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Control Devil vs The Sun Princess (GRACE)
- Thread starter GodEarh206
- Start date
- Status
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Please read the description of AE Type 2 again if you haven't already. She embodies the concept of control, but she doesn't exist purely as the concept of control. If that was the case, she would have gotten Type 1 instead which is what you're describing.
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I didn't say devils are Type 1. My point is that they aren't living beings in the tradtional sense to warrant for them to have souls. Yall keep saying that we automatically assume they have souls doesn't make any sense. I'm willing to concede in that argument if there is some sort of community discussion where it was agreed that a verse automatically is assumed to have souls.
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If the discussion is on if Priscilla's attack can defeat Makima by damaging her soul, then no, it cant. An attack on Makima’s soul still qualifies as an attack on her. The contract doesn’t discriminate between types of harm. Whether it’s physical or spiritual it’s all treated the same way. The damage is transferred and Makima remains unscathed. Hence why soul manipulation cannot affect her. Her contract’s law ensures that nothing, not even attacks targeting her very essence, can have a lasting effect.
The contract works entirely on perception. If someone directs an attack at Makima with the intent of harming her regardless of the form that attack takes, it will automatically be transferred. The key takeaway is this, the attack does not need to physically reach her. The contract’s effect triggers as long as the action is perceived as an attack on her. The only way to bypass this is by not intending to harm her at all, approaching her with an act of genuine (GENUINE) love, or similar non hostile intent. Simply put, if you mean to hurt Makima, you are at the mercy of her contract.
azontr
Any/All- 42,007
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This is crazy NLF, and most of it is frankly completely made up and never mentioned in the manga. Makima's contract, and frankly contracts in general, are never said to or implied to apply to one's very soul. Nor their "essence", as you may put it.
If Priscilla burns Makima's soul, she will die.
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So souls do exist in Chainsaw man?
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In Chainsaw Man, Devil's are concepts and not human beings, so interpretation on if they would have a soul or not is up for debate. However, I won't be partaking in that lot of this debate.
azontr
Any/All- 42,007
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Law Manipulation, in of itself, has limits. Makima's contract extends to physical attacks and harm that can be classified under the general realm of physical phenomena. The contract has never interacted with anything spiritual, ever, and never will. To claim that it will function on spiritual attacks based purely on this fact, or on its perception mechanics, is an NLF.
Not to mention, Priscilla's blade only cuts or burns what she wants to burn. A random bystander won't be target of Priscilla's hostility, so the Yang Sword won't affect them, continuing to harm Makima regardless, even if she hypothetically could transfer the damage (she can't).
Zabazab
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She believes Pochita can bypass it by eating and erasing her, though.
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the NLF is assuming it can stop any kind of damage even if it isnt mentioned
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actually this might specifically be because the act of eating doesnt technically constitute any hostile intention?
azontr
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Well there's a difference between eating something that's dead, packaged, and cooked than attacking someone and eating them alive.
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It doesn't have to when it's already explicitly stated. An attack on her soul is still perceived as an attack on Makima’s being and since the contract doesn’t discriminate between types of harm, the damage is transferred to a random Japanese citizen. The contract’s law is explicit: it’s based on intent to harm, not the form the attack takes. Whether the attack is physical or spiritual, as long as the intent to harm Makima exists, it’s redirected. The contract doesn’t care about the form the attack takes, it only cares that the attacker’s intent to harm her exists. That intent triggers the contract, transferring the damage to a random Japanese citizen. You’re asking for proof of resistance to spiritual attack in manga, but that’s not necessary because the contract doesn’t require Makima to resist anything directly.
Now this is different,
Yes, the contract wouldn't work if a party who created the contract didn't exist in the first place.
That's not what's happening here simply because that's how law manip works.
azontr
Any/All- 42,007
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Yes, it does. The contracts law evidently applies to physical attacks. This statement:
Is limited to the forms of attacks that are based in physical reality, fundamentally. If there was no disconnect between the types of attack that the contract can transfer, then it would not work the way it does in the story. To suggest that all attacks, disregarding their nature, are transferable so long as they hold the required intent is the definition of an NLF, as you are claiming the contract functionally has no limits if a condition is met.
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To put it in perspective, it's like saying gravity would still affect everyone, even if they were completely unbound from space-time itself (since gravity is essentially the curvature of space-time).
And yes, I am referring to Regulus Corneas.
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I'll respond to these later.
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it depends, if one doesnt view eating someone alive as hostile but a simple act of consumption then it might not detect it
Zabazab
Any/All- 6,603
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Malicious ****** up dogman (superhero)
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How Pochita can do it and how Dennis did it are different. The former erases her from existence while the latter doesn't even count as an attack.
Kellex
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I'm not exactly that interested in this matchup whatsoever, but there is something I wanna say about damage transferal here.
If Makima were to be able to transfer soul damage, then she would've had Soul manipulation somewhere on her profile cause transferring soul damage = soul manip/resistance in a way. Since Makima doesn't seem to have anything like that, she won't be able to transfer soul damage regardless of the intent.
If Makima were to be able to transfer soul damage, then she would've had Soul manipulation somewhere on her profile cause transferring soul damage = soul manip/resistance in a way. Since Makima doesn't seem to have anything like that, she won't be able to transfer soul damage regardless of the intent.
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I think things are conclusive enough, my vote is for Prisca benedict
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That is not how it works for Makima, she regenerates and a random japanese gets involved in an incident involving fire, that's how the damage transferal works
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Proof of her being able to transfer and regenerate from soul damage?
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Never said that, just wanted to point out how her contract works, it is not a direct transfer
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- Thread starter
- #69
ok can anyone tell me the win-con of both sides
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Pris waltz upto her and one shots her with a single swing of her sword
vs
Makima blasts her to pieces so many times she actually dies (would she even do this if it doesnt work the first 10 times??)
Priscilla has damage transferal too but its limited to stuff she owns and people she likes
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- Thread starter
- #71
I think so, because she also spammed "Bang" quite a few times to get Pochita pushed out into space
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actually my bad bangs AP isnt enough to do any real damage to Priscilla
she cant crush her either since that requires prep time w sacrifices ready
her only real option would be BFR but i feel like Priscilla can just block those attacks or even sense them (or even worse cut them with her yang sword)
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- Thread starter
- #73
I think Makima's win-con would be like this, she would look at Priscilla and realize what she has and from there she would use her subordinates to hold Priscilla back, then Makima would temporarily retreat to a place with a certain height, then Makima would use her crushing ability on Priscilla, because Makima knows that she won't be able to kill Priscilla in just one try so maybe Makima will spam more.
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How fast is her damage transfer / healing?
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- Thread starter
- #75
Bump
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- Thread starter
- #76
Bump
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No idea how that would allow her to know that Priscilla's sword can cut her soul. She already knows Pochita super well.
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dude really doesn't understand the context? Makima knowing about Pochita has nothing to do with her being able to discover the contract that was made in Denji and Pochita's "minds"
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Okay. I see it on the profile now. You could have just said that she has Clairvoyance instead of giving a scan with zero context.
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There are 2 big reasons for why Priscilla wins
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