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Broly V.S Jiren

I dunno, but Belmod's statement is clearly vague

Saying that "only a GoD can access that level of power" only confirms that any GoD can fight at that level, but doesn't say anything about their limit being on that level, let's say that they are "At least Toppo level" using only this

The problem is the Supreme Kai statement, but well, we don't know if he is that reliable about the power of a GoD

And we also have the fact that Vegeta's Final Sacrifice technique can hurt people stronger than him
 
I'm doing it right now actuall because 1 it is important to the result of this thread and likely future threads, and 2 because if this is accepted in general now the scaling would get a lot more complicated since this affects every Low 2-C we currently have DBS wise.
 
If I decide to attempt to make SSBKKX20 Goku and Heavily Suppressed Jiren at that level than yes it would be worse as it would back scale to start of Tournament of Power SSB level entities.... and then we'd have a clusterf***... But I'm not doing that. I'll link it here once finished.
 
?

The profile state that Toppo (Is just like a GoD) yet they can't decide on this site whatever the GoDs has a huge gaps between them or they are all around the same level. Vegeat defeat Toppo yet he's still a fodder to Beerus who himself is a GoD who should be comparble to Jiren who Toppo is fodder to.

Either Belmod is talking nonsense or there is HUGE gaps between GoDs. Something this site still can't grasp
 
There is HUGE gaps between GoD if this is accepted. I'm saying that they treat the feat like any two GoD [never said full power] can accomplish... Meaning they are treating it like some baseline level of a GoD... not neccessarily their full power (at least in the anime)... which actually makes far more sense than how we are treating it.
 
inconclusive do to the fact that we really dont know how they compare, besides the fact that they are probably stronger than beerus.
 
It depends on which version we are referring to in this debate :

Base Jiren... I can prove objectively they scale above him at this point in time, at least Gogeta and Broly... But I put SSB Goku and Vegeta in the realm of UIO 3rd Goku from the ToP based on a statement about the Initial Ikari in the Broly Movie about at least being UIO 2nd Level by statements of "have you seen a Saiyan like this" when referring clearly to his power [because context from the movie hints at such when they mention as imilar thing about Broly's ki despite not talking about his appearance and the only Saiyan that can be compared to is Kefla, who is at least UIO 2nd Level] , getting phenomenally stronger since then while fighting Goku prior to SSG, then gaining another massive amp which would put SSB Goku, Vegeta, Frieza, and Full Ikari Broly in the same realm as UIO 3rd in power,

Ultimate Burning Warrior ? Not 100% sure since we don't know the difference between UIO 3rd and MUI Goku.

Also I have severe questions about peole believing Broly isn't on SSB Gogeta's level... I actually vehemently disagree... Watch the end of the fight Post-Soul Punisher. At the end of the Broly Movie he was trading blows with SSB Gogeta Post-Soul Punisher, and Gogta clearly had to get serious and notably use his aura to fight, and even then he still clashed and traded blows until he was implied to have went all-out at once.
 
The 2nd Existential Seed said:
It depends on which version we are referring to in this debate :
Base Jiren... I can prove objectively they scale above him at this point in time, at least Gogeta and Broly... But I put SSB Goku and Vegeta in the realm of UIO 3rd Goku from the ToP based on a statement about the Initial Ikari in the Broly Movie about at least being UIO 2nd Level by statements of "have you seen a Saiyan like this" when referring clearly to his power [because context from the movie hints at such when they mention as imilar thing about Broly's ki despite not talking about his appearance and the only Saiyan that can be compared to is Kefla, who is at least UIO 2nd Level] , getting phenomenally stronger since then while fighting Goku prior to SSG, then gaining another massive amp which would put SSB Goku, Vegeta, Frieza, and Full Ikari Broly in the same realm as UIO 3rd in power,

Ultimate Burning Warrior ? Not 100% sure since we don't know the difference between UIO 3rd and MUI Goku.

Also I have severe questions about peole believing Broly isn't on SSB Gogeta's level... I actually vehemently disagree... Watch the end of the fight Post-Soul Punisher. At the end of the Broly Movie he was trading blows with SSB Gogeta Post-Soul Punisher, and Gogta clearly had to get serious and notably use his aura to fight, and even then he still clashed and traded blows until he was implied to have went all-out at once.
Click to expand...
If it wasn't for Stamina Goku would have defeated Kefla in SSB
 
The 2nd Existential Seed said:
It depends on which version we are referring to in this debate :
Base Jiren... I can prove objectively they scale above him at this point in time, at least Gogeta and Broly... But I put SSB Goku and Vegeta in the realm of UIO 3rd Goku from the ToP based on a statement about the Initial Ikari in the Broly Movie about at least being UIO 2nd Level by statements of "have you seen a Saiyan like this" when referring clearly to his power [because context from the movie hints at such when they mention as imilar thing about Broly's ki despite not talking about his appearance and the only Saiyan that can be compared to is Kefla, who is at least UIO 2nd Level] , getting phenomenally stronger since then while fighting Goku prior to SSG, then gaining another massive amp which would put SSB Goku, Vegeta, Frieza, and Full Ikari Broly in the same realm as UIO 3rd in power,

Ultimate Burning Warrior ? Not 100% sure since we don't know the difference between UIO 3rd and MUI Goku.

Also I have severe questions about peole believing Broly isn't on SSB Gogeta's level... I actually vehemently disagree... Watch the end of the fight Post-Soul Punisher. At the end of the Broly Movie he was trading blows with SSB Gogeta Post-Soul Punisher, and Gogta clearly had to get serious and notably use his aura to fight, and even then he still clashed and traded blows until he was implied to have went all-out at once.
Click to expand...
SSB Gogeta, even before powering up, was still dominating brolys final power, even shown casually evading his ki attacks, and there were no blows to trade, as gogeta didnt even give broly time to breath. after landing a punch that hindered broly, he powered up again to dominate in a one sided fight. plus the novel just outright states that he let out a hint of his full power. so the novel at least clarifies that.


the scalinfg is more like ssb gogeta (after showing aura) > ssb gogeta (before showing aura) > broly
 
BTW. the reason this fight is a debate is because people working on DB just dont seem to give a **** about conscistency in statements. before the movie happens, statements everywhere about broly being above hakaishin power, being the strongest foe ever, ect. the day the movie comes, the only statement about his power is just "your probably stronger than beerus", nothing more. albeit, being stronger than beerus is an achievement on it self, the previous saga tackled that already. so we are stuck confused on wether broly really surpasses jiren or not.
 
Ovrhide said:
BTW. the reason this fight is a debate is because people working on DB just dont seem to give a **** about conscistency in statements. before the movie happens, statements everywhere about broly being above hakaishin power, being the strongest foe ever, ect. the day the movie comes, the only statement about his power is just "your probably stronger than beerus", nothing more. albeit, being stronger than beerus is an achievement on it self, the previous saga tackled that already. so we are stuck confused on wether broly really surpasses jiren or not.
Click to expand...
That depends as Broly got stronger so fast he surpased Goku and Vegeta's years of training in a single fight so if Jiren doesn't go all out from the start Broly can win. And isn't Ultra Instinct is better multiplyer than fusion for e.g. in heroes Cumber was able to fight and hold his own against both SSB x10 Kaioken Vegito and SSJ4 Vegito but lost to Ultra Instinct Goku
 
Jiren is above infinite zamasu who was literally a universe, he was also above every god. I don't see how Broly can possibly win here.

But to show you here, no character (with the same power as they had) from the ToP arc who fought jiren is in the broly movie.

So there is no one to scale to, so, if you don't agree with my point it's inconclusive.
 
Jiren's got more hype and better feats. Goku said Broly is maybe stronger than Beerus. While Jiren was pushing Goku to his limits and had to master a form that even GoDs struggle with to beat him.
 
UsernameMan12 said:
Jiren's got more hype and better feats. Goku said Broly is maybe stronger than Beerus. While Jiren was pushing Goku to his limits and had to master a form that even GoDs struggle with to beat him.
Click to expand...
Really? Did you miss the last year by any chance? I can bring you like 5-6 sources that support Broly being the strongest guy ever. Although in the end they all are Promo stuff.

We should talk within the show.
 
ZERO7772 said:
This "Jiren > every god" meme needs to die already.
Click to expand...
Jiren is above every god... Every god was like nani tf when goku went ui, thrn Jiren is above that. So what's your point here?
 
If I am correct UI2 was said to be stronger than Beerus and Jiren was able to hold his own against that not sure how is broly going to win. Although if the fight is long enough he may surpass him.
 
GojiBoyForever said:
Being shocked at something=\=Being weaker
Click to expand...
This wiki uses this feat: Jiren > infinitezamasu because he was stated to be the strongest adversary they've ever faced. This should alao pit him above beerus as beerus has no feats to prove otherwise.

Yes, I know that wouldn't mean he's stronger than every god, but he was also repeatedly stated as "the mortal beyond the gods" etc
 
This wiki uses this feat: Jiren > infinitezamasu because he was stated to be the strongest adversary they've ever faced. This should alao pit him above beerus as beerus has no feats to prove otherwise.

Dude by that logic Jiren would be stronger than Whis.
 
Jiren doesn't exactly have any crazy feaths either if we come down to it. He had to fight seriouly to to put down: SSBKKx20 Goku, SSBE Vegeta and #17

All of those guys are weaker than SSJ Gogeta put togethere.

Most promo stuff says that UI Goku is "probably" stronger than Beerus, and Jiren got stomped by UI Goku before he power up so Jiren would be weaker than Beerus by that logic.
 
Excuse me what....?? How???

Being the strongest saying that Jiren is the strongest person they've faced shouldn't include Beerus. According to you that statement makes him stronger than Beerus so logically it should include Whis since Jiren is the strongest amirite.
 
This confuses me. Because supressed jiren > God of destruction canidate toppo. Which is equal to a god of destruction. And broly ssj I think was stated to be "Maybe stronger than beerus" So wouldn't powered up jiren > SSJ Broly
 
Zamasu Chan said:
Being the strongest saying that Jiren is the strongest person they've faced shouldn't include Beerus. According to you that statement makes him stronger than Beerus so logically it should include Whis since Jiren is the strongest amirite.
Click to expand...
I was talking about how beerus is weaker than zamasu...
 
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