After several days avoiding the thread (because it's very f*k*ng long) it's time to try it
To sum it up Telne’s got at least the equivalent strength of a giant Dragon 5x Kimun Kamui’s size, and Elma can grapple with the strength of a “giant” version of Telne. While Tohru can grapple with Elma.
Which, to my understanding, would probably upgrade to Class G for lifting strength.
If I understand correctly, Telne is 5 times taller than Kimun Kamui so x5 to the LS (300 m:60 m), just one problem... I doubt that by being 5 times taller, you are automatically 5 times heavier (only depending on the shape of a species, it changes, right?)
Also, it would be good to calculate how heavy a creature of that size should be, considering that we have an official height,
and we know how it looks, can we get the weight, right? (I don't know about math, if I'm wrong don't kill me)
Consolidating feat - Telne - Telne’s strength through this move is so vast that she can physically destroy Saitama; Japan, where the series is set, with a swipe of a single hand (Japanese) or a snap of her fingers (Official Eng). I’m not intricately sure how heavy Saitama is, even with it being an irl place, but being able to swipe it aside so easily through perspective control seems to line up with ‘the weight of largest man-made structures’, or possibly even heavier. If so, please tell me.
Isn't this just AP?
Another feat of Tohru’s is injuring Telne in a 1v1 fight. Tohru did not perform as well in their rematch because of the zoning power of Perspective Control keeping Tohru a distance away from her the entire fight, but this is also a display of Tohru’s striking strength in being able to injure Telne as such with her bare punches, which seems to confuse Telne how Tohru managed it
I don't remember this, in which chapter was it?
Anyway, it's Ap, nothing to do with LS
On its own living at depths isn’t lifting strength because your body is designed for that depth - much like we don’t technically lift the “weight” of our atmosphere whenever we move but we simply live squashed under it all the time. But being able to freely dive to that depth from the surface, move around in that pressure, and also return to the surface with no ill effects, can be seen as a display of lifting strength done as your body can operate the same at both pressures (
https://vsbattles.com/threads/ocean-pressure.126476/).
In this above thread it’s postulated that doing such at the depth of the Mariana Trench would be indicative of Class K or M lifting strength.
The bottom of the Mariana Trench is a mere 16,000 PSI, whereas the pressure diving to a depth of 300km below water would be upwards of 436,770 PSI
Seems good
We can observe that Lucoa easily dwarfs the size of many mountains, meaning by being able to hold and push-back against one of Lucoa’s blows Tohru may even surpass Class T strength by this feat
Note: unlike most Tohru feats this is an example of Tohru trying her absolute hardest. She famously has never been able to beat or harm Lucoa, and Tohru pushing back against Lucoa’s fist is narratively within the chapter an example of Tohru having become much stronger since the old times, a plot beat that’s very important in the story and brought up by Fafnir/Lucoa many times. Lucoa gives a monologue before this blow how Tohru needs to become stronger to handle future threats. Meaning this isn’t a fluke feat or the author forgetting scale but an example of Tohru’s growth - to be able to fight back on Lucoa’s level for the first time ever.
Maybe a possible for Lucoa, but in Tohru's case... blocking a hit isn't Durability? especially considering that by lore she shouldn't scale Lucoa yet, I doubt this punch feat is going to be useful
In a story from his spinoff, while playing with Kanna/Saikawa, Fafnir is bored at their slow human speeds playing tag and tells Kanna to move faster than the speed of light so he can have fun catching her.
Notably in the original jap translation there is no “try moving”, Fafnir simply commands Kanna to move, which also seems to fit with the series staple of “dragon expects incredible dragon-like capabilities out of mundane human experiences” and quells the possibility he is only telling Kanna to try moving that fast rather than to actually move that fast.
Well... it can be useful
However, you need more than a mention like that for... well what Phoenks said:
Fafnir's singular statement isn't really enough evidence to straight up say that he can go faster than light.
This wiki has some tough standards regarding statements like this. You'd need something that further implies or shows him going at those speeds, especially for a solid rating.
Fafnir is by far one of the smartest dragons to the point Tohru consults him for wisdom, training and advice, Tohru of whom other dragons like Kanna/Ilulu consider a genius for being a self-taught expert on typically human/wizard magicks. This statement suggests Fafnir casually assumes Kanna can move this fast, that Fafnir knows he himself can move this fast, and that by comparison (as Tohru is faster than Fafnir by the guidebook):
Usually the guidebooks tend to be taken as a support for an argument and not an argument itself, I doubt the veracity of the guidebook
Consolidating feats - several times Tohru reacts to and dodges Kanna’s electric attacks, dodges lightning while flying within clouds and outspeeds lightning strikes as she fights
That's not Massively Hypersonic and that's it? (if it meets
IDK how many criteria)
And in addition we know by the guidebook that Kanna’s beam attack from their first playfight was an electric blast, to which Tohru easily reacted to with time to spare then dispersed
Ok, probably is Massively Hypersonic electricity
Although this in itself is not faster than light it demonstrates Tohru, when playing on (what she thought was) a human level, can casually react to around 1/10th the speed of light or sub-relativistic speeds. Therefore it is not out of reason that when competing seriously on a Dragon level that Tohru/Fafnir can move faster than light.
I'm sorry, but where is the scan?
Slightly miscellaneous feat I just thought was cute: Kanna manages to comfortably fly from her housephone in Saitama (where Chloe always calls her) to Minnesota before Chloe can leave the room
Nice feat, although she probably traveled there in the middle of the call, so it's not much use either
In one of the possible endings to the videogame written by Cool Kyou Shinja, Tohru says that a fight between her and Fafnir would cause 1/4 of the earth to be destroyed
Is the game canon? IDK, I'll assume for now that it does.
Anyway, what Phoenks said:
Based on what you said and showed... It seems to mean that it would destroy 1/4th of the planet over time.
We don't know how much time that is, or how many attacks it would take for this to happen, so we can't scale them to that value with their individual attacks.
The best I think we could do is a "likely far higher" citing this statement as evidence that she is probably a lot stronger than 6-C.
(Country Level) Consolidation - Tohru and Lucoa mention that if Elma were to get delirious from hunger she would accidentally sink Japan. Of note is the fact Elma sources all her mana from food, meaning this is something they feared from as weak an Elma as Elma could possibly be
I think it's okay
Consolidating Discussion - Tohru’s Progression - Tohru is much stronger than she ever was before finding Earth, this is mentioned many times by Fafnir and Lucoa, by Elma, by Sword-Kun and by Tohru herself. Tohru’s increase in strength has been a running and narratively important plot beat since the beginning of the Kanna’s father arc
And that's why we should make different keys for Tohru
Yep, Tohru is much stronger at this point, and we already know that she was increasing in strength from before, we need keys
Proposed Addition to Ability Set - Holy Sword; Attack Potency Unknown
In recent chapters after the conclusion of the Telne arc, Tohru can now manifest the Holy Sword that the Abrahamic God once smote her with, and use it as an offensive weapon against other dragons.
Although it possesses a conscience, thinking itself Tohru and Kobayashi’s child, it requires a 2nd being to wield it as a weapon against others and currently has deemed itself as Tohru’s weapon - taking the form of whatever blade or tool she desires.
I would suggest this be deemed a standard weapon of Tohru’s, as Tohru has used it in battle against other dragons such as Telne and Elma, and the Holy Sword can only manifest itself in the real world around Tohru due to Tohru’s mana powers and the events of the Telne arc. Only Tohru and Kobayashi can see it, only Tohru and Kobayashi can hear it, and only Tohru and Kobayashi can wield it. It exists in orbit around either Tohru or Kobayashi, and can go wherever they go and manifest where they are, but cannot stray from them. It currently has assigned itself the role of Tohru's weapon to wield.
Makes sense
Tohru has used the Sword to oneshot Telne, who at the time was easily far stronger than both Tohru and Elma combined, and implied by Fafnir to be far stronger than the entire present group including Fafnir, Tohru, Elma, Ilulu and Kanna. Tohru and Fafnir together, being enough to destroy 1/4 of the earth. Elma and Ilulu being of similar strength to Tohru.
I'm not entirely sure, but if the scaling of the Tohru with the sword should be worth it... and Elma, they both held the sword at the end of chapter 112, so I assume it's the combined power of the two dragons, plus the plus of the sword
And she didn't really oneshot her, Telne faked her defeat (although she did have to use all her magic defending her, so she still climbs to her, just not above her, just climbs to her)
Telne has expressed extreme fear in its presence and seemingly understands that the weapon is far beyond her ability to counter if used, instead threatening to kill Kobayashi before she has the speed to use it against her.
The scan shown looks more like a reaction to the sword telling Kobayashi that she's just faking it, something Telne obviously didn't want to be found out about, not fear.
The sword, or “Sword-Kun” is both implied and mentioned to have power over Conceptual Manipulation, such as the concept of cutting and being made by the Abrahamic God to pierce through any Dragon, as Telne says that the Gods of Kobayashi-verse have control over concept manipulation and that this is a power she was specifically granted by Gods - and that she can resist the same power because she was granted protection by the same gods against concept manipulation. This obviously didn’t work because Kobayashi becoming Sword’s mother altered it’s nature, but there you go. Telne is similarly stated to have Conceptual Manipulation given to her by gods on other occasions, such as her sleepover with Kanna and Ilulu (scans provided lower down)
Tohru mentions when wielding it that the Sword gives her a strength boost as Sword-Kun described it would do to Kobayashi, but we have nothing yet to go off how much of a boost that means.
It's a shame, because the conceptual manipulation of cutting is a pretty juicy thing.
On the other hand if Telne really has resistance to concept manipulation, that should be put in the profile, because currently she only has resistance to Holy manipulation.
Now...
If I have nothing to say about a P&A, I won't say anything and it means that I agree 100% (because I'm sick of writing)
Elma and possibly by extent Tohru are implied to have a resistance to Conceptual Manipulation by being able to resist and push against Telne’s Perception Control attacks, making Telne’s hands strain even though her hands are not actually touching them except in concept
Although I want things related to Conceptual Manipulation... This doesn't seem fair.
Telne's ability is Perception Control, but Elma only had to physically fight what is equivalent to an invisible barrier, there's nothing to say that she necessarily needs a resistance to Conceptual Manipulation for that to work.
Regeneration - Consolidating Feat -
...
I think it's still Low-Mid, but better, since it can also regenerate organs like the heart, it would just be an addition to the justification and that's it (I say this because Mid is directly decapitation or severe damage to the brain)
Also add oxygen creation to Tohru’s powers, apparently, hahaha
Minidora is canon?
If someone doesn't know what Minidora is... well,
this is it
Magical Wifi Extension
(Not gonna post a scan because this one's too funny to add to a vsbattle page, it’s a thing she does but it’s so dumb hahaha)
For those who want proof, I think it is in chapter 121 of the main series
The Chorogons all show forms of mindreading. Lucoa reads Shouta’s mind on a ski lift, Fafnir reads Azad’s mind when becoming his roommate and reads Elma’s mind when he turns her into a plushie, in the game Ilulu creates a dreamworld level of Kobayashi’s memories, thoughts and psychology that all the dragons go exploring
Is the game canon? for the moment I will assume that yes (again)
Extrasensory
In the game although Ilulu is not in the area, Kanna and Elma and Tohru can sense the presence of another being stuck in the game with them, while Kobayashi cannot
Is the game canon? for the moment I will assume that yes (ok, I will stop)
Healing
Heals deep life-threatening wounds on Ilulu
[Ilulu healing scan is nsfw]
Kanna has a similar ability in the game where she can heal herself as well as multiple teammates
IS THE GAME CANO...
help, I can't stop
Also, if you can't show the ability, I would recommend at least saying in which chapter it is presented (I'm just saying it for the future)
Eating Lava (Not a feat just thought it was funny lol)
Not ironically, that's heat resistance, and if dragons can be damaged by other dragons' fire, you could make a case for their fire being hotter than lava.
For some reason I can't write more, so what follows will be in another comment
