Frost Downgrade

[OmniTops]

The profile of Frost says that it is universal for being almost comparable to Goku SSJ1, but in reality Goku SSJ1 was very superior to Frost and left him in ridicule with casual blows as you can see in the following link https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rw-20EqzRG0

So he was forced to use his poisonous needle to defeat him, and vegeta confirms that Frost is well below the SSJ1 when he defeats him with a single punch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aY6S3f_vee8

For what Frost should be comparable to Goku Base content, it is made very clear that Goku was not using all his power against the third form of Frost as you can see in the following images.








And something superior to Piccolo that should be something more powerful than in the saga of Majin Buu, so without error to be mistaken I say that Frost of the saga of the universe 6, next to Piccolo and therefore Gohan Base, SSJ1 and SSJ2 ( Pre-training with Piccolo / Pre-Tournament of Power) like Watagash and Lavender (Zen Exhibition Match) they should be Solar System Level.

 

[Huesito88]

Lavender has been talked about he won't be downgraded (it's a rule)

edit ok maybe it isn't a rule and I mixed up Lavender with Basil (but point stil stands they scale to each other and that has been discussed in another thread)

 

[OmniTops]

Huesito88 I would like to know why, and what about the rest?

 

[OmniTops]

Bump

 

[Dbknowitall]

these Dragonball super tiers are all over the place, why is piccolo at 3-A? and Frost too, these guys are SSj2 tier pre beerus arc, even if you use the animation which completely poops on scaling, SSj2 Goku was more or so Similar in strength to mystic Gohan, meaning even after his powerup with whis and beerus goku at SSj2 is still not 3-A just slightly stronger than his SSj3 pre beerus arc.

and no gohan has not gotten significantly stronger since fighting Super buu by anime and manga text piccolo train gohan so he can regain his previous power he had against super buu which was a few days before the big tournament.

Frost should be change to a SSj2 Counterpart Tier same for Piccolo, now with the manga fixing the scaling android 17 scales to SSj3 at most.

the only Universe Level Tiers should be SSJB+, even SSJG which goku used to fight beerus is not confirm to be the same he can do byhimself as at that time he had the power of 5+ saiyans plus the transformation you cant expect it to have the same PL even if its the same transformation, he also did not cause universe level destruction byhimself but had beerus brign in half the power, so at most that form is Semi Universe, and that form is stronger than SSJB goku currently has by alot, as SSJB vegeta in the manga got easily beaten by beerus.


i mean is quite literally ridiculous as how Mystic gohan goes from Tier 4-B to 3-A when he has the exact same power, at most 4-A.'

just because its a new arc does not mean everyone is super OP, that 3-A for android 18 is absolutely insane.

mods should really make some changes.

 

[YungManzi]

@Dbknowitall

I think it has something to do with Base Goku asorbing his SSJG form into his base form...thus becoming 3-A in base form. Which means that everyone who is stronger than base Goku is 3-A.

 

[Akreious]

Super Saiyan god attacks + Beerus attacks were able to end the universe in 3 hits if they didn't nullify and completely negate the force. if SSJ God wasn't universe level back then but half like you said, he'd still be WELL INTO universal in SSJGod alone now by absorbing that power into his base mode and going SSJGod again, with Blue granting an even higher boost. This is ignoring any increase in Goku's Base Power from the BoG arc to the tournament of power or the Kaioken stacking on SSB. @dbknowitall just because you disagree with upgrades doesn't make them untrue. Android 18, despite her lack of training, was on par with android 17 that fought a semi-holding back Goku (a Goku that's gotten boosts from the First tournament as well as Goku black Arc). And what you said about Super Saiyan God is completely untrue. There is no known evidence or even reference that the ritual increased the power of SSJGod just because there's more people (people that were complete fodder fyi, so the power boost they'd give would still be negligible. One was an unborn baby). The SSJGod form gives access to Godly Ki and a huge power boost, that's it.

 

[OmniTops]

I mention that Frost can not be 3-A in Universe 6 Saga, since Goku said he was holding back and then Goku SSJ1 got over it without much difficulty and Vegeta defeated him in one hit like SSJ1. being his only feat being superior to Piccolo and equal to Goku Base content, so he should only climb to Piccolo, which can not be 3-A since he never faced Goku Base nor was it said to be comparable to this, on the other hand 4-B if it would make sense since in Revival of F Saga it was Large Star +.

 

[Tyranno223]

You know that Goku's base in revival of f was 3A with the whole absorbing ssj god's power right? It's why Frieza's final form is 3A and therefore Frost would also be universal for being Ssj Goku > Frost >/= Base Goku >/= Final form Frieza

 

[OmniTops]

He was holding back on base, he makes it very clear.

 

[Niarobi_(Formerly_Hadou)]

Frost was comparable to Goku's base when he wasn't in final form, and was able to take a Final Flash from Vegeta Blue without getting obliterated. He also began to defeat Gohan in the Tournament of Power.

 

[Niarobi_(Formerly_Hadou)]

Also, @dbknowitall, we don't use the manga for Dragon Ball Super, here, we consider the anime to be the primary canon.

 

[OmniTops]

I'm talking about Frost Universe 6 Saga

 

[Dark649]

From the Discussion Rules: Please do not create new discussion threads complaining about the Dragon Ball Super characters being upgraded to 3-A based on Base Goku's revision, as the topic has been discussed to exhaustion at this point and every thread tends to be a repeat of the last one. The characters who became Universal have demonstrated legitimate scaling to be upgraded, while the characters who didn't have not. Failure to adhere to this rule will result in the thread being locked.

 

[Niarobi_(Formerly_Hadou)]

Frost did little training with Hit like a few hours before the Tournament of Power. That wouldn't be enough to bump him up to Universal AP. And the Universal Durability in the Universe 6 Saga can't be denied.

 

[OmniTops]

@Dark649 But the reason he says in Frost's profile is erroneous, since he says it is almost comparable to Goku SSJ 1 when it was clearly overcome by this very easily.

@TheHadouCyberspaceWitch 17 is universal only training with hunters.

 

[Niarobi_(Formerly_Hadou)]

17 isn't only training with hunters, he's training by himself, and he's been training for well over a decade.

 

[Dark649]

SS1 Goku is 3-A in Super and if you disagree then the thread will be closed.

 

[OmniTops]

if I agree with that, but in his Third Form it was comparable to Goku Base when it was contained, and then Goku SSJ1 humiliated without Strive to your final form.

 

[Niarobi_(Formerly_Hadou)]

Goku's base is also Universal. Frost was also holding back against SSJ Goku.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

We are really not going through this crap again...3-A is an infinitely wide tier....literally. These guys would simply be on a lower end of it. We've gone through this countless times and nothing has changed. It's literally a discussion rule now due to how many times we dealt with it.

 

[OmniTops]

Goku base was holding back and Frost was not restrained as he was even forced to use his Poisoned Needle

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Goku holding back =/= holding back all the way to Solar System level. Also from my understanding, Frost uses his poison regardless of whether his opponent's strong or not.

 

[Niarobi_(Formerly_Hadou)]

On SSJ Goku. And he wasn't forced, he just didn't care enough to try. If he were really pushed to his limit of power, he would've went Final Form and 100%, which we see he's naturally capable of doing when showcased in the Tournament of Power. Frost and Frieza also have a discussion about how Frost has never trained, so Frost VS Hit doesn't even count as a training regimen. Like I said before, he was defeating Gohan in the Tournament of Power, and he tanked Vegeta Blue's Final Flash in the Universe 6 Saga. He was comparable to SSJ Goku in that saga, because he was not remotely trying against him.

 

[OmniTops]

Against Roshi and Krillin he held back until Large Star

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

Against Roshi and Krillin he held back until Large Star

Yet, he also knows how strong they are. He had no reason to hold back so much of his power here, unlike with Krillin and Roshi as he knows nothing about Frost.

 

[Niarobi_(Formerly_Hadou)]

Obviously. He used SSB,.though, and was capable of pushing his ki lower than he can in his base. You can make that excuse for his base form and his SSB form, but not his SSJ form. Goku may have been overwhelming Frost, but like I said, Frost was not remotely serious. Him not being in his final form means he was using less than 1% of his full power.

 

[Antvasima]

I think that we should preferably close this thread.

 

[Niarobi_(Formerly_Hadou)]

That would likely be wise.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay.