read list is the size of the Milky Way so this may take a while, but I plan on going through DB's manga continuity again. Reformulate some ideas of my own, help discuss others if the future allows it. In the meantime, don't have much of an issue with the current way of things. And I admit that I need a lot more to work with for my case than I currently have.

 

[Saintdhqhdy]

Yes. Unless it's explicitly stated to do something (it hasn't been stated to) or shown (it hasn't been shown to), then yes, what we see is what it gets, nothing more, nothing less.

Against Moro. Hell, Moro even straight up says his magic gives him an edge against MUI Goku.

In the case of Gran it may as well be bordering on hax. But that sounds like denial tbh.
Here's a better one, why can Ki attacks work against Goku? You'd think his body would evolve to be invulnerable to such an easy thing as energy beams?

Because that's what it's shown to entail and the context in which it is said is referring directly to such cases? As such, that's what it gets. We're indexing DB, not your personal Headcanon lad.

Actually, it’s stated to surpass goku limits, which can mean more things than just physical strength.

Mui goku, not a fp mui goku, which is the Avatar.

Explain the Granolah part. Anyways, it wouldn’t even matter bc it’s not fp mui, which is who I’m arguing for. When did a ki attack ever work against fp mui goku?

Idk if y’all confused but I make it very clear in the post that the goku that adapts to shit is the fp mui avatar, not just mui. Hence why I used an example of it.

It’s shown to entail goku adapting to his opponent, not just a ki amp like you think.

Headcanon is me completely making something up, I’m using narrative implications to make my argument, stop using words you don’t know the definition of.

 

[Saintdhqhdy]

Surpassing limits by transforming implies physical, because it usually refers to the limits of your power. Especially because we are talking about dragon ball, where transforming is usually to increase your power

We know transformations in dragon ball can also give you hax so not necessarily.

 

[Magicomethkuon]

Actually, it’s stated to surpass goku limits, which can mean more things than just physical strength.

Mui goku, not a fp mui goku, which is the Avatar.

Explain the Granolah part. Anyways, it wouldn’t even matter bc it’s not fp mui, which is who I’m arguing for. When did a ki attack ever work against fp mui goku?

Idk if y’all confused but I make it very clear in the post that the goku that adapts to shit is the fp mui avatar, not just mui. Hence why I used an example of it.

It’s shown to entail goku adapting to his opponent, not just a ki amp like you think.

Headcanon is me completely making something up, I’m using narrative implications to make my argument, stop using words you don’t know the definition of.

This forum works on a feat basis, Saint. It's like a scientifical theory, deductions on their own won't cut it even if it seems likely. Because the possibilities are many. If we conclude that Goku can resist hax that he has not fought before from the scans and statement alone, it can be stretched and extrapolate far past limits shown. Statements help but don't win threads on their own.

 

[Chariot190]

Actually, it’s stated to surpass goku limits, which can mean more things than just physical strength.

And it's on you to prove that, which you haven't. Every instance is physical, so post proof it extends to hax.

Mui goku, not a fp mui goku, which is the Avatar.

You're arguing for the completely featless avatar? Bro that's unironically even worse, that has even LESS going for it.
Also one of your alleged examples is MUI, not the avatar, in fact the only statement that could even be stretched to mean what you're arguing is for MUI.

Explain the Granolah part. Anyways, it wouldn’t even matter bc it’s not fp mui, which is who I’m arguing for. When did a ki attack ever work against fp mui goku?

Jesus please don't tell me you're arguing Avatar Goku is immune to ki attacks.
And just read the profile.

It’s shown to entail goku adapting to his opponent, not just a ki amp like you think

Adapting in terms of "oh Goku got stronger" or "oh his body hardened so he could tank this attack", literally it, nothing else. It's on you to prove it extends beyond that.

Headcanon is me completely making something up, I’m using narrative implications to make my argument, stop using words you don’t know the definition of.

Your narrative implications are being stretched to the point of basically being made up, you're taking a statement and extrapolating to mean something completely unfounded in context. That's blatant Headcanon ngl, it may as well be made up.
If it isn't, just post proof, I'm sure you've realized by now nobody is agreeing with you here based on your current "evidence", you're going to need something more definitive or concrete here.

 

[Saintdhqhdy]

And it's on you to prove that, which you haven't. Every instance is physical, so post proof it extends to hax.


You're arguing for the completely featless avatar? Bro that's unironically even worse, that has even LESS going for it.
Also one of your alleged examples is MUI, not the avatar, in fact the only statement that could even be stretched to mean what you're arguing is for MUI.


Jesus please don't tell me you're arguing Avatar Goku is immune to ki attacks.
And just read the profile.


Adapting in terms of "oh Goku got stronger" or "oh his body hardened so he could tank this attack", literally it, nothing else. It's on you to prove it extends beyond that.


Your narrative implications are being stretched to the point of basically being made up, you're taking a statement and extrapolating to mean something completely unfounded in context. That's blatant Headcanon ngl, it may as well be made up.
If it isn't, just post proof, I'm sure you've realized by now nobody is agreeing with you here based on your current "evidence", you're going to need something more definitive or concrete here.

I did, my original argument is saying that it’s narratively correct, in which you haven’t responded to.

goku avatar is featless? “Db fans don’t read” he literally beat moro and overpowered gas. The avatar literally represents fp mui cool one of my examples was mui. I wasn’t using that example when making my argument tho.

How am I extrapolating it? the context of fp mui is to allow goku to adapt to any situation by surpassing his limits so he can win. In the instance i showed, all he needed was to get stronger, so that’s what he did. So no, not headcanon. Don’t know why it matters if ppl agree with me or nah, as long as I refute everything it’s good.

We been typing paragraphs for like 30 minutes now, going back and forth on literally the same thing, you repeating yourself. I’m really starting to get tired of it, don’t have that text debater stamina like you. We can settle this in call quickly later today and I’ll just post the recording of me beating you in here. This way I won’t have to explain the same thing to you over and over again in paragraph form

 

[Chariot190]

I did, my original argument is saying that it’s narratively correct, in which you haven’t responded to.

Because it's a nonargument. Your personal interpretation of an unfounded conjecture that you personally believe might make sense, ultimately means **** all here, we don't list what people think might make sense if there's no backing or corroborative evidence.

goku avatar is featless? “Db fans don’t read” he literally beat moro and overpowered gas. The avatar literally represents fp mui cool one of my examples was mui. I wasn’t using that example when making my argument tho.

Yes, featless. It has no feats for what you're arguing. Obviously wasn't talking about it not having any power feats, nobody is talking about that, we're talking about if it can adapt to hax, in which case, it's featless.
It being strong isn't even remotely supportive as a feat.

One of your examples being MUI falls flat as well because we already know hax can work on MUI, basically confirming that statement in question wasn't talking about hax at all and thus isn't evidence at all to your claim.

How am I extrapolating it? the context of fp mui is to allow goku to adapt to any situation by surpassing his limits so he can win. So no, not headcanon. Don’t know why it matters if ppl agree with me or nah, as long as I refute everything it’s good.

Because the statement "surpassing his limits" is being extrapolated to mean he can adapt to esoteric hax, when in reality, the statement is just saying "yo Goku can become even stronger than possible before lol", which is what it's shown to mean at that. The statement doesn't implicate what you say it means.
By definition, you're extrapolating a basic statement into something resembling Headcanon.

It matters because you kind of need agreement, staff agreement at that, to get this accepted? Otherwise why the hell are you even here making a CRT with the intent to get it added? If you don't care about people agreeing with you or getting this accepted then cool, have fun, go wild, I don't actually need to do anything nor care what you personally think.

We been typing paragraphs for like 30 minutes now, going back and forth on literally the same thing, you repeating yourself.

I'm repeating myself because you haven't given me anything new to respond to.
If you don't like it just post actual proof instead of trying to convince others your personal belief that isn't backed by any real evidence is somehow true.

I’m really starting to get tired of it, don’t have that text debater stamina like you.

Does checking your phone like once a half an hour and spending maybe a minutes top actually that draining? This pales to any actual office or computer job mate.

We can settle this in call quickly later today and I’ll just post the recording of me beating you in here. This way I won’t have to explain the same thing to you over and over again in paragraph form

Lmao

 

[Saintdhqhdy]

Because it's a nonargument. Your personal interpretation of an unfounded conjecture that you personally believe might make sense, ultimately means **** all here, we don't list what people think might make sense if there's no backing or corroborative evidence.

Yes, featless. It has no feats for what you're arguing. Obviously wasn't talking about it not having any power feats, nobody is talking about that, we're talking about if it can adapt to hax, in which case, it's featless.
It being strong isn't even remotely supportive as a feat.

One of your examples being MUI falls flat as well because we already know hax can work on MUI, basically confirming that statement in question wasn't talking about hax at all and thus isn't evidence at all to your claim.


Because the statement "surpassing his limits" is being extrapolated to mean he can adapt to esoteric hax, when in reality, the statement is just saying "yo Goku can become even stronger than possible before lol", which is what it's shown to mean at that. The statement doesn't implicate what you say it means.
By definition, you're extrapolating a basic statement into something resembling Headcanon.

It matters because you kind of need agreement, staff agreement at that, to get this accepted? Otherwise why the hell are you even here making a CRT with the intent to get it added? If you don't care about people agreeing with you or getting this accepted then cool, have fun, go wild, I don't actually need to do anything nor care what you personally think.


I'm repeating myself because you haven't given me anything new to respond to.
If you don't like it just post actual proof instead of trying to convince others your personal belief that isn't backed by any real evidence is somehow true.

Does checking your phone like once a half an hour and spending maybe a minutes top actually that draining? This pales to any actual office or computer job mate.

Lmao

Obviously it’s not physically draining… you probably can’t relate bc you used to text debating.

but uh yea, idk why you’re so set on continuing to type so much for so long, like I guarantee you would’ve gone on for another 30 if I didn’t stop it lol

Anyways, my request should no problem, like we can do it in the vsbw discord if they have one but yea, I’m not on that essay every 5 minutes timing

 

[Chariot190]

Obviously it’s not physically draining… you probably can’t relate bc you used to text debating.

Yes, because we're on a forum dedicated to it. Get used to it.

but uh yea, idk why you’re so set on continuing to type so much for so long, like I guarantee you would’ve gone on for another 30 if I didn’t stop it lol

Probably yeah, till I got home yeah. A minute here and there isn't an issue.

Anyways, my request should no problem, like we can do it in the vsbw discord if they have one but yea, I’m not on that essay every 5 minutes timing

Dude, if you can't convince me here, what do you actually think would change by talking into my ear and being audibly irksome instead of visually would accomplish?
Ive seen your arguments, they don't cut it, unless you have actual proof I couldn't care less what you have to say. Unless what you have to say is proof, in which case post it here, where it matters.

 

[Saintdhqhdy]

Yes, because we're on a forum dedicated to it. Get used to it.

Probably yeah, till I got home yeah. A minute here and there isn't an issue.


Dude, if you can't convince me here, what do you actually think would change by talking into my ear and being audibly irksome instead of visually would accomplish?
Ive seen your arguments, they don't cut it, unless you have actual proof I couldn't care less what you have to say. Unless what you have to say is proof, in which case post it here, where it matters.

Blud said get used to constantly typing for an hour that’s not crazy to say?

Bc in call, you can’t repeat yourself and make the same dumb arguments after you get debunked, trust me, I’ve seen it happen

honestly, idk why you typed that last long ass paragraph you could’ve just said no, Blud made an entire paragraph worth of excuses when he just could’ve typed NO

 

[Chariot190]

Unironically yes, get used to it on a forum dedicated to debates in text if you're going to stonewall a thread because nobody is buying your proposal, otherwise stop stonewalling.

Lol.

My bad, I figured you'd want an actual explanation, but it was my mistake to think explanations are your kind of thing
I assume we're done here then, nobody agrees with the proposal, the absolute best one could do is argue maybe for the anime, which isn't what this thread is for.

 

[TheGunsFinalWrath]

I did, my original argument is saying that it’s narratively correct, in which you haven’t responded to.

goku avatar is featless? “Db fans don’t read” he literally beat moro and overpowered gas. The avatar literally represents fp mui cool one of my examples was mui. I wasn’t using that example when making my argument tho.

How am I extrapolating it? the context of fp mui is to allow goku to adapt to any situation by surpassing his limits so he can win. In the instance i showed, all he needed was to get stronger, so that’s what he did. So no, not headcanon. Don’t know why it matters if ppl agree with me or nah, as long as I refute everything it’s good.

We been typing paragraphs for like 30 minutes now, going back and forth on literally the same thing, you repeating yourself. I’m really starting to get tired of it, don’t have that text debater stamina like you. We can settle this in call quickly later today and I’ll just post the recording of me beating you in here. This way I won’t have to explain the same thing to you over and over again in paragraph form

hop in vc

why are you even here then. bro wants to make a crt on a forum where you literally don't VC but text only (with said changes inside said forum, needing to go through the forum itself and not outside) , refuses to debate a dude on his own self created crt
There are two options for you, leave and abandon this crt or continue debating. You have no other choice literally.

"typing for 30 minutes" but have you really? It's not like you're going back and forth constantly nonstop 24/7.... Shrug, whatever.

 

[Saintdhqhdy]

why are you even here then. bro wants to make a crt on a forum where you literally don't VC but text only (with said changes inside said forum, needing to go through the forum itself and not outside) , refuses to debate a dude on his own self created crt
There are two options for you, leave and abandon this crt or continue debating. You have no other choice literally.

"typing for 30 minutes" but have you really? It's not like you're going back and forth constantly nonstop 24/7.... Shrug, whatever.

Bc chariot is a random it wouldn’t matter if I beat a random in the thread or vc. Obviously if it was a mod, I can’t do that bc they decide the threads.

I don’t see why you typed this, Blud got on my hesd and typed a paragraph bc I said I’m tired from typing for 30 minutes straight

all this unnecessary typing, this ain’t even about the topic anymore

 

[TheGunsFinalWrath]

Bc chariot is a random it wouldn’t matter if I beat a random in the thread or vc. Obviously if it was a mod, I can’t do that bc they decide the threads.

I don’t see why you typed this, Blud got on my hesd and typed a paragraph bc I said I’m tired from typing for 30 minutes straight

all this unnecessary typing, this ain’t even about the topic anymore

"because he's a random" What does that have to do with a CRT??? Prove it on the forum itself VIA text, to prove that what you're arguing for is correct, or quit it. Nobody even wants to ******* hear a garbage VC debate in a form dedicated to texting. People reading this forum ain't here to watch recordings but to read the formulated arguments written in text. Somebody being random or not doesn't matter, you're supposed to prove it here that your proposal is solid and legit, which means you're not just gonna ignore arguments here and try to force others to move to an outside place, but rather do it here.
imagine calling somebody random. like bro, that's hella cringe, get that discord vc debating persona out of here



then go back to topic and stop whining about a different form of debating on powerscaling in a crt brother. you literally shoot your own foot, don't blame me about going off topic when it's YOUR fault.

 

[Magicomethkuon]

I am no mod but even I can see that this is going nowhere. Besides that, evidence currently on the table isn't enough to change the state of affairs. It's probably best to ask for a thread mod to check and close this, unless OP has other scans to bring and further support his case.

 

[TheGodOfICE777]

Just make this crt useful and argue for the anime since the wiki already accepts goku adapted to hit’s timeskip

 

[Saintdhqhdy]

"because he's a random" What does that have to do with a CRT??? Prove it on the forum itself VIA text, to prove that what you're arguing for is correct, or quit it. Nobody even wants to ******* hear a garbage VC debate in a form dedicated to texting. People reading this forum ain't here to watch recordings but to read the formulated arguments written in text. Somebody being random or not doesn't matter, you're supposed to prove it here that your proposal is solid and legit, which means you're not just gonna ignore arguments here and try to force others to move to an outside place, but rather do it here.
imagine calling somebody random. like bro, that's hella cringe, get that discord vc debating persona out of here



then go back to topic and stop whining about a different form of debating on powerscaling in a crt brother. you literally shoot your own foot, don't blame me about going off topic when it's YOUR fault.

Im not reading allat, you typed a essay bc you’re mad I said vc bc I didn’t wanna type for an hour straight like bro you aren’t even part of this. Getting ignored unless you argue against my thread

like what made bro type allat, text debaters are sum else

 

[Saintdhqhdy]

Just make this crt useful and argue for the anime since the wiki already accepts goku adapted to hit’s timeskip

No. I already made 2, I’m too lazy for a third upgrade

 

[TheGunsFinalWrath]

Im not reading allat, you typed a essay bc you’re mad I said vc bc I didn’t wanna type for an hour straight like bro you aren’t even part of this. Getting ignored unless you argue against my thread

like what made bro type allat, text debaters are sum else

vc debaters being afraid of letters is insane yall need to grow some skin in the real world if you're so afraid of letters in powerscale debating

 

[Maverick_Zero_X]

OP has failed to and is refusing to provide evidence for RE at this point. Closing.