Dragon Ball Super Discussion Thread 67

[ByAsura]

Wait, but if there was that much of a difference (base being more than MUI level), then wouldn't have Gotenks been able to defeat Fat Buu in base, even before he went in the HTC?

 

[ZERO7772]

Fusion work by combining the two at their best and multiplying it by "x"

Goten and Trunks at the time were fucktons weaker than Fat Buu individually so while Base Gotenks was >> SSJ Gouten\Trunks he was still weaker than Fat Buu

 

[Peter1129]

Wait, but if there was that much of a difference (base being more than MUI level), then wouldn't have Gotenks been able to defeat Fat Buu in base, even before he went in the HTC?

If Gotenks Fusion was with two SS2 lvl characters than probably. But instead Gotenks is a fusion of two SS1 lvl characters so I doubt Base is enough for them to beat a SS3 lvl character like Fat Buu.

 

[ByAsura]

I'm pretty sure the gap between base to MUI increased far beyond its limits with rage, which covers MUI, UIO, Kaioken x20 Blue, Super Saiyan Blue, Super Saiyan God, Super Saiyan 3, Super Saiyan 2, the two ascended Super Saiyan forms, and Super Saiyan, would be more than enough to cover that gap. Especially since Goten and Trunks were somewhat comparable to the other Saiyans at the time, even without Gotenks.

Even if we lowball the above, it'd still be far more than 800x (SS is scaled from half power Frieza being Kaioken X20 level). And that would just be 20x SS.

 

[Peter1129]

Because Fusion is so ******* ridiculous they nerfed Vegito in Zamasu arc but Mary Sue Kefla get every possible boost from the Potara.

RIP Vegito.

Wait how was Vegito nerfed? Are you talking about his time limit or his power? Cause I'm pretty sure in terms of power he wasn't really nerfed. And for the time limit they just extended upon the fusion of the Potaras which were never explained in Z other than it being permanent.

 

[ByAsura]

"Tens of times."

 

[ZERO7772]

Transformations are by default mere power up from your base state. You can't compare characters using forms and transformations

Bardock, for example, would lose to Frieza from Namek saga even if he had SSJ3 let alone SSJ at that time because Bardock has PL of 10K and since SSJ3 is 400 times increase then he will get PL of 4,000,000 which is still much weaker than final form Frieza. not to mention power levels are lack consistency and never stick to the same formula

It's not like Kid Trunks will be Jiren lvl if you give UI back in the Buu Sage

 

[ZERO7772]

Wait how was Vegito nerfed? Are you talking about his time limit or his power? Cause I'm pretty sure in terms of power he wasn't really nerfed. And for the time limit they just extended upon the fusion of the Potaras which were never explained in Z other than it being permanent.

Vegito couldn't beat up Zamasu who Goku was beating a few moments ago and while it's true Zamasu power up it's highly unlike he powered up thousands of times since Trunks was still able to tag him right after he tanked Vegito's strongest attack like nothing

 

[ByAsura]

That's not what i'm saying. I'm saying the power gap between base and Rage Boosted MUI like you are talking about, not base Goten or Trunks to Goku's Rage Boosted MUI.

 

[ZERO7772]

>ap between base and Rage Boosted MUI

You can't come up with the gap between Base and MUI since none of the forms post SSJ3 has official multiplier

 

[ByAsura]

Which is why i only used the 40x of Super Saiyan (wiki's terms) and Blue's 20X to get 800.

Anyway, I think i'm a drop this.

 

[Peter1129]

@Zero Pretty sure that was PIS. Cause there is absolutely no reason for a Fusion to be overpowered by a character that was weaker than its fusee.

 

[ZERO7772]

Which is why i only used the 40x of Super Saiyan (wiki's terms) and Blue's 20X to get 800.

Anyway, I think i'm a drop this.

and I am telling you it doesn't matter how much multiplier you get if you have a shitty base power level

 

[ByAsura]

I could argue, but like I said, i'm just gonna drop it because it's late in my time zone.

Anyway, do you guys think Frieza and 17 kept their limit broken power, or not?

 

[Peter1129]

@Asura Probably yes. Although I still think that limit break statement was probably misinterpreted.

 

[BlackeJan]

Frieza and 17 dont have zenkai's so im 100% sure that they dont have their limit breaking power up

 

[ByAsura]

@Peter Do you mean as in it doesn't refer to power, or wasn't breaking their limits?

 

[ZERO7772]

Goku's line during their final fight against Jiren can be interpreted different ways, clearly, he was saying they were exhausted and doesn't have much more stamina left but somehow here we think he was saying they got stronger.

 

[Peter1129]

Like I've said before the limit break statement can be interpreted in different ways such as.

"We have all gone past our limits" could be referring to how they are all exhausted and they don't have any stamina left.

 

[ZERO7772]

Didn't the wiki use that line as excuse to assume 17 and Frieza got stronger? I am willing to accept they got stronger but to use that as proof is Meh to say the least.

 

[ByAsura]

It was a justification in the CRT, but it's not in the profile.

 

[Peter1129]

Yeah I'm fine with 17 and Frieza getting stronger if Frieza manages to keep up with Broly in the movie. But using that line is a big no. Heck Goku didn't even say they broke their limits. He said they've gone past their limits. There's a clear difference between the two.

 

[Peter1129]

Even the justification on their profile makes no sense. Golden Frieza and 17 fought a heavily worned out Jiren that didn't have his extraordinary strength anymore. And after he powered up and gained some of his strength back he overpowered Golden Frieza and 17's barrier with his Ki before Post-MUI Base Goku stepped in and stopped it with his ki when the barrier was about to be broken. After that Base Frieza miraculously keeps up with said Jiren alongside Post-MUI Base Goku. Even though Post-MUI Base Goku was portrayed as being even stronger than Golden Frieza and 17 combined as he managed to stop of Ki wave that overpowered the two.

 

[BlackeJan]

Yup! i Post MUI Goku became stronger then Golden Frieza/17....how come we didnt say this b4?!

 

[FTW395]

Maybe what they're referring to with "stronger than GOD's" is MUI. If he goes MUI I hope he doesn't lose because according to the spoilers posted Goku is going to lose.

 

[DragonEmperor23]

I want Goku to lose so the Thanos and Broly correlations continue to grow.

 

[ZERO7772]

@Peter How can you mirror my though so closely?

 

[ΚΟΜΙΞ]

Since Funimation has said that the old 3 movies have a meaning Fusion has more and more chances to appear than UI.

 

[ZERO7772]

B-But Vegeta doesn't know the fusion dance....

 

[ΚΟΜΙΞ]

B-But Vegeta doesn't know the fusion dance....

I agree but its Toei... Also apart from the new Broly figure we have 2 figures for new characters.

 

[HST_Master]

I agree but its Toei... Also apart from the new Broly figure we have 2 figures for new characters.

In b4 Vegito Blanco and Gohan Calvo

 

[AntorusTheBurningThrone]

**** it, i'm calling it:

Fusion does happen, Gogeta goes SSBEKKx20 or some shit, and is even with the Broly. However, he defuses the last minute, and Broly torments a beaten down Goku and Vegeta. However, due to their fight, Broly throws Vegeta away like trash, and pummels Goku to no end.

However, before Broly could punch through the knocked down Goku's chest, Son Goku then vanishes, and stands. The Music plays, and Son Goku opens his eyes. Migatte no gokui returns. And here, Goku instantly turns complete, showcasing that he's fully mastered the power of Migatte no gokui.

And then, the final fight's going to be U.I Goku easily kicking Broly's ass. Ending with a Kamehameha (Or a Canon Dragon Fist, idk) through Broly's chest, with Ultimate Battle playing.

From the words of Akio Iyoku himself:

"And also, Dragon Ball is really Goku's story, so I'd like you to focus on just what happens with Goku in the new movie. I think the final battle will definitely be something amazing."

Source: http://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/akio-iyoku-dbs-movie-interview/

Also note what Toei said earlier, in the scan from yesterday: "Those who believe that Goku will win this fight may lose confidence". They're going to bring in ALL the fanservice. Gogeta, Goku Vs Broly, everything. However, when the fan's expectations of Goku winning are lowered to the GROUND, they're going to bring back Ultra Instinct. Showcasing that this is Goku's Ultimate Power, and that nothing can top this state. Nothing. Not a GoD, nor a Fusion, nor Jiren, not even Broly himself could tangle with him at this level.

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

I heavily agree with Antorus ... Also... WIth so many saiyans being on at least UIO 3rd - Jiren level [Kanba,Goku,Broly].... I personally feel that there, if the series continues via movies or tv show, is going to be a enemy comparable to the Angels [ If they don't decide to do it in this DBS movie in January .... Please don't... Last thing is thinking that Broly & Goku ( UI ;Post-Tournament ) is >= Whis is actually a legitimate thing after the movie.. ]. I'm going to flip if we see in the next trailer that Whis is battle damaged.... I wouldn't know what to do.

 

[AntorusTheBurningThrone]

You...you agree with me?

That's a first.

 

[ZERO7772]

If Heroes is anything to go by, Gogeta\Vegito >> U.I Goku

If anything Gogeta will beat down Broly easily then defuse before he finishes him "typical fusion" then Goku will have even match with Broly and defeat him with some help after gaining U.I

 

[ByAsura]

I hope Goku doesn't even leave a corpse.

If you don't get what I mean, then I have two words: Bio Broly.

 

[-BANLK-]

Can this new Broly defeat Hulk?

 

[ByAsura]

Broly is like all DB characters, Wall level.

 

[AKM sama]

I wish Broly lives.

Anyway, I think UI will appear and they are not gonna throw the form away by making it lose to Broly because they spent a year building it up. UI will most probably win or stalemate.

If they are bringing Gogeta, they are not gonna throw him away too by making him lose to Broly, because it is the first canon appearance of the fusion. Gogeta will most likely dominate Broly and then run out of time.

 

[ByAsura]

UI Gogeta.