Demigra tier revision

[Bluetrekking]

I agree with Ryu and the paths history can take. This is portrayed in the DBH UMX video games when you create different timelines based on actions in another timeline.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

I think I'll agree with Aeyu.

 

[Goku_Blacc]

I agree with Ryu.

 

[Aeyu]

Also, transcending one space-time is not the same as transcending all of them. Different possible universes/timelines could have different laws of physics, if we apply real world logic. Based on the, "infinite paths history CAN take," it sounds more like Demigra could possibly encompass infinite timelines, not that he does or will; this is based off his 2-B rating. I still stand by 2-B, possibly 2-A rating, if any upgrade is to occur. I don't think there's enough evidence for a *solid* 2-A.

 

[Super_Saiyan_God_Julian]

I'm not sure where to go about this. I can at best give Demigra an "At least 2-B" rating but even that is iffy at the moment.

However I can agree on Xenoverse Demigra being "2-B" due to the fact that Toki Toki gave him a huge boost to anything he had previously,stating he was a new god who controlled Space and Time and being comparable to Beerus who could supposedly destroy all of history on his lonesome.


Also i agree with Azathoth and Aeyu that these statements are far to vague to upgrade any of the characters to "2-A".

And "High 2-A" is out of the question unless more solid evidence is brought up.

 

[Bluetrekking]

DB Heroes is too vague and inconsistent to give a solid 2A. Like how Xeno Goku could have one-shot Demigra by going at least SS3 but did not for the sake of plot. Currently in DBH, Demigra would be complete fodder compared to the new villains. The Time patrol was solo'd by a random demon god about 6 times.

 

[Bluetrekking]

So far from this thread I see really mixed opinions. Some say he should stay the same, some say possible 2A and some say outright 2A.

Just a by the way, can someone explain to me what is the "real world" is because I am really confused. It is not part of the Multiverse, it is not a Higher-Dimension, it is a place that interprets the DBH world as fiction, transcends the Multiverse but not a higher dimension. This place is pretty unique.

 

[SSJRyu1]

@Bluetrekking Real world is said to be another dimension in the manga. Also it is said in heroes that you have to "trancend space" and it is outside the DBH "world" which refers to the multiverse of all the endless alternate timelines. Also like you said it treats the events in heroes like fictional stories or games. I persoanlly see it as a higher dimension as that fits all the statements made about it best.

 

[Bluetrekking]

@Bluetrekking Real world is said to be another dimension in the manga. Also it is said in heroes that you have to "trancend space" and it is outside the DBH "world" which refers to the multiverse of all the endless alternate timelines. Also like you said it treats the events in heroes like fictional stories or games. I persoanlly see it as a higher dimension as that fits all the statements made about it best.

True, especially in the manga. I cannot see why not.

 

[Bluetrekking]

And Ryu, what you stated about various possibilities existing is kind of off. Chronoa did not just say that Demigra caused various possibilities, she stated that possibilities that may have existed exist. This means that Demigra created infinite number of timelines.

 

[Kepekley23]

I also agree with Ryu. He seems to have the better arguments so far.

 

[Bluetrekking]

I also agree with Ryu. He seems to have the better arguments so far.

Agreed.

 

[Bluetrekking]

Also, what are your thoughts on this:

Demigra made infinite timelines:

https://imgur.com/a/t135T

This scan translates to: "Various Kinds of infinite posibilities that may have existed overflow."

Demigra turned all infimite possibilities into infinite timelines.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

@SSJRyu

1. That does not remotely translate to that. She just says "the possibilities are overlapping". You did not show a scan that said "infinite possibilities are overlapping" or "all possibilities are overlapping". We cannot infer from the scene something that isn't remotely implied, when the direct line of dialogue basically say that possibilities are now overlapping and that's it.

2. Like I said, to my knowledge. I know nothing about Saint Seiya. Matt would be better to ask on that topic.

3. Again, it doesn't say that. It says "transcended space and went to a different world". You need to realize just how many franchises there are on this site that have statements like this that are meaningless because lack of any context. Especially so here, where the real world is treated simply as another reality alongside the DB multiverse and not a higher-dimensional plane of existence.

4. See above. Transcending the confines of one multiverse to travel to another =/= transcending to a higher-dimensional realm, especially when a being from said other multiverse is on the same playing field as beings from the first multiverse.

5. Again, outside of =/= transcendent. This is how everything here is treated. And, again, you also ignored that the Einsteinian space-time being referred to is the 4-D continuum of our universe. This is why "extradimensional being" and "being with extra dimensions" are vastly, vastly different.

You are essentially asking us to upgrade every Tier 2 character who exists outside of their local multiverse. This is still nothing that points to 2-A, let alone High 2-A. If you want to prove 2-A, you need more clear evidence pointing to infinite timelines. If you want to prove High 2-A, you need evidence that Demigra is 5-D.

"Demigra revives after his apparent destruction, and travels back 75,000,000 years to his first battle with Chronoa"

I more meant "what part of heroes is Demigra stated to be dead before his first appearance?".

 

[SSJRyu1]

Glad you got an exact translation. Yes that is further proof imo of 2A size feat. Thanks for sharing.

 

[Dark649]

I agree again with Azathoth.

 

[Bluetrekking]

@SSJRyu
1. That does not remotely translate to that. She just says "the possibilities are overlapping". You did not show a scan that said "infinite possibilities are overlapping" or "all possibilities are overlapping". We cannot infer from the scene something that isn't remotely implied, when the direct line of dialogue basically say that possibilities are now overlapping and that's it.

2. Like I said, to my knowledge. I know nothing about Saint Seiya. Matt would be better to ask on that topic.

3. Again, it doesn't say that. It says "transcended space and went to a different world". You need to realize just how many franchises there are on this site that have statements like this that are meaningless because lack of any context. Especially so here, where the real world is treated simply as another reality alongside the DB multiverse and not a higher-dimensional plane of existence.

4. See above. Transcending the confines of one multiverse to travel to another =/= transcending to a higher-dimensional realm, especially when a being from said other multiverse is on the same playing field as beings from the first multiverse.

5. Again, outside of =/= transcendent. This is how everything here is treated. And, again, you also ignored that the Einsteinian space-time being referred to is the 4-D continuum of our universe. This is why "extradimensional being" and "being with extra dimensions" are vastly, vastly different.

You are essentially asking us to upgrade every Tier 2 character who exists outside of their local multiverse. This is still nothing that points to 2-A, let alone High 2-A. If you want to prove 2-A, you need more clear evidence pointing to infinite timelines. If you want to prove High 2-A, you need evidence that Demigra is 5-D.

"Demigra revives after his apparent destruction, and travels back 75,000,000 years to his first battle with Chronoa"

I more meant "what part of heroes is Demigra stated to be dead before his first appearance?".

1. Ryu has the direct translation of what Chronoa said. What she actually said is: "Various Kinds of infinite posibilities that may have existed overflow."

This happens after Demigra warped the multiverse and created timelines.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

bby what you doing.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

1. Ryu has the direct translation of what Chronoa said. What she actually said is: "Various Kinds of infinite posibilities that may have existed overflow."

Could be solid. Where's the translation from?

 

[Schnee_One]

Agreed with Azzy.

But is Demigra even 2B?

 

[Bluetrekking]

Kanzenshuu.

 

[Matthew_Schroeder]

I agree with Azzy, by the way.

 

[Super_Saiyan_God_Julian]

We will need a link though so we can evaluate it completely and if it's legit so we can link it to his profile.

 

[Aeyu]

I agree as well. I don't really support an upgrade, though if the Heroes scan is true, his Heroes form might be able to have a 2-B, possibly higher text, since the idea is supported by that game but not necessarily by Xenoverse.

 

[Bluetrekking]

See the problem is I PM'd the guy. I would have to ask him to put it on a public Forum in order to link it. He is here: http://www.kanzenshuu.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=445

He does all the DBH translations.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Well, if anyone else is fluent in Japanese, perhaps we can try to get it translated, in the meantime.

 

[Interxeption]

Got Herms to translate https://twitter.com/Herms98/status/922242510960844800

 

[Golden_Void]

I can already see how the result of that translation is gonna turn out, but I shall watch anyway. :^)

 

[Super_Saiyan_God_Julian]

The very legend itself Hermes huh...very good Interxeption.

Anyways im going to see what Azathoth thinks because im a little confused.

 

[The_Everlasting]

Well, RIP that attempt.

 

[Ryukama]

Getting your upgrade debunked by Hermes himself is almost an honor.

 

[Interxeption]

lol :]

 

[Bluetrekking]

Hermes is a tier 0 DB translator. Hermes >>>>>> every DB translator so I have no problem with it.

 

[Dragonmasterxyz]

And thus it all comes crashing down. Part of me was hoping for it tbh.


For obvious reasons.

 

[Schnee_One]

Hermes is a tier 0 DB translator. Hermes >>>>>> every DB translator so I have no problem with it.

Imma give a Kudos for Bluetrek speaking TRUTH! (Echo voice)

 

[Super_Saiyan_God_Julian]

Hermes' power is so great he can debunk an upgrade thread without even knowing it exists lmao.

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

Can someone more knowledgable about how possibilities affect time explain to me exactly what Chronoa is indicating ?

 

[Super_Saiyan_God_Julian]

I don't exactly know what she is talking about. Her statement is kind of vague.

 

[Bluetrekking]

Can someone more knowledgable about how possibilities affect time explain to me exactly what Chronoa is indicating ?

When Demigra went into his Makyouka form, He warped the Multiverse and made possible timelines into timelines.

 

[The_2nd_Existential_Seed]

Okay... At least we know he can affect the Multiverse.

Remember when everyone was 4-B in Heroes. Now they have almost everyone in 2017's DBH 2-B ... XD