Blue Lock Discussion Thread

[Dinozxd]

eh? Loki later in that feat just runs basically, if we even take the anime feat I believe Rin and the others were in slow motion compared to him iirc

The feat Vzearr calced is all about his explosive accelaration, not his running speed. Also, he does stop after taking a few steps more then uses his explosive accelaration again to blitz dudes.

 

[Zefra3011]

yeah, then he can just dash here and there and score at least some goals extremely easily which simply doesn't happen.

Not only that but if consider that feat subsonic we have to consider every single apparently subsonic instance like this to be also subsonic which mean basically everyone is subsonic in the verse and uh... no thanks, it will break the entire IQ battles within the characters, if they are genuinely made to have superhuman speeds they would focus on train that more that they skills and field vision.

Also i want to ask the narrative need of having them at subsonic speed when most of the time they are portrayed to be normal humans.

 

[Dinozxd]

by using the point of a friend if Loki was geniuely subsonic compared to other characters, and yes, his speed is presented to be above everyone else in the verse, he could just speed blitz everyone and score easy goals from the start of the match by just dashing here and there, even if you account for stamina even he should be able to score 2-3 goals this way which is something OP given in every match he will make the team start with an enormous advantage.

He pretty much does exactly that in this arc lmao

 

[Vzearr]

Also i want to ask the narrative need of having them at subsonic speed when most of the time they are portrayed to be normal humans.

Give an example.

Not only that but if consider that feat subsonic we have to consider every single apparently subsonic instance like this to be also subsonic which mean basically everyone is subsonic in the verse

Those are more then likely effects, to be considered subsonic via after images you'd need evidence they aren't just effects.

uh... no thanks, it will break the entire IQ battles within the characters, if they are genuinely made to have superhuman speeds they would focus on train that more that they skills and field vision

Non-point.

 

[Vzearr]

yeah, then he can just dash here and there and score at least some goals extremely easily which simply doesn't happen.

Plot induced stupidity is a thing.

 

[Zefra3011]

Give an example.

them running at normal speed and not spamming those "subsonic dashes"?

Those are more then likely effects, to be considered subsonic via after images you'd need evidence they aren't just effects.

I wasn't talking about the after images, I was talking about them moving those short distances while other characters are presented to be frozen, like here:

or when Kuon blitzed everyone on the field in the early serie

Non-point.

it actually is, speed blitzing each others is a way better method than just intensely drain your stamina with meta vision and those things

 

[Zefra3011]

Plot induced stupidity is a thing.

why it has to be the PSI and not those feats being an exaggeration making them outliers? I'll ask again the narrative need to have them moving at those speeds

 

[Vzearr]

them running at normal speed and not spamming those "subsonic dashes"?

You can't be serious? "Sanji can't be ftl otherwise he'd spam his dashes and run across the world in seconds".

I wasn't talking about the after images, I was talking about them moving those short distances while other characters are presented to be frozen, like here:

This doesn't mean anything. Its just a reaction blitz, this feat would scale from peak human to low superhuman at max.

why it has to be the PSI and not those feats being an exaggeration making them outliers? I'll ask again the narrative need to have them moving at those speeds

You would need to prove why its an outlier.

 

[Zefra3011]

You can't be serious? "Sanji can't be ftl otherwise he'd spam his dashes and run across the world in seconds".

not interested in One Piece my apologize, I can just say "yeah he isn't FTL then", also you are comparing a legit superhuman verse with a peak human/maybe slightly superhuman verse.

This doesn't mean anything. Its just a reaction blitz, this feat would scale from peak human to low superhuman at max.

the problem is exactly being able to constantly blitzing each others, exactly.

You would need to prove why its an outlier.

you don't have to prove it is PSI? and you keep ignoring the question about the narrative need of them being that fast

 

[XxZetsuxX]

Zefra makes more sense to me ngl

 

[Vzearr]

not interested in One Piece my apologize, I can just say "yeah he isn't FTL then", also you are comparing a legit superhuman verse with a peak human/maybe slightly superhuman verse.

Nothing about blue lock is human like.

you don't have to prove it is PSI?

You're the one making a claim, prove it.

you keep ignoring the question about the narrative need of them being that fast

I haven't ignored it. If you actually read our messages you would realise it stems into the "plot induced stupidity" argument.

 

[Zefra3011]

you did claim it's PSI right? or it wasn't a claim?

 

[Zefra3011]

Nothing about blue lock is human like.

actually, even looking at your calcs they are all around street and below so... yeah, only intelligence is fairly superhuman imo.

 

[Vzearr]

you did claim it's PSI right? or it wasn't a claim?

You made a claim first, prove it.

actually, even looking at your calcs they are all around street and below so... yeah, only intelligence is fairly superhuman imo.

We've only calced a few feats.

 

[Dinozxd]

Damn still having this discussion?

The PIS argument makes more sense to me tbh.

 

[Zefra3011]

You made a claim first, prove it.

tbh I think I answered when I explained how OP Loki would be if he was genuinely at that speed even only with dashes or if the characters could reaction blitz each others casually like they "do".

 

[Dinozxd]

tbh I think I answered when I explained how OP Loki would be if he was genuinely at that speed even only with dashes or if the characters could reaction blitz each others casually like they "do".

Idk why you're acting like Loki isn't regarded as one of the best players in Blue Lock's universe. He's by far the fastest character in the series and could blitz the whole Blue Lock squad with ease.

The man is already OP. I don't get why an OP character having OP speed and abilities is a problem here.

 

[Zefra3011]

he should be straight up top 1 which he isn't, that's the point, we know he is top 5, and the others don't have his level of speed, if he can blitz them he shouldn't just be top 5, like, even being able to potentially blitz an entire squad would break everything since with Loki in team it means you instant win.

not only that but right before performing the feat he talks about how the opponents are "full of opening" which should be completely irrelevant when by sheer speed he can just does as he please, keep in mind that even a peak human in speed can give hard time to an Athletic human, you don't need to be that absurdly fast

 

[Dinozxd]

he should be straight up top 1 which he isn't, that's the point, we know he is top 5, and the others don't have his level of speed, if he can blitz them he shouldn't just be top 5, like, even being able to potentially blitz an entire squad would break everything since with Loki in team it means you instant win.

People can still read his route and block all his possible routes and stuff. Blue Lock characters have enough iq to do that.

not only that but right before performing the feat he talks about how the opponents are "full of opening" which should be completely irrelevant when by sheer speed he can just does as he please,

The dude can't just phase through his opponents cuz he has good speed. He has to find a good spot to blitz dudes or else he'll just violently crash into ppl lmao. It's not like

He already mostly does as he pleases? Rin intercepts his route right after he blitzes Isagi and the dude just says "I'm fast" and blitzes him.


I agree that the feat doesn't scale to 66 m/s (idk why Vzearr included that end as the timeframe seems to be rejected sitewide for now). Isagi obviously couldn't react to Loki so maybe using 0.1 or 0.08 seconds makes sense. Either of these timeframes make the feat land at relatively close to baseline Subsonic and they are the only ones that make sense.

 

[Zefra3011]

People can still read his route and block all his possible routes and stuff. Blue Lock characters have enough iq to do that.

all that work and he can just dash the other way without any problem

He already mostly does as he pleases? Rin intercepts his route right after he blitzes Isagi and the dude just says "I'm fast" and blitzes him.

you basically contradicted your point above

I agree that the feat doesn't scale to 66 m/s (idk why Vzearr included that end as the timeframe seems to be rejected sitewide for now). Isagi obviously couldn't react to Loki so maybe using 0.1 or 0.08 seconds makes sense. Either of these timeframes make the feat land at relatively close to baseline Subsonic and they are the only ones that make sense.

any reason for Isagi to have those reactions speeds?

 

[Dinozxd]

all that work and he can just dash the other way without any problem

Other way being away from their goal so...

you basically contradicted your point above

Rin is just one guy. Loki is regarded as a threat to every team and was stated to be top 5 in the world of football at just 17 and you think teams will just have 1 guy mark him?

any reason for Isagi to have those reactions speeds?

Well he's not regarded as a really good dude in physicality so Athletic Human reactions might be better I guess?

 

[Zefra3011]

Other way being away from their goal so...

Rin is just one guy. Loki is regarded as a threat to every team and was stated to be top 5 in the world of football at just 17 and you think teams will just have 1 guy mark him?

imo all you said only works if you can't actually blitz the opponent, if they are coming in 5 you just need enough space to move your body between them and if there isn't just dash on the side and another dash to surpass them, we are talking about someone who can do few meters without you not noticing him (at least that's how you present him) he would win every single match

Well he's not regarded as a really good dude in physicality so Athletic Human reactions might be better I guess?

to me Loki speed works as long as it's not way above 12,4444 m/s (peak human running speed), and honestly, if someone who is in front of me instantly dashes at 12,4444 m/s beside me I wouldn't instantly react for sure lol, something like 20 m/s would be already too much imo, especially given they weren't exactly prepared to counter that, that feat can be many things and not only sheer speed, a matter of having openings, the opponent not being prepared, the opponent not being able to read it and of course a bit of speed instead of "yeah Loki can disappear from his opponent's sights making him unbeatable"

 

[Dinozxd]

imo all you said only works if you can't actually blitz the opponent, if they are coming in 5 you just need enough space to move your body between them

And a space like that is what he means by "weak spots".

just dash on the side and another dash to surpass them,

There are 10 players (minusing the goalkeeper obv) in the field you know? multiple dudes can just intercept his possible routes which would force Loki to pass the ball.

to me Loki speed works as long as it's not way above 12,4444 m/s (peak human running speed),

Comparing a short distance dash (which was around 3 meters) and a 100 meter race is weird.

and honestly, if someone who is in front of me instantly dashes at 12,4444 m/s beside me I wouldn't instantly react for sure lol,

....

something like 20 m/s would be already too much imo,

...........

especially given they weren't exactly prepared to counter that,

Isagi was directly looking at him and was tryna read him. I don't see how he would be caught off guard in a scene like this.

that feat can be many things and not only sheer speed a matter of having opening, the opponent not being prepared, the opponent not being able to read it and of course a bit of speed

It's not like Isagi's vision shifted somewhere away from Loki... He was actively waiting Loki to move. There is no reason for Isagi to shift his focus into something else.

"yeah Loki can disappear from his opponent's sights making him unbeatable"

You pretty much defined Loki's playstyle.

 

[Vzearr]

Me waiting for Blue Lock calcs to get evaluated:

 

[Zefra3011]

Me waiting for Blue Lock calcs to get evaluated:

ever thought about using Kaiser Impact for subsonic? doesn't even need calcs prob

 

[Vzearr]

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Vzearr/Meguru_Bachira_profile_draft

 

[Vzearr]

This feat is actually insane. Tbf the whole video has insane feats. Too bad most of them are probably outliers.

 

[Dinozxd]

These calcs got accepted. They should scale most of the verse to Street Level while only some characters should scale to Superhuman speed and Peak Human LS.

 

[Vzearr]

These calcs got accepted. They should scale most of the verse to Street Level while only some characters should scale to Superhuman speed and Peak Human LS.

Nice work!! The verse page is probably ready to be posted with some small tweaks, unless people have objections.

 

[XxZetsuxX]

Still trying to figure out how you will do VS matches with them

 

[Vzearr]

Still trying to figure out how you will do VS matches with them

Has this not been explained to you?

 

[XxZetsuxX]

Has this not been explained to you?

If you did, I probably forgot lol

Explain pls

 

[Vzearr]

Characters like Bachira and Shido can perform acrobatic kicks so at least some of the verse can actually fight. Besides, a character on the website doesn't need to know martial arts to participate in vs threads.

This and there are multiple other characters that fight, read the manga.

 

[XxZetsuxX]

This and there are multiple other characters that fight, read the manga.

I see, Thanks for telling me

Btw, What i meant with martial arts is that, Anyone with martial arts be it weaker or stronger than them will absolutely demolish them

The anime is focused on football afterall, I'm not saying they can't be on the wiki because of them not having it

 

[Vzearr]

I see, Thanks for telling me

Btw, What i meant with martial arts is that, Anyone with martial arts be it weaker or stronger than them will absolutely demolish them

The anime is focused on football afterall, I'm not saying they can't be on the wiki because of them not having it

Alot of characters have good abilities, I wouldn't be too sure about that.

 

[XxZetsuxX]

Alot of characters have good abilities, I wouldn't be too sure about that.

I mean, Their abilities are for football, I just can't see how they will use it in a fight

I don't see meta-vision being useful at all in a fight (Unless you can prove me wrong)

 

[XxZetsuxX]

However, The Wiki might allow football matches with other characters XD

 

[Vzearr]

I mean, Their abilities are for football, I just can't see how they will use it in a fight

I don't see meta-vision being useful at all in a fight (Unless you can prove me wrong)

Analytical prediction, Power mimicry, Social influencing. All can be applied to fights. Also, don't get me wrong, characters like Ryusei can fight, and relatively well.

 

[XxZetsuxX]

Analytical prediction

The meta vision is mainly based on predicting where the ball is going to end up no?

Power mimicry

This is for football, You need to prove Isagi (Or any other characters with this) can do it for fights too

Social influencing.

I can see this working depending on the scenario

All can be applied to fights.

A character who shows abilities mainly for football needs to show he can do it for other things like fighting

Also, don't get me wrong, characters like Ryusei can fight, and relatively well.

I see

 

[Vzearr]

The meta vision is mainly based on predicting where the ball is going to end up no?

Its based on how the game is going to end up, Isagi can perfectly predict all characters moves for an extended period of time, acting like this wouldn't apply to anything else is baseless.