Eclipsa Butterfly vs Jiren

[AntorusTheBurningThrone]

Doesn't have a Universal range, no. But, it does affect Universe+ beings.

 

[ZacharyGrossman273]

Having that level of AP doesen't give you resistance to time stop on it's own, so it's not universal. I vote Eclipsa via having better timehax than Jiren has resisted.

 

[AntorusTheBurningThrone]

Thing is, I don't think her time stop will be the first thing she uses though. Therefore, if her time stop IS the only thing that could be Jiren, then maybe Jiren will the upperhand, since she's both evil, and...well...tough. The first thing Jiren could do is easily beat her down without care.

 

[ZacharyGrossman273]

"

• Dark Velvet Inferno: Eclipsa releases a stream of darkness that encases the target in a sphere, denying them any chance of escape. The sphere then cracks, engulfing the target in a powerful burst of energy before collapsing completely, seemingly leaving no trace behind. Meteora somehow managed to survive and was reverted to an infant, uch to Eclipsa's surprise and delight.

What's Jiren's defense against this?

 

[AntorusTheBurningThrone]

Jiren destroys the sphere by powering up.

 

[ABoogieYesSir]

Uh Jiren FRA.

 

[GyroNutz]

Jiren at full power is superior to infinite Zamasu, a living timeline-thing.

Omnitraxus Prime is the same deal, and Moon Butterfly is superior to him.

Eclipsa Butterfly scares Moon Butterfly, and easily defeated someone comparable to her.

So no, Jiren doesn't simply 'glare'. He doesn't have any form of 'UI'; saying he does is headcanon. Finally, while he is better at martial arts, Eclipsa Butterfly is one of the most skilled wielders of the Wand, and I doubt martial arts will matter too much when Eclipsa can settle this battle with hax.

Voting Eclipsa Butterfly, and I'm not a big fan of the reasons above for Jiren either

 

[Akreious]

How would she ever detect a Jiren Glare? It took UI for Goku to defend against it, Goku got pummeled every other time. She'd take every glare to the face.

Also your reasoning above is massively downplaying Jiren.

Fullpower Jiren is superior to Berzerk Kefla who is superior to 2nd UIO Goku who is superior to first UIO battle jiren who is superior to first UIO Goku who is superior to Infinite Zamasu.

They said Infinite Zamasu was weaker than Jiren back in the FIRST Ultra instinct fight so saying MAX POWER Jiren is only superior to Infinite Zamasu then is, in all honesty, MASSIVE downplay.

 

[Ninjaboy14]

How would she ever detect a Jiren Glare? It took UI for Goku to defend against it, Goku got pummeled every other time. She'd take every glare to the face.
Also your reasoning above is massively downplaying Jiren.

Fullpower Jiren is superior to Berzerk Kefla who is superior to 2nd UIO Goku who is superior to first UIO battle jiren who is superior to first UIO Goku who is superior to Infinite Zamasu.

They said Infinite Zamasu was weaker than Jiren back in the FIRST Ultra instinct fight so saying MAX POWER Jiren is only superior to Infinite Zamasu then is, in all honesty, MASSIVE downplay.

I know this may strike up some controversial comments, but.

Shouldn't Infinite Zamasu be superior to Jiren?

As Jiren can shake the world of the Void. Infinite Zamasu IS the universe (or in this case, the world of the Void).

 

[Akreious]

I know this may strike up some controversial comments, but.

Shouldn't Infinite Zamasu be superior to Jiren?

As Jiren can shake the world of the Void. Infinite Zamasu IS the universe (or in this case, the world of the Void).

Nope. Jiren was explicitly said to be far different from any other enemy and is quoted as Goku's most powerful adversary, which would include Infinite zamasu. They said this in Jiren's FIRST fight against UIO Goku and Goku's surpassed his original UI form twice and yet was still only almost on par with Jiren untio achieving MUI.

I guess you missed the part where they flat out said hes superior to Infinite zamasu? Also the feat you said would be High 3-A not Low 2-C

 

[Ninjaboy14]

I meant Infinite Zamasu can eventually become 2-C.

 

[Akreious]

Eventually?

 

[ShadowWarrior1999]

Speed is unequalized. Jiren blitzes.

 

[Akreious]

Lol

 

[GyroNutz]

Also your reasoning above is massively downplaying Jiren.

Fullpower Jiren is superior to Berzerk Kefla who is superior to 2nd UIO Goku who is superior to first UIO battle jiren who is superior to first UIO Goku who is superior to Infinite Zamasu.

They said Infinite Zamasu was weaker than Jiren back in the FIRST Ultra instinct fight so saying MAX POWER Jiren is only superior to Infinite Zamasu then is, in all honesty, MASSIVE downplay.

Show solid evidence that heavily suppressed Jiren was stronger than infinite zamasu.

Note that Beerus getting scared of Jiren, or some off-hand statement with some character being in awe of his strength, is not solid evidence

 

[AntorusTheBurningThrone]

Also your reasoning above is massively downplaying Jiren.

Fullpower Jiren is superior to Berzerk Kefla who is superior to 2nd UIO Goku who is superior to first UIO battle jiren who is superior to first UIO Goku who is superior to Infinite Zamasu.

They said Infinite Zamasu was weaker than Jiren back in the FIRST Ultra instinct fight so saying MAX POWER Jiren is only superior to Infinite Zamasu then is, in all honesty, MASSIVE downplay.

Show solid evidence that heavily suppressed Jiren was stronger than infinite zamasu.
Note that Beerus getting scared of Jiren, or some off-hand statement with some character being in awe of his strength, is not solid evidence

Jiren glared a Spirit Bomb without even caring. That was when it was stated.

 

[GyroNutz]

Glaring at a 3-A spirit bomb isn't a good feat.

If you mean when Shin says 'His power is different to anyone we've faced before', again, that's too vague. I can buy Jiren being stronger than merged zamasu from a writing perspective, but Goku never faced off against Infinite Zamasu - Zeno did.

 

[AntorusTheBurningThrone]

Goku actually did...

In fact, he seriously thought that he could take on Zamasu had he acquired another Senzu Bean.

 

[Akreious]

Glaring at a 3-A spirit bomb isn't a good feat.
If you mean when Shin says 'His power is different to anyone we've faced before', again, that's too vague. I can buy Jiren being stronger than merged zamasu from a writing perspective, but Goku never faced off against Infinite Zamasu - Zeno did.

Shin saw what power Infinite Zamasu had. If he was wrong, Old Kai or Kibito Kai from the other stall would've contested that but nobody said a thing. How the hell is that too vague? He stated that he's different from everyone else, as in he's so out of their league that he's a whole other thing entirely. The other enemies isn't even in the same league.

Also, every guide and magazine supports this stance, with multiple "Strongest enemy Goku faces to date!" taglines littered across the place.

Plus, we've at least got supporting evidence. Just saying "It's too vague" isn't enough. It's actually the reverse in this case, what evidence do you have that Jiren is NOT superior to Infinite Zamasu despite several statements and supporting guide quotes, which is like 3rd canon. When your 3rd Canon supports your main canon, you got some solid material right there.

 

[True_yojimbo]

The level of head-canon for a stupid Disney show is too high.

 

[Orrormaster]

Jiren wins

 

[Uselessnoob245]

necro brah