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This is meant to be a thread where people can help gather information about neck snapping in preperation for an indepth crt
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Gathering information for neck snapping
- Thread starter The_pen_or_the_sword
- Start date
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- lifting strength
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- Thread starter
- #4
He might get a pass then what were the gaurds class 1/5 feat?
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Fisher can rip through heavy-duty zip-ties. Would that be something?
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- Thread starter
- #7
might brake him into peak human likely leaves him at athletic human. We'd need a calc to be sure but I severly doubt it breaks into class 1
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Nah that's solidly Peak Human if we assume heavy duty zip-ties. It looks kind of? similar to a lateral raise, and a 190 lb elite powerlifter (aka those guys who can deadlift around 545 lbs.) can only lift 180 lbs combined.
However, it'll take a lot more to get to class 1 and we don't know what the tensile strength of the ziptie is.
However, it'll take a lot more to get to class 1 and we don't know what the tensile strength of the ziptie is.
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So does anyone have anything on neck snapping
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I think I saw one vid on yt but can't find it
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I'm working on a calc that demonstrates how much force you can get from leverage in a can opener. Should be done in a few days at most.
The issue with neck cranks is that generally if you're in that position it's easier to choke someone out. So neck cranks are theoretically capable of breaking someone's neck but it's not exactly a mainstream technique and research is scarce.
The issue with neck cranks is that generally if you're in that position it's easier to choke someone out. So neck cranks are theoretically capable of breaking someone's neck but it's not exactly a mainstream technique and research is scarce.
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- Thread starter
- #15
Yeah I already found that when I was hunting around your never going to accidentally apply the neccessary force to snap a neck and if you wanted to kill someone it is far easier to choke them out, so while the technique is theortically possible I haven't found any cases of such happening in real life
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Actually, I thought about it a bit more and a lot of fictional neck breaks would actually be possible with superhuman strength. Most are generally in position for a rear naked choke, so they have some control over the body (meaning their upper torso won't turn with their neck). However, it normally it lacks leverage for a severe neck crank, so being able to break a neck from that position is actually pretty superhuman.
Like I watched Punisher MCU again and he breaks someone's neck with an upward jerking motion after getting them into a guillotine choke. That's technically possible, but in real life would take the combined weight of both fighters from a DDT.
Basically, some characters might? not need a downgrade?
Like I watched Punisher MCU again and he breaks someone's neck with an upward jerking motion after getting them into a guillotine choke. That's technically possible, but in real life would take the combined weight of both fighters from a DDT.
Basically, some characters might? not need a downgrade?
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- Thread starter
- #21
Holding your own against bodybuilders and using a sledgehammer one handded sound like peak human feats to me, as far as I know the effort to accoplish both feats would still fall outside class 1
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Should we talk about Agent 47's lifting strength? We got the CW Arrow fighters who're at least class 1.
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It honestly depends on the weight of the sledgehammer.
A real life war hammer had a head weight of around 2 lbs. and a general purpose sledge has a head weight around 8 to 10 lbs. That's around 5x heavier than the 2 lb. hammer an average person could wield one-handed, so 5x80 kg = 400 kg or Peak Human. However, a sledge can go up to 20 lbs. so that can bring it up to Class 1.
A real life war hammer had a head weight of around 2 lbs. and a general purpose sledge has a head weight around 8 to 10 lbs. That's around 5x heavier than the 2 lb. hammer an average person could wield one-handed, so 5x80 kg = 400 kg or Peak Human. However, a sledge can go up to 20 lbs. so that can bring it up to Class 1.
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- #25
Yeah Im not sure it's ever stated so Id be in favor of peak human possibly class 1
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Yeah so you think we should get an admin here and talk them through this?
I don't think we should accept neck snapping feats unless the character has similar supporting feats, as good technique and bodyweight can help do it (See John Wick/McClane).
The good part is that most profiles with neck snapping feats do have better lifting feats, so we wouldn't need to edit that much.
I don't think we should accept neck snapping feats unless the character has similar supporting feats, as good technique and bodyweight can help do it (See John Wick/McClane).
The good part is that most profiles with neck snapping feats do have better lifting feats, so we wouldn't need to edit that much.
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And here I was about to add Class 1 to Batfleck (oh well)
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- Thread starter
- #28
Sorry I just disagree with the idea of instatly giving class 1 over something that makes zero sense and doesn't fit characters more regular showings
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- Thread starter
- #29
sounds good Illl throw up a rough draft I wrote of the proposed change
Ok guys going over several profiles I've noticed something, it has to do with lifting strength notably neck-snapping. Those capable of this feat are given class 1 lifting strength as that's the amount of force needed to snap a neck. Now this is accurate to some extent class 1 lifting strength would be needed to snap a neck but this ignores some other large factors in play when it comes to snapping necks.
First things first neck snaps as they are displayed in movies isn't physically possible and I'm not just talking about the amount of force necessary I'm referring to the actual physics of breaking a neck. The problem Hollywood ignores is the fact were you to try to snap a neck the way they display the body would follow along with it. At best, assuming you used the necessary amount of for you might sprain the neck but you aren't breaking it without holding the body in place.
Now with proper technique, it is possible to break a person's neck, at least theoretically. The problem is this requires A. A full body hold to stop the body from following the motion of the neck B. a long extended application of force in a twisting pulling motion.
Now the reason I noted theoretically is that no one does it, from the information I've looked through there isn't a real world example. Now the reason behind this is simple, you will never accidentally accomplish this feat, it requires a sustained and intentional effort.
Now if you wanted to kill someone you would also never use this technique in a realistic situation, why you may ask? Because strangulation is a far simpler means of killing someone and far less likely to give your victim a chance to escape.
So now that I covered the basic what's the problem you may ask? Tons of action heroes have abilities that don't make sense like pressure points or open palm strikes. The problem is the fact we give lifting strength based on these feats. Outside of neck-snapping these characters never display similar levels of strength it's just these feats that instantly grants characters class 1. Even though throughout the rest of their series they will never display this level of strength outside neck-snapping.
John McClane (Die hard) Is given a similar rating despite his only other feat being ...pushing back a full-grown man… A feat that wouldn't require class 1 strength… A feat he had to physically exert himself to accomplish…
Sam Fisher is another example his other feat has him shoving a man over the balcony of a roof….
Aiden Pearce (Watchdogs) Is given class one for his ability to trade blows/wrestle with someone else capable of snapping necks despite again nothing supporting this strength beyond neck-snapping.
The punisher is another example, his two supporting feats are swinging a sledgehammer like its a martial arts weapon and out wrestling bodybuilders, feats that don't require class 1 to accomplish. The sledgehammers weight isn't stated thus it could vary between twelve pounds and twenty.
Thus I propose we deem regular neck-snapping an outlier for lifting strength as it is often inconsistent with characters normal showings. Instead we should note it as technique, much like pressure points or open palm strikes. This way we can gauge their lifting strength on there more consistent showings.
Ok guys going over several profiles I've noticed something, it has to do with lifting strength notably neck-snapping. Those capable of this feat are given class 1 lifting strength as that's the amount of force needed to snap a neck. Now this is accurate to some extent class 1 lifting strength would be needed to snap a neck but this ignores some other large factors in play when it comes to snapping necks.
First things first neck snaps as they are displayed in movies isn't physically possible and I'm not just talking about the amount of force necessary I'm referring to the actual physics of breaking a neck. The problem Hollywood ignores is the fact were you to try to snap a neck the way they display the body would follow along with it. At best, assuming you used the necessary amount of for you might sprain the neck but you aren't breaking it without holding the body in place.
Now with proper technique, it is possible to break a person's neck, at least theoretically. The problem is this requires A. A full body hold to stop the body from following the motion of the neck B. a long extended application of force in a twisting pulling motion.
Now the reason I noted theoretically is that no one does it, from the information I've looked through there isn't a real world example. Now the reason behind this is simple, you will never accidentally accomplish this feat, it requires a sustained and intentional effort.
Now if you wanted to kill someone you would also never use this technique in a realistic situation, why you may ask? Because strangulation is a far simpler means of killing someone and far less likely to give your victim a chance to escape.
So now that I covered the basic what's the problem you may ask? Tons of action heroes have abilities that don't make sense like pressure points or open palm strikes. The problem is the fact we give lifting strength based on these feats. Outside of neck-snapping these characters never display similar levels of strength it's just these feats that instantly grants characters class 1. Even though throughout the rest of their series they will never display this level of strength outside neck-snapping.
John McClane (Die hard) Is given a similar rating despite his only other feat being ...pushing back a full-grown man… A feat that wouldn't require class 1 strength… A feat he had to physically exert himself to accomplish…
Sam Fisher is another example his other feat has him shoving a man over the balcony of a roof….
Aiden Pearce (Watchdogs) Is given class one for his ability to trade blows/wrestle with someone else capable of snapping necks despite again nothing supporting this strength beyond neck-snapping.
The punisher is another example, his two supporting feats are swinging a sledgehammer like its a martial arts weapon and out wrestling bodybuilders, feats that don't require class 1 to accomplish. The sledgehammers weight isn't stated thus it could vary between twelve pounds and twenty.
Thus I propose we deem regular neck-snapping an outlier for lifting strength as it is often inconsistent with characters normal showings. Instead we should note it as technique, much like pressure points or open palm strikes. This way we can gauge their lifting strength on there more consistent showings.
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Yeah that's a pretty good draft.
There is one part that could use some editing though. A lot of movie breaks are actually physically possible. Like I said, a lot of them are in position for a rear-naked choke, so they do actually have some control of the body just with minimal leverage.
There is one part that could use some editing though. A lot of movie breaks are actually physically possible. Like I said, a lot of them are in position for a rear-naked choke, so they do actually have some control of the body just with minimal leverage.
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- Thread starter
- #31
Fair how would you add to it to fix it?
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Ok guys going over several profiles I've noticed something, it has to do with lifting strength notably neck-snapping. Those capable of this feat are given class 1 lifting strength as that's the amount of force needed to snap a neck. Now this is accurate to some extent class 1 lifting strength would be needed to snap a neck but this ignores some other large factors in play when it comes to snapping necks.
First off, it is possible to break a person's neck with regular human strength, at least theoretically. The problem is this requires A: control over the body to stop it from following the motion of the neck and B: a long extended application of force in a twisting pulling motion using the neck as a lever.
Now the reason I noted theoretically is that no one does it, from the information I've looked through there isn't a real world example. Now the reason behind this is simple, you will never accidentally accomplish this feat, it requires a sustained and intentional effort. And because strangulation is a far simpler means of killing someone and far less likely to give your victim a chance to escape.
In comparison, quite a few neck snaps as they are displayed in movies aren't physically possible based on the actual physics of breaking a neck. The problem Hollywood ignores is the fact were you to try to snap a neck without first restraining the body in some way, the body would follow along with it, meaning at best you might strain the neck.
Some neck breaks would actually work, as the characters in position for a rear naked choke, so they have control over the body (meaning their upper torso won't turn with their neck). However, it normally it lacks leverage for a severe neck crank, so being able to break a neck from that position is pretty superhuman.
The problem is the fact we give Class 1 lifting strength based on only feats. Outside of neck-snapping these characters generally never display similar levels of strength.
John McClane (Die hard) Is given a similar rating despite his only other feat being ...pushing back a full-grown man… A feat that wouldn't require class 1 strength… A feat he had to physically exert himself to accomplish…
Sam Fisher is another example his other feat has him shoving a man over the balcony of a roof….
The punisher is another example, his two supporting feats are swinging a sledgehammer like its a martial arts weapon and out wrestling bodybuilders, feats that don't require class 1 to accomplish. The sledgehammers weight isn't stated thus it could vary between twelve pounds and twenty.
Thus I propose we stop using neck-snapping as a justification for lifting strength by itself as it is often inconsistent with characters normal showings.This way we can gauge their lifting strength on their more consistent showings.
Here I edited your draft. Tell me what you think.
First off, it is possible to break a person's neck with regular human strength, at least theoretically. The problem is this requires A: control over the body to stop it from following the motion of the neck and B: a long extended application of force in a twisting pulling motion using the neck as a lever.
Now the reason I noted theoretically is that no one does it, from the information I've looked through there isn't a real world example. Now the reason behind this is simple, you will never accidentally accomplish this feat, it requires a sustained and intentional effort. And because strangulation is a far simpler means of killing someone and far less likely to give your victim a chance to escape.
In comparison, quite a few neck snaps as they are displayed in movies aren't physically possible based on the actual physics of breaking a neck. The problem Hollywood ignores is the fact were you to try to snap a neck without first restraining the body in some way, the body would follow along with it, meaning at best you might strain the neck.
Some neck breaks would actually work, as the characters in position for a rear naked choke, so they have control over the body (meaning their upper torso won't turn with their neck). However, it normally it lacks leverage for a severe neck crank, so being able to break a neck from that position is pretty superhuman.
The problem is the fact we give Class 1 lifting strength based on only feats. Outside of neck-snapping these characters generally never display similar levels of strength.
John McClane (Die hard) Is given a similar rating despite his only other feat being ...pushing back a full-grown man… A feat that wouldn't require class 1 strength… A feat he had to physically exert himself to accomplish…
Sam Fisher is another example his other feat has him shoving a man over the balcony of a roof….
The punisher is another example, his two supporting feats are swinging a sledgehammer like its a martial arts weapon and out wrestling bodybuilders, feats that don't require class 1 to accomplish. The sledgehammers weight isn't stated thus it could vary between twelve pounds and twenty.
Thus I propose we stop using neck-snapping as a justification for lifting strength by itself as it is often inconsistent with characters normal showings.This way we can gauge their lifting strength on their more consistent showings.
Here I edited your draft. Tell me what you think.
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- Thread starter
- #33
I like it though maybe an extra note about those feats still getting examined for consistency with the rest of the characters showings.
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- #34
IE
Ok guys going over several profiles I've noticed something, it has to do with lifting strength notably neck-snapping. Those capable of this feat are given class 1 lifting strength as that's the amount of force needed to snap a neck. Now this is accurate to some extent class 1 lifting strength would be needed to snap a neck but this ignores some other large factors in play when it comes to snapping necks.
First off, it is possible to break a person's neck with regular human strength, at least theoretically. The problem is this requires A: control over the body to stop it from following the motion of the neck and B: a long extended application of force in a twisting pulling motion using the neck as a lever.
Now the reason I noted theoretically is that no one does it, from the information I've looked through there isn't a real world example. Now the reason behind this is simple, you will never accidentally accomplish this feat, it requires a sustained and intentional effort. And because strangulation is a far simpler means of killing someone and far less likely to give your victim a chance to escape.
In comparison, quite a few neck snaps as they are displayed in movies aren't physically possible based on the actual physics of breaking a neck. The problem Hollywood ignores is the fact were you to try to snap a neck without first restraining the body in some way, the body would follow along with it, meaning at best you might strain the neck.
Some neck breaks would actually work, as the characters in position for a rear naked choke, so they have control over the body (meaning their upper torso won't turn with their neck). However, it normally it lacks leverage for a severe neck crank, so being able to break a neck from that position is pretty superhuman. But even these semi realistic neckbreaks should be examined for consitency, what else has a character done that further supports this? Has that character struggled in the past with a lesser lifting strength feat?
The problem is the fact we give Class 1 lifting strength based on only feats. Outside of neck-snapping these characters generally never display similar levels of strength.
John McClane (Die hard) Is given a similar rating despite his only other feat being ...pushing back a full-grown man… A feat that wouldn't require class 1 strength… A feat he had to physically exert himself to accomplish…
Sam Fisher is another example his other feat has him shoving a man over the balcony of a roof….
Aiden Pearce (Watchdogs) Is given class one for his ability to trade blows/wrestle with someone else capable of snapping necks despite again nothing supporting this strength beyond neck-snapping.
The punisher is another example, his two supporting feats are swinging a sledgehammer like its a martial arts weapon and out wrestling bodybuilders, feats that don't require class 1 to accomplish. The sledgehammers weight isn't stated thus it could vary between twelve pounds and twenty.
Thus I propose we stop using neck-snapping as a justification for lifting strength by itself as it is often inconsistent with characters normal showings.This way we can gauge their lifting strength on their more consistent showings.
Ok guys going over several profiles I've noticed something, it has to do with lifting strength notably neck-snapping. Those capable of this feat are given class 1 lifting strength as that's the amount of force needed to snap a neck. Now this is accurate to some extent class 1 lifting strength would be needed to snap a neck but this ignores some other large factors in play when it comes to snapping necks.
First off, it is possible to break a person's neck with regular human strength, at least theoretically. The problem is this requires A: control over the body to stop it from following the motion of the neck and B: a long extended application of force in a twisting pulling motion using the neck as a lever.
Now the reason I noted theoretically is that no one does it, from the information I've looked through there isn't a real world example. Now the reason behind this is simple, you will never accidentally accomplish this feat, it requires a sustained and intentional effort. And because strangulation is a far simpler means of killing someone and far less likely to give your victim a chance to escape.
In comparison, quite a few neck snaps as they are displayed in movies aren't physically possible based on the actual physics of breaking a neck. The problem Hollywood ignores is the fact were you to try to snap a neck without first restraining the body in some way, the body would follow along with it, meaning at best you might strain the neck.
Some neck breaks would actually work, as the characters in position for a rear naked choke, so they have control over the body (meaning their upper torso won't turn with their neck). However, it normally it lacks leverage for a severe neck crank, so being able to break a neck from that position is pretty superhuman. But even these semi realistic neckbreaks should be examined for consitency, what else has a character done that further supports this? Has that character struggled in the past with a lesser lifting strength feat?
The problem is the fact we give Class 1 lifting strength based on only feats. Outside of neck-snapping these characters generally never display similar levels of strength.
John McClane (Die hard) Is given a similar rating despite his only other feat being ...pushing back a full-grown man… A feat that wouldn't require class 1 strength… A feat he had to physically exert himself to accomplish…
Sam Fisher is another example his other feat has him shoving a man over the balcony of a roof….
Aiden Pearce (Watchdogs) Is given class one for his ability to trade blows/wrestle with someone else capable of snapping necks despite again nothing supporting this strength beyond neck-snapping.
The punisher is another example, his two supporting feats are swinging a sledgehammer like its a martial arts weapon and out wrestling bodybuilders, feats that don't require class 1 to accomplish. The sledgehammers weight isn't stated thus it could vary between twelve pounds and twenty.
Thus I propose we stop using neck-snapping as a justification for lifting strength by itself as it is often inconsistent with characters normal showings.This way we can gauge their lifting strength on their more consistent showings.
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- #36
Anyone else mind Im getting off for a while sorry irl stuff pulling me away
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