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Few questions about Muhdoka
- Thread starter OriginFox
- Start date
Randomlamdom
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1: because she made witches nonexistent on a conceptual level and became a concept herself, type 3 concepts can be messed with by changing everything that is part of it in reality, while type 2 concepts are outside of reality and are unaffected by that, which is what she can do and is (hope i explained this properly)
2: what i know is that she said she would destroy and rewrite any laws that would stand in her way, don’t know about it being passive because this is outside my area of knowledge
3: she appeared at tart’s death in the witch world, several hundred years before her own birth and wish
2: what i know is that she said she would destroy and rewrite any laws that would stand in her way, don’t know about it being passive because this is outside my area of knowledge
3: she appeared at tart’s death in the witch world, several hundred years before her own birth and wish
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- Thread starter
- #3
I know about the part of her erasing witches and becoming a concept herself, however, that doesn’t explain how she can manipulate concepts that transcend reality and how she herself is a type 2 entity.
Okay but how does that mean she is big enough to encompasses both multiverses? Like at most I’ve seen evidence was of her skirt being the universe.
Randomlamdom
They/Them- 1,676
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? Because after she made her wish, kyubey described how as a concept she would be transcendent over everything, which is type 2
That’s her avatar, her true self is the concept
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- Thread starter
- #5
Kyubey never days that, what Kyubey says is something like how no one will remeber her, Madoka is now a concept existing on a higher plane and she will no longer be able to interact with the world.
So then where is it shown her true form encompassing the two infinite multiverses? Or at least what's the argument
Randomlamdom
They/Them- 1,676
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Yes, she as a concept is on a higher plane of existence, which is transcendent over reality, so she is a type 2 concept
She saves magical girls all in the wraith world, constantly fights ukg in the nonexistent witch world, saw the timelines where homura was fighting for her, and has shown up at places like tart’s execution
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- #7
Okay the encompassing thing makes more sense now but Madoka being type 2 concept doesn't. How is being a concept on a higher plane of existence equal to transcendent over reality?
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She's on par with the Law of Circles which is above the reality systems of the verse iirc
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No, it was expained pretty bad lol
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As i thought lol
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You can't
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Tho I found some stuff.
Madoka is implied to manipulate laws and Causality, and to be above such things
Madoka is implied to manipulate laws and Causality, and to be above such things
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And is stated to be above causality itself (idk the source tho), so Type 2 is fine
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What's there still to talk about?
Strym, yeah, the last one is probably non-canon.
Strym, yeah, the last one is probably non-canon.
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How does she have type 2 conceptual manipulation, and what is the extent of her omnipresent state. If I am reading this thread right. I'm curious too.
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Im not sure about concept manip type 2,but properly it comes from the fact that she can erase the concept of witches before that concept was born?Pretty sure concept type 3 cant do anything like that and erasing concept before it was born means erasing concept which is outside reality?
Law manip is thought based,who tf said that it is passive
She is omnipresent and she can take all mgs(except those from main universe of magireco) through space time into her conceptual body,and she can manifest in nonexistent multiverse to fight with ukg means she exists in that multiverse too
Law manip is thought based,who tf said that it is passive
She is omnipresent and she can take all mgs(except those from main universe of magireco) through space time into her conceptual body,and she can manifest in nonexistent multiverse to fight with ukg means she exists in that multiverse too
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- #21
Why Madoka has type 2 concept manipulation, if her haxs like law and concept manipulation is passive, and what the argument for Madoka encompassing two infinite multiverse is.
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- #22
Well type 2 isn't what you described. Type 2 concept manipulation is manipulating concept that trandscend reality so something thats outside reality isn't transcending it.
When/where was it shown that Madoka was omnipresent? What you're describing doesn't sound like omnipresent but some form of Manifestation/dimensional travel.
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transcending reality is beyond reality,why outside reality doesn't mean transcending it?
Randomlamdom
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Madoka became a concept and shifted up to a higher plane of existence and oversees the wraith world as the law of cycles
And constantly fights ukg across the nonexistent witch world as well as interacting with it before that happened as seen with tart’s execution
Seriously this has been explained multiple times
And constantly fights ukg across the nonexistent witch world as well as interacting with it before that happened as seen with tart’s execution
Seriously this has been explained multiple times
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what does "reality" even mean for Type 2 Conceptual manipulation? sounds super vague and not specific enough imo.
Randomlamdom
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I think it’s a higher dimensional thing
Imagine the concept of “sword”, if it was type 3 destroying every sword in reality would destroy the concept, while if it was type 2 the concept would still exist
Imagine the concept of “sword”, if it was type 3 destroying every sword in reality would destroy the concept, while if it was type 2 the concept would still exist
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I don't see how it can be a higher dimensional thing when on the Top 5 strongest NON-SMURFs there is some characters whom do have Type 2 concept that aren't even 3-A. this was once a topic of discussion in the past and everyone seemed.... lost.. confused...
Also, in my opinion i don't like that analogy or whatever. it doesn't explain it well enough
anyways im sorry to derail this..
Randomlamdom
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Well that’s the way it works. if you think it doesn’t, bring it up with staff
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Im not saying it doesn't, but its hard to understand or make sense of it.
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- #33
Mmk.
The questions should be "Why would being outside reality equate to it meaning trandscending reality"
also omnipresence comes from this scan,quite weird when someone asks sth obviously like this
Well considering how there is barely any scans on Madoka's page I figured I'd ask.
Because what you described of Madoka erasing the concept of witches before it even existed doesn't mean that the concept of witches are beyond reality.
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Concept wasn't born=concept doesn't even exist in reality,idk why it's not beyond reality
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- #35
Why the hell would it be? She's just erasing a concept before it exists, in no way shape or form would that make that a type 2 concept manipulation feat. A prime example of type 2 concept manipulation would be like God Sinbad rewriting the system of the rukh which governs all of reality.
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This shit again?!
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- #38
There's hardly any justifications for type 2 concept manipulation so yes.
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Hardly?
Madoka blatantly showed it on screen.
Her wish is to destroy every single witches on conceptual level throughout the Multiverse and said Multiverse got destroyed and a new one with the new set of Law was born. That is Type 2 since the Multiverse is also being affected by it.
It was later backed up in the Wraith Arc, where Homura refers the previous Multiverse as Obsolete.
Madoka blatantly showed it on screen.
Her wish is to destroy every single witches on conceptual level throughout the Multiverse and said Multiverse got destroyed and a new one with the new set of Law was born. That is Type 2 since the Multiverse is also being affected by it.
It was later backed up in the Wraith Arc, where Homura refers the previous Multiverse as Obsolete.
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- #40
Ah shit, here we go again.
A type 2 concept is/are concept (s) that trandscend reality. She destroyed a multiverse and created a new one...okay, so what? How does that prove that the concept of witches trandscend reality?
