Fusion Zamasu vs Pennywise (rematch)

[QuagsireTheLegend]

I am voting Pennywise for reasons above, much better hax and the fact that his temporary sealing required a 1-A character's involvement is proof that he is more than a match for Zamasu.

Also, when was it stated that Maturin die? just a doubt

 

[MrKingOfNegativity]

Also, when was it stated that Maturin die? just a doubt

IIRC, around the time of the second battle between the children and IT (after the children had grown into adulthood), IT told Bill that Maturin was dead and that he 'choked on a galaxy or two'. I'm almost positive this ended up being the truth.

Also, that makes 6 votes for Pennywise.

 

[QuagsireTheLegend]

Oh wow, thanks

 

[FTW395]

At first I wanted to not get into this argument, but why is "They needed Gan's help to seal him" a valid argument at all? Gan is the only being in Stephen King's storyline that is more powerful than Pennywise so obviously his help would be needed. But him being 1-A really doesn't mean shit. For example if Zen'o was also 1-A then in DBS they would've needed the help from a 1-A being as well to defeat Zamasu. Even if that were the case it wouldn't mean anything for Zamasu, it would just mean that the only being who is stronger than Zamasu is a 1-A being.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

You bring up a valid arguement, and to that I ask: why didn't the kids call upon a less powerful entity to seal Pennywise then?

 

[FTW395]

You bring up a valid arguement, and to that I ask: why didn't the kids call upon a less powerful entity to seal Pennywise then?

Because it doesn't exist? Because they wanted to be sure the entiety they used would be able to get rid of him? Because they couldn't call upon other entities?

 

[Schnee_One]

Your vote FTW?

 

[FTW395]

Your vote FTW?

Inconclusive, neither can kill the other

 

[Schnee_One]

What stops Penny from warping him to death?

 

[MrKingOfNegativity]

The argument here isn't just that Gan's assistance was needed for the children to stop IT. We're also going by the fact that, even after said interference, IT was only defeated temporarily.

Zamasu's death against Zen'o is proof that he is not capable of the same. He can be killed via hax, which IT has plenty of.

 

[FTW395]

The argument here isn't just that Gan's assistance was needed for the children to stop IT. We're also going by the fact that, even after said interference, IT was only defeated temporarily.
Zamasu's death against Zen'o is proof that he is not capable of the same. He can be killed via hax, which IT has plenty of.

That's because Gan sealed pennywise while Zen'o just straight up killed Zamasu, who knows maybe he could've escaped if Zen'o used some sort of sealing ability.

Regardless I've looked at IT's profile before and came to the conclusion that he does have more hax than Zamasu, but not a sufficient amount of hax to actually put him down.

 

[QuagsireTheLegend]

The thing is, why did Gan NOT kill Pennywise? Instead of sealing him temporarily?

 

[FTW395]

The thing is, why did Gan NOT kill Pennywise? Instead of sealing him temporarily?

No idea, never read the books. If he simply couldn't kill him then I think IT needs an upgrade.

 

[MrKingOfNegativity]

I fail to see how a Universal+ being with reality warping and mind-manipulation is incapable of putting down another Universal+ being with near-nonexistent intelligence and no shown resistance to reality-warping.

Zamasu has never been shown to have a counter for any form of reality-warping, and there is nothing to say that Pennywise couldn't attack him mentally as well, since he's shown no resistance to that approach either.

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

Pennywise for the reasons above.

 

[MrKingOfNegativity]

7 votes for Pennywise. That's a wrap, folks.

Grace period starts now.

 

[FTW395]

I fail to see how a Universal+ being with reality warping and mind-manipulation is incapable of putting down another Universal+ being with near-nonexistent intelligence and no shown resistance to reality-warping.
Zamasu has never been shown to have a counter for any form of reality-warping, and there is nothing to say that Pennywise couldn't attack him mentally as well, since he's shown no resistance to that approach either.

Simply due to the fact that this hax doesn't mean everything, really people here just take a look at the profiles and the one with the most words under "power & abilities" is deemed the winner in every case. I am against that system, this is a debating forum and I'm willing to say that Pennywise his abilities are too insignificant to be of any threat to Zamasu, unless someone comes here and shows me a scan of Pennywise doing either of these abilities on an universal scale I will settle on inconclusive.

Regardless my vote doesn't even mean anything since Pennywise has obviously won.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

'Too insignificant'

Well, I mean he wouldn't be Low 2-C if that were the case right?

 

[FTW395]

'Too insignificant'
Well, I mean he wouldn't be Low 2-C if that were the case right?

What does that even mean? Zamasu is Low 2-C as well, lol.

 

[Sir_Ovens]

I mean Pennywise is Low 2-C. Zamasu is also Low 2-C. Logically they should be capable of taking each other out if their AP is potent enough.

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

How can it be too insignificant if they're on the same tier?

 

[FTW395]

@SIr Ovens exactly that's why I vote inconclusive

@Paulo.junior.969 Because his hax might be too weak for it to work on another Low 2-C being.

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

How? He's Low 2-C.

 

[FTW395]

How? He's Low 2-C.

• sigh* this is what I mean when I say that people don't actually debate here, I have never read Stephen King so I don't know really know anything about it. But it's still entirely possible that this mind manipulation he used was against little kids who are like 10-B, if that's the case then there's no reason to assume it'd work vs people like Zamasu. Do know that this is just an example, because as I've said before I don't know anything about Stephen King's IT. The same logic applies to his reality warping ability.

 

[Cropfist]

Mind manipulation is hax independent of AP.

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

Well, if that's the case, it should be mentioned in his profile, that's what the "weaknesses" stat is for.

 

[FTW395]

Mind manipulation is hax independent of AP.

There's a huge range on how powerful mind manipulation can be. Some people might be more resistant to it, like in Dragonball with Babidi, his mind control worked on Dabura but it didn't on Vegeta.

And besides I'd still need an example of IT's mind manipulation to fully judge it.

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

Yeah, but that's Vegeta, Zamasu was never shown to have this resistance.

 

[FTW395]

Yeah, but that's Vegeta, Zamasu was never shown to have this resistance.

Resistance to hax in Dragonball comes from simply being stronger than your enemy and Zamasu is a whole lot stronger than Vegeta was back then.

 

[The_Everlasting]

Let's not go back to "higher ki > hax".

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

Wasn't this debunked? (the hax resistance thing)

 

[The_Everlasting]

Yup.

 

[FTW395]

Let's not go back to "higher ki > hax".

Tbf it's been shown for various abilities that Higher KI > Hax, some however like Guldo's timestop aren't. (Atleast as far as we know)

 

[The_Everlasting]

Besides the fight with Hit, when has it ever been a thing?

Krillin and Gohan couldn't get out of Guldo's time freeze or paralysis.

Babidi was able to mind control Dabura and Vegeta.

Majin Buu successfully absorbed Mystic Gohan.

 

[FTW395]

@The everlasting Babidi was not able to mind control Vegeta at all, he wasn't able to mind control Buu either.

Majin Buu couldn't absord Vegito nor did his candy beam actually finish Vegito off, sure it turned him into a jawbreaker. But it was alive and still kicking his ass.

Goku legit broke Hit's hax through simply powering up.

 

[The_Everlasting]

Babidi never tried mind controlling Buu, and that still doesn't explain Dabura.

But it still turned Vegito into a piece of candy.

And that's the only instance that's contradicted every other time.

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

Didn't Buu say that he was only able to kill Babidi because Babidi couldn't talk, so, couldn't seal him?

 

[FTW395]

Didn't Buu say that he was only able to kill Babidi because Babidi couldn't talk, so, couldn't seal him?

Sure, but that I'm not talking about sealing. Buu wanted to get rid off Babidi because he was talking too much and that annoyed him. I'm quite sure that if Babidi was able to mind control Buu, he would've done so.

@The Everlasting sure he turned him into a piece of candy, but he was still alive while everyone else where he used it on wasn't. Meaning his hax partly didn't work.

 

[Paulo.junior.969]

If more power = resistance to hax, why would sealing be a problem? Sealing is hax.

 

[ToAruFan]

Mind hax wouldn't work on Fusion Zamasu, because Fusion Zamasu is merely a mindless embodiment of Zamasu's will. How can you mind manipulate something that doesn't have a mind?