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wouldn't it be better to create a rule about demoting Universes to 3-A? Because the evidence has been shown, maybe in the future it will create chaosYeah, seems fine to close it IMO
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wouldn't it be better to create a rule about demoting Universes to 3-A? Because the evidence has been shown, maybe in the future it will create chaosYeah, seems fine to close it IMO
There already is. Do not attempt to change dragonball cosmology unless new information comes. This thread will just add up as even current new information regarding RoSaT is not enough neither tier 2 revision has affected it.wouldn't it be better to create a rule about demoting Universes to 3-A? Because the evidence has been shown, maybe in the future it will create chaos
So this can be closed thank you my brotherThere already is. Do not attempt to change dragonball cosmology unless new information comes. This thread will just add up as even current new information regarding RoSaT is not enough neither tier 2 revision has affected it.
This was debunked but we can add further justification I can handleif i may say something, it was not concluded per say, but just that it got derailed so much that it was impossible for staff to evaluate and then it was decided for a new thread to be created to be easier for staff to evaluate, along with the summaries from each side
edit: also the note on the profiles has to change anyway since the rosat is not considered part of the macrocosm anymore, i still believe that a downgrade is needed, since the rosat was hinted as not being a space time, but just having different timeflow due to time dialation due to gravity, hence not being a space time and the rosat being the only thing that was keeping the timeline at 2-C since it was assumed to be affected, but now that reasoning doesn't work anymore, so there needs to be a change no matter what
Add a new note regarding RoSaT and just explain it there why it's still a part of macrocosm while being outside of living universe even when talking into account the statement of frieza. Justification can stay as it is.This was debunked but we can add further justification I can handle
This was debunked but we can add further justification I can handle
just to say that we should probably wait for more staff before deciding anything, the whole purpose of this thread's creation was to have staff read the sumaries of each side of the past threads and then reach a consensus, but as shown in the op, the rosat may not even be a space time anymore, so we need more staff opinion on that tooAdd a new note regarding RoSaT and just explain it there why it's still a part of macrocosm while being outside of living universe even when talking into account the statement of frieza. Justification can stay as it is.
just to say that we should probably wait for more staff before deciding anything, the whole purpose of this thread's creation was to have staff read the sumaries of each side of the past threads and then reach a consensus, but as shown in the op, the rosat may not even be a space time anymore, so we need more staff opinion on that too
Seems like the original topic was concluded and it was decided to keep Universes as separate space-times, and then the thread just randomly shifted into the tired old 2-C Universes discussion and trying to scale the canon cosmology to the non-canon cosmology. I say we just close the thread.
I think that @DarkDragonMedeus , @Firestorm808 , and I already rejected a Dragon Ball cosmology downgrade.
Sorry, but this topic has already been completed and rejected, the Universes are still low 2-C and the timeline is 2-C, there is even a rule about not changing the entire cosmology, Frieza's argument is not new, this goes all the way back to Z's manga, something discussed a while ago, all arguments against the verse have been refuted, now all that's left is to apply this and close this thread.Yeah, seems fine to close it IMO
correct me if am wrong, but without a explicity statement calling them space times, and with all of them being affected by time travel, wouldn't they just be spatially separated but still being in the same time continuum?Well, tbh, it's kinda seems like RoSaT being spacetime continuum or not may simply don't even affect the rating of timeline being 2C. Given that they're universes at the end of the day. And as I have said before, high 3A multiverse as far as I've seen only applies on verses with the universe being nothing more than galaxies in a greater space (no actually separation at all), no spatial or not even temporal. In any other case, they can still be tier 2, toriyama seems to build rather unique cosmology which shouldn't be concluded easily to high 3A based of given evidences that maybe just be a part of its unique features.
freeza statement is new information from the ongoing manga, plus there is nothing to apply here just yet, and no one covered to other point of the rosat not being a space time, which would invalidate the current note completely, we can't close a thread that has no conclusion reachedSorry, but this topic has already been completed and rejected, the Universes are still low 2-C and the timeline is 2-C, there is even a rule about not changing the entire cosmology, Frieza's argument is not new, this goes all the way back to Z's manga, something discussed a while ago, all arguments against the verse have been refuted, now all that's left is to apply this and close this thread.
Ant unlocked it before and keep it unlocked because the profile isn't too controversial to be lockedIt appears to be unlocked for some reason.
yes, the arguments are not new, it is said that the room of time separated from the Universe since Z, so yes the mention of Freeza is not new, but just an explanation of the z manga already shown, the topic was successfully completed, even the admins asked for closure, so yes this topic is waiting for the page to be unlocked to close this.correct me if am wrong, but without a explicity statement calling them space times, and with all of them being affected by time travel, wouldn't they just be spatially separated but still being in the same time continuum?
freeza statement is new information from the ongoing manga, plus there is nothing to apply here just yet, and no one covered to other point of the rosat not being a space time, which would invalidate the current note completely, we can't close a thread that has no conclusion reached
Spatially separated Dimensions all being serviced by single time Dimension can still be tier 2 structures. And I've expressed my thoughts towards travelling between universes stuff, I do not agree with that point in our revision but even given that revision, dragonball cosmology being unique in itself can facilitate the movement between Dimensions, how else SDBs gonna move btw Dimensions w/o dimension travel? They can't, so they must have Dimension travel. Space btw universes has been unexplained in dragonball so far, all we have is visual of it having planets, doesn't seems like enough.correct me if am wrong, but without a explicity statement calling them space times, and with all of them being affected by time travel, wouldn't they just be spatially separated but still being in the same time continuum?
freeza statement is new information from the ongoing manga, plus there is nothing to apply here just yet, and no one covered to other point of the rosat not being a space time, which would invalidate the current note completely, we can't close a thread that has no conclusion reached
I guess any of you should add a note then or just another justification if need be.
i'm on phone so i can't do anything, and need to sleep soon since in my time zone it is midnightI guess any of you should add a note then or just another justification if need be.
Jeez, this is 14:21 ;-;i'm on phone so i can't do anything, and need to sleep soon since in my time zone it is midnight
you ignored the other point about the rosat not being a space time to begin with, we still need staff to evaluate ityes, the arguments are not new, it is said that the room of time separated from the Universe since Z, so yes the mention of Freeza is not new, but just an explanation of the z manga already shown, the topic was successfully completed, even the admins asked for closure, so yes this topic is waiting for the page to be unlocked to close this.
Seems like the original topic was concluded and it was decided to keep Universes as separate space-times, and then the thread just randomly shifted into the tired old 2-C Universes discussion and trying to scale the canon cosmology to the non-canon cosmology. I say we just close the thread.
Yes, that is fine with me as well, but shouldn't somebody first write an explanation blog with all of the evidence for the universes being separate from each other shown in the preceding thread where we discussed this issue, so we can link to it in our main Dragon Ball verse page afterwards? Somebody with proper writing skills need to help out with cleaning up the language and structure in a wiki sandbox page first though?Yeah, seems fine to close it IMO
well, there is still the problem of the rosat not being a space time showed in the op, no one addressed it yetYes, that is fine with me as well, but shouldn't somebody first write an explanation blog with all of the evidence for the universes being separate from each other shown in the preceding thread where we discussed this issue, so we can link to it in our main Dragon Ball verse page afterwards? Somebody with proper writing skills need to help out with cleaning up the language and structure in a wiki sandbox page first though?
@Reiner, @Vietthai96, @godofice, could do that, I left all links to the relevant comments that I included that each universe is separated from the other by dimensional barriers and dimensions, my writing is not very good, if not i would do it right nowYes, that is fine with me as well, but shouldn't somebody first write an explanation blog with all of the evidence for the universes being separate from each other shown in the preceding thread where we discussed this issue, so we can link to it in our main Dragon Ball verse page afterwards? Somebody with proper writing skills need to help out with cleaning up the language and structure in a wiki sandbox page first though?
Yes, that is fine with me as well, but shouldn't somebody first write an explanation blog with all of the evidence for the universes being separate from each other shown in the preceding thread where we discussed this issue, so we can link to it in our main Dragon Ball verse page afterwards? Somebody with proper writing skills need to help out with cleaning up the language and structure in a wiki sandbox page first though?
@Reiner @Vietthai96 @Dagoth_OwO @Ottavio_Merluzzo@Reiner, @Vietthai96, @godofice, could do that, I left all links to the relevant comments that I included that each universe is separated from the other by dimensional barriers and dimensions, my writing is not very good, if not i would do it right now
@TheUnshakableOne mentioned something very interesting that should be added here and put it on my profile, I think it would help a lot@Reiner @Vietthai96 @Dagoth_OwO @Ottavio_Merluzzo
Would any of you be willing to collaborate with this project?
I have tried countless times to get AKM, DDM and co. to try and make up a cosmology blog but they've always met dead-ends at one side or another.Yes, that is fine with me as well, but shouldn't somebody first write an explanation blog with all of the evidence for the universes being separate from each other shown in the preceding thread where we discussed this issue, so we can link to it in our main Dragon Ball verse page afterwards? Somebody with proper writing skills need to help out with cleaning up the language and structure in a wiki sandbox page first though?
@TheUnshakableOne our friend was mentioned about, I think letting him do it would be a good one, and put what canon or not.I have tried countless times to get AKM, DDM and co. to try and make up a cosmology blog but they've always met dead-ends at one side or another.
Well, I asked a few knowledgeable members to collaborate with writing a sandbox draft page, that can then be reposted as a blog post after it has been finished.I have tried countless times to get AKM, DDM and co. to try and make up a cosmology blog but they've always met dead-ends at one side or another.
I can help make one for toei and canon db cosmologyWell, I asked a few knowledgeable members to collaborate with writing a sandbox draft page, that can then be reposted as a blog post after it has been finished.
this could be a potential draft for the new note
Note: We consider the universes in Dragon Ball alternate time-spaces relative to each other, hence why Zen'ō is rated as 2-C, despite the events in the Goku Black Saga showing parallel timelines encompassing the whole of the multiverse.
The reason for this is that Universe 7 by itself has already been shown to contain parallel space-time continuums within its globe, such as the Room of Spirit and Time, which is still affected by time travel; which proves that the new timelines can encompass other space-times as well, and thus the events in the Future Trunks Saga don't prove anything in the way of the universes being physically connected. Also, the realms in Universe 7 have been shown to need teleportation to traverse between or special means of dimensional travel like Whis’s staff.
7.Credits - @Nullflowerblush
Merus refers to the Room of Spirit and Time's progression of time alternative to the outside world's as the result of time dilation, which may imply that the Living Universe and the Room of Spirit and Time exist within the same space-time continuum, but experience the same time differently.
@Reiner @Vietthai96 @Dagoth_OwO @Ottavio_Merluzzo
Would any of you be willing to collaborate with this project?
None of that mentions anything about afterlives being different timelines, also I noticed the four galaxy thing; Which should be four quadrants not galaxies. Though it is evidence of them being different bodies of spaces requiring either teleportation and/or dimensional travel yeah.の は 、 場所 的 に 上下 の に なっ て いる そして 、 、 地 から から 閻魔 に は 自由 移動 は 不 可能 閻魔界 から 界 王界 に は な 方法 で しか 行く こと は 王界 王界 に は 特殊 方法 方法 で 行く こと こと は 王界 に 'なっ て。 この かいおうかい えんまかい こと から も 、 界 王界閻魔界 → 地獄 、 、 完ぺき 上下 上下 関係 が で き上がっ いる こと が わかる.
The areas of the two worlds are in an up-and-down relationship in terms of location. The areas of the two worlds are in an upper and lower relationship in terms of location, and free movement from hell to Enma is impossible, while from Enma to Kaio-kai can only be reached by a special method. This fact shows that a perfect hierarchical relationship has been established between Kaio-kai and Enma-kai and between Kaio-kai and Enma-kai and Hell.[/URL]
この世は、現世とも呼ばれて いる。端的に言うと、広大な宇 宙のことなのである。その宇宙、4つの銀河に分かれておりその他に宇宙のどこかには悪魔界と呼ばれる、混沌とした場所あることもわかっている。 西南北の銀河という区分は、行 政単位として神々が使っているだけで、この世に住んでいる生命体は、銀河間を自由に行き来することができる。もちろんその技術力があっての話だが・・・ちなみに孫悟空達の住む地球は、北の銀河に存在している。北の銀河でも有数の美しい惑星
This world is also called the present world. Simply put, it is the vastness of space. We know that the universe is divided into four galaxies, and we also know that somewhere in the universe there is a chaotic place called the demon world. The division of the galaxies into southwest, southwest, north, and southwest is only used by the gods as a unit of government, and life forms living in this world can move freely between the galaxies. Incidentally, the Earth, where Sun Wukong and his family live, exists in the northern galaxy. One of the most beautiful planets in the northern galaxy.[/url]
悪魔界は、この世の中でも特 場所である。あの世の神々の目の届かぬところであり生体が住んでいること以 外よくわかっていない。その体が、宇宙の惑星の平和を脅かしたという記録も残っているこの世からあの世へは、普通 の生命体では、自由に行き来す ることはできない。 死亡時に魂 となって行くしか方法はない だが、あの世の神々に行き来を
The demon world is a special place in this world. It is a place beyond the reach of the gods of the other world, and is not well understood except for the fact that it is inhabited by living organisms. There is a record that the body of a living being threatened the peace of the cosmic planets. The only way to go there is as a soul at the time of death.
【界王神界】 あの世、こ の世の者は、ここへの立ち入りは許されていない。 もっとも高度な瞬間移動能力を持っていなければ移動不可能なのだが。
The world of the gods.
No one from the other world or this world is allowed to enter this world.
However, it is impossible to move around here unless you have a high level of instantaneous movement ability.
i never actually delved deep into the DB cosmology. I only watch it for fun not to scale, but it appears the living world is divided up, and the afterlife is inaccessible and impossible to cross over into without special means to do so. The scans also mention some sort of qualitive superiority (hierarchical) relationship with the various worlds some being higher, and some being lower than others.
it would best if someone went to R/Translate for a professional to get a very accurate translation of it, and also proof its not retconned.
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