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QuasiYuri

They/Them
VS Battles
Retired
6,605
4,155
I should definitely have done this on new year but got too lazy

More clean-up​

Her speed justification regarding the Green Sun should be removed, since the Sun itself don't look anything big, wouldn't be a reason for Immeasurable and its just her resurrection anyway.

Homestuck canonicity blog​

This blog should be added in case anyone may think that we're putting non-canon stuff on the profiles (saw some people in the fandom who are quite puzzled by how canon is now an in-verse thing and not fully understanding it).

Limited Cosmic Awareness and 4th Wall to Hiveswap dudes​

So most HS characters have limited Cosmic Awareness and 4th Wall Breaking. I think Hiveswap dudes should too, because of the tons of 4th Wall and similar breaking like in Homestuck.

To list some of them:

-Lanque's route first choice, where Ardata warn you about NSFW stuff and Lynera saying age restriction don't apply to her since she's not real

-The famous Marvus discussion

-Joey making a typical 4th Wall breaking

And much more, which tbh can easily be found here and there

Joey upgrades​

So besides the fact that dodging Nihkee's punch was removed meaning I can't do speed scaling like I intended

Joey got new stuff:

She learned a bee dance especially made to make them react to her and create their weird saliva ; which would likely be some form of limited Animal Manipulation

Given how easily she's able to get help from the same dudes who make MSPAR have Social Influencing, she should get this ability.

Her intelligence section should include more stuff, like being able to hold her own in a trial, getting help from others pretty easily or trick highbloods into thinking she comitted murder; although it should be nuanced by the fact that she needed help in the trial and that Marvus voluntary accepted the tricks

Xefros upgrades​

Joey got stuff, but Xefros surprisingly got better ones. He should get Rage Power. It's pretty obvious from his fight with Azdaja (where he becomes stronger because he's mad about Joey being hurt) and the fact that he is of the Rage aspect.

He should scale above MSPAR, being able to tackle Baizli and scaring Tegiri when proposing to fight despite still having broken bones. Since he was already implied to be stronger than the regular dudes of his caste, it wouldn't make any problem.

Also his stamina likely should get upgraded, since he did all of Act 2 with broken bones.

Speeds changes​



Hiveswap​

In Nihkee's route, MSPAR goes through a lot of training, one of them being going toe-toe with a punching bag which send sonic waves everytime you hit it. Although MSPAR themself aren't said to have succeeded; Nihkee should have a "possibly Subsonic" rating, since she's a well-trained troll who constantly uses the material shown in the room. Others trolls who could qualify are Purpleblood her age like Marvus or Chahut , which shouldn't be too far below her.

Another thing is: why MSPAR has Peak Human speed? No feats remotely implied this, and the only numbered speed we have is his top running speed, being 12 miles per hour (which is very average). As such, them and everyone scaling should only get an average speed (unless they're like Nihkee)

Homestuck​

So the problem here is mid-tiers FTL+ speed.

Here's the justifications for it, being respectively from Sollux's and Jack's profile.

"Threw the troll's meteor to the Green Sun within a very short timeframe, and later, into the Furthest Ring at sufficient speed to reach another session within three years. Should be comparable or superior to his ancestor, the Psiionic, who was able to move The Condesce's flagship thousands of light years within a matter of hours."

"Capable of incredibly quick interplanetary travel"


However, each have their own flaws:

-The Troll meteor's feat is done in the Furthest Ring, where time and space are non-linear and all. Plus Sollux was helped by Aradia and died in the process.

-There's absolutely no reason to consider him above the Psiionic nor comparable. Not all Goldbloods are comparable and no feats were remotely comparable to it .

-Planets/Lands are planet-sized. The medium isn't in any way similar to space or our universe. So there's no reason to assume it needs FTL+ speed.

Now what feats could work?

If anyone think of one of the nearly LS/LS statements, it's a no. Besides being proven as BS for Jade and because of Furthest Ring, Dave himself called out the fact that it was likely BS and not going at this speed anyway.

Now the only thing I see besides scaling to the Kids is this calc based on a WoG saying that Bro threw a batarang before a note "could fall even a single nanometer".

I could understand that this feat may be seen as an outlier or not enough (and there's likely others feats which could be used to contradict it), so I'm more proposing it as a "possibly" rather than a straight FTL+.

Including things such as Aspects in Notable Attacks/Techniques (when it's relevant)​

Didn't worked on it yet, but someone suggested that we should have Classpects under Notable Attacks/Techniques.

Class merely being "how you use your aspect"; I think it would be more useful to have the Aspect listed, with the description explaining what it is and how it is used by the character. It can work for both Homestuck characters and Hiveswap ones, as long as they have shown some abilities (like if they're just a random Void player, they naturally gain Resistance to Mind Read + Precog/Clairvoyance but it isn't worth putting it in Notable Attacks/Techniques)

I'll likely have some draft or sandbox in the following day(s).

Conclusion​

So to resume everything:

-Rose's speed justification with the Green Sun should be removed

-Canonicity blog gets added

-Hiveswap characters all gets limited 4th Wall/Cosmic Awareness like HS ones

-Joey and Xefros get new stuff

-Speed get changed for Hiveswap characters, "Average Human Speed" with possibly Subsonic for the strongest ones.

-HS mid-tier speed gets changed to something else. Maybe "Supersonic+, possibly FTL+"

-Aspects should be included in Notable Attacks/Techniques section when relevant, but some draft should be made before

I also intend to do a troll physiology page but it takes some time.
 
Speed justification stays. Saying "It doesn't look to big" is dumb and contradicts it being twice the size of the universe and the "largest source of raw narrative" in the multiverse

Canon blog is fine

Sollux and Psiionic have the same energy, if not the Psiionic having a good bit more. Nuetral on this.

Everything else is fine
 
Speed justification stays. Saying "It doesn't look to big" is dumb and contradicts it being twice the size of the universe and the "largest source of raw narrative" in the multiverse

Sollux and Psiionic have the same energy, if not the Psiionic having a good bit more. Nuetral on this.
Never was stated to have the size, only the mass.
Also it isn't a justification for Immeasurable nor a true speed feat anyway (it's litteraly a transfo process she had no control over), so it has no reason to be.

They just are both mutant goldblood. No reason for him to scale. Even Mituna pre-power lost would be discutable despite Psiionic being an older version of him.
 
Agree on all of them, the green is only said to be massive, not big, although i think that answer was given when they asked how big it was, but in cascade when it expanded, it only seemed like hundreds of times larger than dersite, it was never said to have the size of the universes as far as i know.

Being a source says nothing about size.

Plus ressurection teleports the user somewhere, it ain't speed, and is not like we are removing it, we are just changing the justification.

Was waiting for us to finally give xefros what he deserves, another justification is him ragdolling azdaja when he got angry, idk but i'm sure a psionic who's also a champion (******* troll vegeta too) would probably scale higher than the other trolls.

Actually, has azdaja ever seem someone super strong in hiveswap, because maybe we could scale xefros to them to have a notion on his rage power.

Oh yeah, his telekinesis seemes to get better after the fight, and he could move levers and pit doors in the control room, it made some people theorize he is a mage of rage, pretty cool.

sharing energy doesn't make you comparable though, weak and strong god tiers have gaps of 5 whole tiers, lord english used the green sun's 1-A power while the other guardians used only 2-A.

Aren't planets/lands state-sized?

I feel like their speed is better at supersonic for now, a single ftl feat is pretty outlier, but crossing states in short time could help, feferi's page claims she can cross a planet or something quickly.

Like, the ftl god tiers will probably scale to "crossing their lands quickly" because states are big.

Btw where does the supersonic+ come from, is there a calc for afterimages? And bro should probably be "at least hypersonic+" or something since he managed to get on a meteor while it was falling on the city, somehow, could scale him and jack noir 3x To the weaker god tiers.

Basically, the weaker ones at the begining would be supersonic while the mid tiers (weak god tiers, bro, 3x jack) would be some degree of hypersonicness.
 
Yeah but "largest source" can mean the content and not the size, plus that would help for scaling, as in, find a source of narrative and make the green sun comparable.
 
I wasn't talking about it being big via a source, it's stated to be "the largest source of raw narrative"
I think it's not supposed to be like bigger than everything but more the most concentrated source of it
 
Was waiting for us to finally give xefros what he deserves, another justification is him ragdolling azdaja when he got angry, idk but i'm sure a psionic who's also a champion (******* troll vegeta too) would probably scale higher than the other trolls.

Oh yeah, his telekinesis seemes to get better after the fight, and he could move levers and pit doors in the control room, it made some people theorize he is a mage of rage, pretty cool.

Like, the ftl god tiers will probably scale to "crossing their lands quickly" because states are big.

Btw where does the supersonic+ come from, is there a calc for afterimages? And bro should probably be "at least hypersonic+" or something since he managed to get on a meteor while it was falling on the city, somehow, could scale him and jack noir 3x To the weaker god tiers.
Yeah Xefros should have a "higher when enraged" (scaling chain is Enraged him>Azdaja>Kuprum>Drone).
Should have better TK yeah.

They didn't physically cross their lands tho. Not entirely. They go through portals, do puzzles and all (Feferi justification should be removed too btw).
Not sure about calcing the time taken to go between lands, since Bec Noir took 3 hours to do Derse-Prospit iirc (although it's PIS).

It comes from Brobot in his fight against Jake, who casually catch bullets. Jake can keep up with him despite being a very weak player and all.
 
I was rereading Homestuck and I found this

"No. The release of temporal energy will be quite massive. This is a hard reset. It will reboot the conditions in your universe well before you began playing the game. You will have lived different lives after the reset. The different initial conditions will ideally lead to a more favorable scenario in the new session. Unfortunately, you will have no memory of anything that has happened in the session you are in now. (...) You will all cease to exist completely if you remain here during the Scratch. (...) Similar, but more severe. Since this timeline will undergo such a violent upheaval, such a merger of memory cannot happen. You will be resigned to absolute oblivion. Unless you can discover a way to preserve yourselves. But it's not really my place to advise you on that. After you have dealt with the Scratch and the sun, what happens to you is not any of my business."

According to Doc Scratch, the Scratch hardcore resets the game of Homestuck. Scratch and Rose also say the following:

"That frames the dual objectives accurately.
But if you are inventive, you may find a way to survive the reset and participate in the renewed session.
It's up to you.
Just as it's up to you to face the decision to claim immortality before you enter your creation.
TT: Immortality?
Yes.
TT: Do you mean ascending to the god tier?
Yes."


God-Tiers are implied to be able to resurrect from the Scratch, so they could very well have Mid-Godly or High-Godly. Thoughts?
 
We know they can't from Dancestors session, since Meenah killed everyone so that Scratch gets triggered during their death and save their souls.
 
my memory may be foggy, but wasn't it not specified when they got the God-Tier?

Also, I'm pretty sure they had to save their friends who weren't god-tier, if they were
 
They became during their session.

Also I'm p sure Meenah flat out said she killed them for GT delay
 
To delay them becoming God-Tier? I'm not talking about they will become GT from the Scratch, I am talking about resurrecting from GT Immortality from the Scratch
 
To delay them becoming God-Tier? I'm not talking about they will become GT from the Scratch, I am talking about resurrecting from GT Immortality from the Scratch
Delay they resurrection so that their soul get saved in Dream Bubbles
 
So, were they God-Tiers? Meenah and Aranea sure, but everyone else? I think they had to save everyone by blowing them up, thus going to the dream bubbles to ignore the scratch. IIRC, the Tumor (The Item they used to nuke themselves) ignores the immortality
 
So, were they God-Tiers? Meenah and Aranea sure, but everyone else? I think they had to save everyone by blowing them up, thus going to the dream bubbles to ignore the scratch. IIRC, the Tumor (The Item they used to nuke themselves) ignores the immortality
Everyone needed to be saved anyway yeah, although I don't remember Tumor havibg this ability since John not being the sacrifice was because it would be heroic.
 
Because Scratch didn't imply GT would save them? He litteraly says they'll need to escape despite everyone inside being GT before escaping.
Also Jade confirmed that they would have just been erased iirc.
 
I didn't found the soun wave punching bag in the route, what's the time stamp, also are they supposed to dodge the sound waves to be successful or what?
 
I didn't found the soun wave punching bag in the route, what's the time stamp, also are they supposed to dodge the sound waves to be successful or what?
It's when they describe everything they went through, near the end of good route.

We don't know how it exactly works, so that's why I propose a possibly.
 
In that case it should be possible supersonic instead, since they would be dodging sound at close range, although it feel more like a durability feat than a speed one since they are testing their endurance.

Also MSPAR outrun a giant toothy monster, it coul give him a likely higher speed rating.
 
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Their speed was calculated in the same route so idk. The training tools are varying, and only the iron maiden was meant to calc their endurance iirc.
 
In that case, "possible supersonic" could be put.

I mean like, training their endurance to increase it, since they would endure the waves and fight back.
 
So there is 2 things i want to ask which might affect eith one of the points:

1. Where is the statement of the dream bubbles being 5D?

2. Are dream bubbles as big as the genesis frogs (or bigger)

Reason for that is because in caliborn enter we see how bi the cracks are compared to a dream bubble, and in collide we see that the green sun is comparable in size to the cracks, so depending on how big they, the green sun could be as big or bigger than before.
 
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