Clover, you seem really nice, but that is just not a fair assessement.
So zeno didn't erase the HBTC when erasing the timeline? Right...
The notion of physical travel is an "issue" to OP's CRT anyways, since he also claims there is a physical barrier separating them. This can't be a contradiction because of it.
You're asserting this based on nothing tbh
Which is utterly irrelevant considering it's already considered within the macrocosm itself existing between its dimensions, a point I don't even see the OP itself arguing against.
What is this "very blatant finite speed"?
Immeasurable speed does not mean you can travel across universes, traveling across separate spacetimes is impossible via sheer speed alone.
vsbattles.fandom.com
see up above
It shows a proof of concept, a boundary doesn't automatically means something has a different time axis. It's a fact the original arguments don't rely only on the Anime statement, so it proves that some of the arguments used, "It's separate, so it's a different spacetime", is not correct.
Your counter-examples were whataboutism using DC very specific and unconventional macrocosm. I already explained why I don't buy it, it required a lot of statements, evidence, and direct events that showed it's fictional concept, it does not set a precedent for other fictions, they require as much, if not more evidence than DC to have be granted the same level of concept.
It is a valid debunk for the point it was target at, if you concede on it, we can just move on.
When has the story even gone to those lengths?
Like these?
Hell if I know, that's the thing about not having evidence, we can't draw a conclusion, can we?
Entire cast noticing their movement?
"could"
Never what we were saying!!!
What...? it didn't show "proof of concept," it was just conversation about unimportant physics topics.
Up above you didn't adress this, you acted as if it was a problem only for us. You're the one arguing for the CRT, explain how it's not contradictory in yours but yes in ours.
They weren't whataboutism, they were logical conclusions based on statements. It feels like yours is more whataboutism here, saying that there can't be a larger structure containing multiple timelines
that would make it 2-C
not conceding this at all
It was stated in the daizenshuu too. Also it's not just "IT", it's kaikai and angels' staff, which are shown to be special movement techniques too. Also, keep in mind, the walls contradicts the thing about the super dragon balls being a contradiction too. They get past the "walls" somehow. The most consistent interpretation is that the walls are dimensional walls.
That contradicts your CRT too, as you're saying the universe doesn't have defined boundaries by agreeing with the crt, yet agreeing with this. It's contextually talking about the macrocosm map, talking about "the sphere" as the depiction of the macrocosm in the picture, explaining "this is the macrocosm, everything inside it is x or y..."
Obviously they did, as the HBTC is contained in the macrocosm, which is contained in the timeline, and he erased that.
It'd be dimensional travel regardless, and it makes even more sense considering they only reach the actual contents of the living world.
Straw man argument.
Nah, we're simply showing they're not inherent contradictions, which align with the statements better.
See up above as in the wiki standard I linked, it is in there.
. I hate Dragon Ball.
so then it's not a contradiction....
This is reality about space-time.
This is contradicted by conventional logic. I want you to prove these smaller structures/timelines exists individually. Show any sign of individualism between them.
Two separate spaces sharing the same time would be Low 2-C.
Then you also agree that it is an important point for you side, thus you need to debunk it. Otherwise you concede by default.
The Daizenshuu is kind of worthless, but since it was in the Chouzenshuu also, let's move on.
It's a wall separating the afterlife and the living world.
Poorly defined = ambiguous boundaries
The recent CRTs deemed this impossible and it was determined for the Angels to be Dimensional Travel via Warp so that shit is gone and dead.
It's in-between the macrocosm dimensions, it's unknown if he deleted these as well.
Prove they warp naturally, please.
You separate my point in half and then claim it's strawman.
They are. If they travel physically between universes, they being separate spacetimes falls flat.
They aren't a problem.
This is one thing I will never get about these DB universe CRTs. You have people clearly complacent to or even outright acknowledging the fact that these places are separate spaces regardless of space-time or not, while simultaneously trying to hold arguments about physical travel and whatnot, being literally self contradictory. Physical travel isn't possible between separate spaces.
There's no such need. The distance between two separate spacetimes need not be necessarily infinite nor is that the default assumption.
Please tag where I casted a vote? since I really do not know when I agreed to this CRT
Then stop using the anti feats for the movement stuff, cause you're arguing indirectly against them being anti feats
I'm giving an alternative look to show it's something that people have considered, and my stance on that is that it's not a real anti feat for the cosmology
Not really, it's literally a good piece of evidence that was never discredited
It also traveled to u6 too
a wall is a non-abiguous boundary
He destroyed more than just the macrocosm, his destruction reached other universes. If he's destroying the macrocosm, he's destroying what's between it
The proof is in them moving between the separate dimensions.
Straw man again, not a random guess, as the evidence points us to it
the evidence is them doing so, despite there being walls as is stated by the chozenshuu. That already implies theres something special about them moving, proving it's not out of the question.
Actually, it is, since they're what supposedly keeps them separate. Remember, they aren't just really far away and you could travel to them in a spaceship, they are verbatum inaccessible unless you have special means
Sorry, I'll take you out, I thought you agreed, my mistake
I never argued it was, actually. I do consider the afterlife and the living world separate spaces, never argued for physical travel.
If the Angels themselves are accepted as needing dimensional travel to cross universes, I don't see why assume the SDBS dispersed by the literal reality warping Dragon should automatically be assumed to cross universes through physical travel when we're never shown how they cross universes, just like the Angels' warp technique despite it appearing to fly through the universes. It's the same principle.
I removed you, sorry
Ultimate Gohan physically traveled from Kaioshin realm to the living world in Buu saga
Kibito teleported him. He only flew to the battlefield.
If I remember correctly, Beerus can also do it, but he doesn't because he is lazy and somewhat slower than Whiz
Nope. he's never traveled to the afterlife or kaioshin realm alone, nor is this ever implied.
Without that, there aren't really any anti feats for the cosmology
No, I'm pretty sure Whiz mentions this at some point around the very first few episodes of DBS
prove it, cause you already misremembered one time, and I don't remember that
